Fat people even more likely to be affected by COVID than previously thought

[pocketem]

UK government scientists are urgently investigating whether people living with obesity may be disproportionately affected by the coronavirus, after emerging data from intensive care units suggested a stronger link than previously thought.

New data from the UK’s Intensive Care National Audit and Research Centre, which has been presented to ministers and SAGE scientists, has found that the proportion of severely obese patients in ICUs is twice the proportion in the general population.

Ministers have become increasingly alarmed by data coming out of Britain’s intensive care units, with some members of the government suggesting obesity may end up being a factor in the UK’s higher death toll.

The UK is currently projected to have the highest number of coronavirus deaths in Europe. Around 1 in 4 UK adults are obese. In 2018, the WHO found that the UK had the third highest obesity rate in Europe, behind only Malta and Turkey.

More here:
www.buzzfeed.com/amphtml/alexwickham/uk-scientists-coronavirus-obesity-link

Having a breakfast at 8 am full of carbs / sugars explains why at about 11am you start to feel tired and hungry so you grab a bar of chocolate or a coffee with sugar or something with carbs in and feel better but a few hrs later you feel the same tired and hungry so you eat something to give you a quick boost

This never happens to me. I can happily munch through two pieces of toast with butter and marmalade at breakfast and never get a weird "crash" at 11, necessitating a chocolate bar! I might have another coffee at 11 but I don't feel tired, or have a 'slump' or anything. If I eat too much sugar, eg at Easter, I might feel a bit sick. Then I don't want to eat anything,let alone more sugar, boak.

@hamsterarse, I am a medic who has done research and can interpret the data and can understand what studies are really saying. Assume and you make an ass of yourself.

I think most doctors agree with the newcastle study (diabetes) and know eating too many carbs is a big reason behind the weight gain int eh US and UK in the last 30 years. However it will take 30 years before the NHS is prepared to change its eating pyramid which has loads of carbs at the bottom so I am not holding my breath. Those of us who think eating health foods instead which makes us feel good (and which in no way are dull foods or lead to dull lives) can carry on eating well but I am certainly not happy to keep paying for the NHS when if people just turned to healthier foods and less food we could solve a lot of its funding issues.

What you tend to find is doctors understand the new science around healthy eating better than dieticians as they tend to read the latest research papers.

Think i shall just leave this here.

NEWS / CORONAVIRUS FOOD ALERT

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Government food parcels should come with a health warning
The Government has stepped in to distribute food parcels to the one and half million people clinically vulnerable people being shielded from the coronavirus. However, now that the parcels have started to arrive, questions are being asked about what is in them.

Photo credit: Food parcel for clinically extremely vulnerable people, March 2020. Anonymous but verified source

Photo credit: Food parcel for clinically extremely vulnerable people, March 2020. Anonymous but verified source

Pictures have emerged of emergency food boxes filled white bread, pasta, tins of corned beef and satsumas, and in a comment piece (£) The Times journalist Jenni Russell said she was ‘stunned’ by what she described as the ‘pitifully inadequate’ provisions being sent to tens of thousands of Britain’s most medically vulnerable people.

The operation is expected be scaled up to hundreds of thousands in the coming weeks. These are people the NHS considers the sickest in the country, who desperately need shielding from coronavirus. They number cancer patients, transplant survivors and immune supressed patients.

According to Jenni Russell, the first boxes, which are being organised by the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government, were “high on carbohydrate, much of it highly processed.” She listed: “a packet of fig rolls, a box of chocolate breakfast cereal, a packet of pasta, one white sliced loaf, a packet of potatoes. Three tins of beans, two of starchy marrowfat peas, two of tomatoes, one of peach slices, a jar of pasta sauce, teabags and coffee. There are no fresh vegetables but a little fresh fruit; a small bag of oranges and one of pears.”

She describes it as food “to survive on, not to nourish” and argues “the reason this matters so deeply is that we are not just trying to give people any old calories to keep them alive. In this pandemic, where there is no cure, whether or not we survive will be critically influenced by the robustness of our individual bodies and immune systems.”

