Masks

[SMJYellow]

I know the jury is out on the wearing of masks for the public in public/indoor environments.

In the news, there's talk about asymptomatic spread. Also I read that the virus spreads in the usual way via droplets from coughs and sneezes. I also read it can be spread by breath and just my talking. I mean, that's fairly scary. Can colds spread like that.

I know we had issues of PPE for the healthcare professionals. I don't see any harm in fabric/cloth/reusable masks, especially masks with a filter pocket.

I reckon it's only a matter of time before the government will recommend the wearing of cloth masks for the public when in indoor public environments.

(a little of topic - I bought some fabric masks from sewers on etsy for the family and my mother turned her nose up at them. She wants the surgical masks. If you're lucky to find them, there's price gouging going on. I'm slightly upset about that. I meant well and she snubbed me. The masks I bought aren't good enough for her. I will be using them myself).

Don’t wait for the government, masks4all campaign has been running for weeks.

My 79 year old mother got out her sweing machine and made me 12 masks, a selection of colours to match outfits and a selection of cartoon characters so kids at school wouldn't be scared.

Masks (other than the full FFP3 as used in full PPE) protect others more than the wearer but I think there is enough evidence to show it is worth wearing them
Your mother is ungrateful and ill-informed. Basic surgical masks give very little protection and we are asked not to buy them as it could reduce supplies for healthcare workers. Fabric reusable ones are a better idea

I read they make things worse..trapping germs in wet, moist conditions..yuck

Every other country that is bringing it under control is using masks.
The gov lied to stsrt with as they didnt have any for staff.
Look at photos of nurses in spanish flu even then they had cloth masks on

The campaign against face masks/coverings will go down as one of the most baffling and self-destructive aspects of this whole pandemic.

I've made several now, trying to get used to going out with one on, would be a lot easier if more people were doing it!

(I don't mean going out everywhere, just supermarket and the like)

The campaign against face masks/coverings will go down as one of the most baffling and self-destructive aspects of this whole pandemic.

Someone needs to write an "And The Band Played On" about the whole sorry mess.

Lack of preparedness.
Lack of closing down flights.
Turning the whole thing into a political football.
WHO and its multiple cockups.
China lying.
UK and US being bloody stupid.
Mixed messaging on "It's the flu" and immunity.
Locking healthy and sick people up together in households and letting them breathe all over each other.
Modeling based on flu pandemic predictions.
And the bizarre messaging on masks, which has now resulted in masks becoming another facet of the culture war in the US.

Let's hope we get our pandemic response sorted out in time for bird flu. Because the next bird flu could be very dangerous for children. Be afraid.

If they're triple layered and made of cotton then they're bloody close to the n95 masks that medical staff wear, however your mother also needs educating about viral load and how if she doesn't hang around somewhere too long, then the viral load won't be as high as it would be if she was just lollygagging.

I've just been sent a pattern to make masks and was going to make some for me and DC. Does anyone know what should be used for the filter? Or do they not need a filter? There is so much conflicting stuff that ive confused myself
Thanks

I don't know how useful it is but when I looked into it a lot of mask makers said you could just use a piece of kitchen roll - there was talk of some kind of hoover bag but I don't have those.

USA is using masks. Since 8 April. Is the outbreak under control there?

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/304397?fbclid=IwAR0sckyLgKAsW7VNQ5c3mGWvO3Nl3QeQw4SSJProGIM6vu6VxM1jyAYUqhU

@Dowser
I read they make things worse..trapping germs in wet, moist conditions..yuck

Well you’ve taken on board the message that was circulated to prevent a worsening of the PPE shortage but this was a huge mistake since face coverings have been shown to make an impact in reducing the spread of covid/disease in general. Have a look at the data from countries who already do this and the numbers speak for themselves.

You should have numerous masks that are cleaned and rotated at least daily for personal general use. It’s highly unlikely people will use them to the same standard as a hospital setting but then the general population are not washing their hands to the same standards as a clinical setting either. Something is still better than nothing.

The best analogy I’ve seen is this: if we’re both naked and I piss on you you’ll get soaked, if you’re wearing clothes you’ll get wet but not as much. If we’re both wearing clothes I’ll just get my own clothes wet.

We can’t all walk round in ET style contamination suits (I mean you can but it’s not practical on a large scale) but there are small measures that make a decent impact in reducing spread. That’s what we’re aiming for and the knee-jerk message circulated to protect PPE supplies has been very damaging imho and our government and the WHO should be working much harder to reverse that. It needs them to say that they were wrong though so I won’t be holding my breath.

USA is using masks. Since 8 April. Is the outbreak under control there?

Which states are you referring to? The USA is not a small enough country to take as a collective example.

New York’s numbers and measures aren’t the same as Utah’s and both are under the control of their own state governors policies.

The science does seem somewhat contradictory. And obviously there are lots of factors involved - age of population, how stats are measured, how many people fly into the country, health of the population, how the virus is spreading, other measures in place...

But there does seem more science pointing in favour of us wearing them (or at least some form of face covering) at least in shops or on public transport:

So maybe Bo-Jo will ask people to do so tonight:

@Cornettoninja

Try California & New Jersey. Is the outbreak under control in those states? You can go down to county level if you like, even.

Ok so looking at NJ they locked down on the 21st March and mandatory face masks in certain public places was 10th April. It’s hard to tell the impact of face mask measures since much like the U.K. they were already dealing with a large infected population and the focus now is maintaining a level of control once lockdown is lifted.

Globally this pandemic has been dealt with in a very reactionary way so it is hard to tell what preventative measures have a decent impact although countries that have a cultural acceptance of face masks do appear to have better control of their numbers. That’s too simplistic though since there will be many other factors to pick apart in the aftermath.

My point was that the USA can’t be used as a homogenous example since they’re governed at state level and they are all implementing different policies and are at various levels of infection. Continuing with focus on NJ there is no evidence to say face masks don’t make a difference since they already had a widespread infection and of course face masks don’t make much of difference retrospectively. What will matter is their rates going forward that can be compared to pre-lockdown infections that manifested later on.

Thing is this is all guesswork and even with hindsight no one will be able to say what infection rates would have looked like with or without the use of certain strategies. As far as intrusiveness and costs go face masks/coverings are a low cost non-intrusive measure that doesn’t hurt to to try.

Supermarkets and bus/trains could put posters up and ask people to respectfully consider wearing masks.

I feel it is the one smallest cheapest measure we could make is to make and or wear face coverings at least in places where it is not easy to keep distance like commuting and shopping.

Thanks @Whitestick . I have hoover bags so can sacrifice one of those. The pattern have said to use air conditioning filters. But it is an american site. Money is v. Tight so I'd rather not buy things I dont need.

I've bought some fabric masks from notonthehighstreet. I also have some disposable masks and some reusable ones. I've bought for my parents too.

I'd rather have them and not need them than not have them and need them.

@PorpentiaScamander apparently some hoover bags have asbestos in them so double check before using the ones you have at home....