I don’t understand

[Slazengerbag]

The rumours are flying around about lockdown being eased on Monday, schools back in June and so on. If this happens what was the point of the lockdown to start with? I know it was to protect the NHS, but are we not going to be back in the same position we were in 8 weeks ago? I know we have more ventilators and the nightingale hospitals but is that all we needed to lift lockdown?

I understand lockdown can’t go on for the sake of the economy but is it not too soon with the amount of people still dying and contracting the virus?

Lockdown wasn't just about temporarily easing pressure on the NHS, it was and is about getting to a position where the scientific advisors say we have a hope of keeping R below one in the medium term. There could be quite a gap between the time when a largely diverted NHS becomes underwhelmed, and getting to that point. That means R far enough below one to have headroom for re opening on a gradual basis, and case numbers down also. It means too that testing, tracing, PPE etc should all be in place. I am not sure how they are doing on that last part.

If they are easing things from Monday hopefully it is a sign things are going well.

I think all these highly respected experts who are working their arses off on finding a vaccine would benefit from coming on here to be told there will never be a successful one. I'm sure they'd appreciate being able to go home and put their feet up and have a nice cup of tea rather than wasting their time.

There will most likely be a vaccine. All the evidence points to the fact there will. The one the Oxford team have been working has already proven effective in animal trials and is being tested in humans.
It won't save everyone and it might not appear as quickly as some would like but the odds are very in our favour.

Well they need to let nhs staff speak honestly about how prepared they are. Covering up with 'we are well prepared' as the gov said at the start was so obviously bull.
It is basically letting the gov do their own performance review.

I just don't understand how this track and trace thing will ever work. It could have worked if we'd started it in January but we're so far gone now. The virus has spread to every corner of the country, no one wants to be monitored via their mobile phones, many people are asymptomatic so will never be "tracked" and we're getting nowhere near the testing capacity to check who actually has it and who doesn't. How will this ever work?

The lockdown wasn't imposed purely to protect the NHS, I wish people would stop saying that. The slogan is 'stay home. Protect the NHS. Save lives'. The NHS have not been able to save 30,000 lives. Whether they are overwhelmed or not, they cannot save everyone. The lockdown was to try and stop the spread so limiting the amount of people becoming infected, the amount of people needing hospital treatment and ultimately to stop people from dying who are unlikely to be saved.

The NHS isn't overwhelmed so people are saying lift the lockdown, we have empty hospitals created for this pandemic that are not being used etc. People are still dying though. Why? Because coronavirus is deadly to certain people and also to just totally random people with no health issues as well. The NHS will not save these people. It doesn't matter how many ventilators or beds they have, some people just will not survive the virus and that's apparent. The only way to keep those people alive is to stop them catching it. But how do you do that? When 10% of the deaths are to people with no underlying health issues so they will not be shielding and not know they might not survive it? It's a bit like playing roulette. Our government don't really care if we lose a loved one or our own lives. It's just a number to them. A number they would rather not have in their statistics, granted, but a number all the same. They want the figures down but they aren't looking to save everyone. They want to look good, like they handled it but they aren't looking to save everyone.

Our economy is going to come first now so we'll accelerate through guidelines being lifted and amended. The press will stop reporting on the death rate so much so we can stop thinking about it and soon the people in this country that die of it in the months to come will be just like those starving people in Africa that most of us don't really give a fuck about either and manage to play ignorant to.

That's what we have coming but we are a selfish nation. "I miss my parents", "I'm not coping looking after my own kids all day", "We can't afford to pay for all this so we need to get everyone back to work and let some people take the sacrifice for us". Mumsnet is especially eye opening to the self centered and also to the amount of people that have not bothered to follow the guidelines either.

Morally we should all be doing what we possibly can to protect those that will die instead of foaming at the mouth waiting for Boris to unground us so we can flee the house and do whatever. I will do what I can for as long as I can to not be part of the spread but I think I will be in the minority. Of course I won't be staying inside my house for months but I won't be running off to see visitors the moment Boris says I can or stampeding any new shop that opens! No one should but it sounds like once this lockdown is lifted, it's going to be chaos

They need to be straight as it makes a difference to people's choices re sending kids back in.
Tbh im not convinced the gov is capable of tracking and tracing and keeping it below 1.

^ this

Well said YappityYapYap, completely agree.

@YappityYapYap
You’ve put into words exactly how I feel about the whole situation.
Thanks

YappityYapYap - you've hit the nail on the head.
Anyone seen the queue for B&Q??? That's what it will be like everywhere every time somewhere reopens. People will get slack on social distancing and actually few will give a fuck until it's their loved one suffocating slowly to death.

Why do people say with such assurance that we need to get it, to gain immunity?

Many virus's there is no immunity. We have absolutely no idea whether we will get immunity or if so how long it lasts.

yap how do you rationalise the fact that the flu also kills seemingly healthy people every year? Young people with no underlying health conditions?

JellyBelly78 "Wish people would stop going in about herd immunity! It’s already been recognised as being a stupid strategy that will result in thousands of deaths" it's a vital part of the plan and always has been for every contagious disease. I don't care what they told you on youtube. Look it up properly so you know what the term means.

I will do what I can for as long as I can to not be part of the spread but I think I will be in the minority.

I strongly disagree with your post, sorry.

A minority won't care and will do too much/get too close to people. There are always thoughtless people around.

But many many people are scared of this virus. They have something to lose if it gets out of control. Why have people complied with lockdown? Certainly not because the army has been patrolling the streets forcing them to. Most people haven't wanted to risk dying or they care about someone vulnerable and haven't want them to die.

It goes very strongly against what's natural to socially distance so it's fair enough people are struggling badly. In reality I think when restrictions ease many people will want to mix more but there will come a point where certain things are judged as too risky so they just won't do them. I want to sit outside with a small handful of friends or go and have a coffee at a cafe with outdoor friends. I have no desire to be in a shopping centre or on a plane. I'm at low risk of dying if I get the virus but I'd still rather not get it because i dislike feeling ill.

It is not self-centred to want to ease restrictions and avoid the potentislly catastrophic economic repercussions that will follow from a longer lockdown. Larger numbers of people will die the longer this goes on too. Those numbers have the potential to dwarf the virus deaths bearing in mind it is largely a virus which targets those at the end of their lives.

At a cafe with outdoor *tables, sorry

@YappityYapYap how will that address the economic issues?

@savehalloween there is a vaccine for it and 30,000 people don't die every 8 weeks of flu either in the UK

@underneaththeash how is not going to your parents house to visit the moment you are allowed and overloading newly reopened shops going to affect the economy? All I'm saying is, this anticipation for relaxation shouldn't be a free for all. If you CAN still do what you can to stop the spread, DO IT. There is probably a number of things everyone could do but they will choose not to because that's not the attitude here in the UK, in England especially. People want their kids back in school in a week for christ sake. If they are that desperate to put their own children back into the firing line, do you really think they're going to care about strangers? So does that progress to them having symptoms but feeling 'entitled' to carry on shopping and going out because they've been locked up for 7 weeks and they are now 'free'

The rumours are flying around about lockdown being eased on Monday, schools back in June and so on

You said it yourself.
It's all rumours.
People speculating, passing off as fact... just take it one day at a time as no-one knows anything yet.
I really can't see schools going back in June, it'd seem pointless only being there for a few weeks and then breaking up for summer holidays.
Creating more risk only to break up in a few weeks anyway
I think it's going to be more of a gradual ease like some businesses starting up again first.

No one is advocating “putting their own children in the firing line”, anymore than letting them catch chicken pox or putting them in a car or letting them play dangerous sports. The risk to children (with exceptions obviously for those with conditions like an organ transplant or cancer) is absolutely tiny. Even allowing for this mysterious syndrome that has been identified. By all means keep your children at home if that’s what you think best for your family, but let’s not imply those of us more concerned with the detriment to their mental health, development and education are doing something irresponsibly risky to their physical health by wanting them back at school. You can potentially argue it’s risky to the school staff (although I disagree) or other people in wider society, but I’ve yet to see evidence it’s particularly risky to them.

And no, my desire for my children to have a quasi normal childhood for the couple of years at least it will take to have a widely available vaccine, with friends, school, playgrounds etc does not somehow mean that if I’d actually got symptoms I’d go shopping just because I’m “free”.

I don't think a lot of the public are capable of keeping it below R1!

LemondareAndDaisyChains

Completely agree. We’ll know soon enough. Opinion polls show vast majority in favour of caution and I believe that will be government policy too.

The gov need to communicate which it is Herd
Or keeping below 1 for track and trace.
The Govt have made this perfectly clear. They tell us in every daily briefing that we have to get the R down and maintain it below 0. They tell us why. They talk about the track and trace app being tested and how it will work. They couldn't be any clearer.

The gov need to communicate which it is Herd
Or keeping below 1 for track and trace.

The chief scientific adviser himself has publicly said "herd immunity" as a policy was a mistake.

@YappityYapYap

"The lockdown was to try and stop the spread so limiting the amount of people becoming infected, the amount of people needing hospital treatment and ultimately to stop people from dying who are unlikely to be saved."

"Our government don't really care if we lose a loved one or our own lives. It's just a number to them."
Right, so, on the one hand you say the govt imposed the lockdown "ultimately to stop people from dying" and on the other hand you state "Our government don't really care if we lose a loved one or our own lives".

If the Govt didn't care about the population dying then they could just let us all die at home to save the NHS from being overwhelmed.

As an aside I would be interested to know whether people with Covid-19 who dial 111 are now being hospitalised at an earlier stage than they were.

Do sufferers still have to be gasping for breath and turning blue as was reported anecdotally on the Lungs threads on MN?

Are people even bothering to dial 111 as a result of hearing the anecdotes?

Are sufferers just dying at home or dialling 999 and being hospitalised?