Sustain chief executive, Kath Dalmeny, was interviewed for the piece and is described as “sympathetic” to the government’s fight on many fronts, but says it must recognise the magnitude of the task it has assumed here. Kath Dalmeny said:

“It is a crying shame that so many meals-on-wheels services have been axed due to austerity over recent years, which used to keep older people fed and cared for. In this coronavirus outbreak, it’s as if the state is starting a care home for 400,000 extremely fragile residents. These people need bespoke diets designed by clinical dieticians, differing for those with varying critical conditions, provided in packaging easily opened by weak hands. If they can’t get that, malnutrition and hunger will follow.

Xenia, “ I think most doctors agree with the newcastle study (diabetes) ”.

Do you now. You “know” this how?

Querlouse Sat 02-May-20 12:07:58
You mustn't say things like this. Then people can't blame Boris for the death toll

They can. The media are already starting to talk about how poor people are worse affected whereas all the horrid rich tory voters are fine in their big houses with expensive food

According to Jenni Russell, the first boxes, which are being organised by the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government, were “high on carbohydrate, much of it highly processed.” She listed: “a packet of fig rolls, a box of chocolate breakfast cereal, a packet of pasta, one white sliced loaf, a packet of potatoes. Three tins of beans, two of starchy marrowfat peas, two of tomatoes, one of peach slices, a jar of pasta sauce, teabags and coffee. There are no fresh vegetables but a little fresh fruit; a small bag of oranges and one of pears

What would you have in the boxes? Bearing in mind it is supposed to be enough calories to sustain someone, have a long shelf life (it can take days for them to be packed and delivered), and can't cost the earth?

Replace the bread with wholemeal and the cereal with something more boring and that's an OK box given the huge restrictions involved.

I really want a fig roll now.

Helena Those food parcels. Yet another government cause of diabetes and poor health.

I say again what I've said on other threads. The issues around poverty and obesity and poor health are not down to one government. No political party is blameless. The Blair and Brown governments caused as much damage as those that followed. The crippling NHS PFI debts being just one example.

www.rochdale.gov.uk/news/Pages/first-coronavirus-food-parcels-leave-bad-taste.aspx

First coronavirus food parcels for most vulnerable leave a bad taste in the mouth
30 March 2020

The contents of a sample food parcel.

The council is taking steps to improve the quality of the government food parcels for people most at risk from coronavirus after the first batch arrived in the borough.

The food boxes are for people who are being shielded from coronavirus and cannot leave their homes because severe health conditions leave them most vulnerable to the virus.

The government said the packages would contain essential food and household items such as pasta, fruit, tinned goods and biscuits, for those who need to self-isolate at home for 12 weeks but have no support network of family or friends to help them.

The parcels that arrived in the borough of Rochdale on Monday, 30 March 2020, however, contained tea bags, cordial, 1 apple, chocolate bars, dry noodles and gingerbread biscuits. There were also only 44 delivered, despite there being 129 people in the borough who are being shielded and have requested an emergency parcel. In other parts of the country the parcels have included ready meals and more nutritionally-balanced items.

To improve the quality of the parcels the council is adding extra items, including bread, milk and a selection of tinned meat and fruit. The council is currently contacting each of these shielded residents on the list to ask if they need additional help and support.

After seeing the parcels council leader Allen Brett is calling on the government to do more to improve the quality of what is being provided: "Everyone appreciates that this is an unprecedented situation but the parcels that have been provided were not of the quality we were expecting. Thankfully our council officers are able to source food locally and add them to the packs to ensure that those receiving them have a better choice of items.

'We are doing all that we can, I expect government to do the same'
"It's not clear to me why people in some parts of the country are getting pre-prepared meals and our citizens are getting tea bags, biscuits and cordial. We were also 83 parcels short so we've had to create those ourselves, which we are doing. The people receiving these parcels are likely to be alone and quite possibly afraid so there must be a greater effort to provide them with everything they need to get through this. We are doing all that we can, I expect government to do the same."

The improved parcels will be issued by council staff who are working around the clock to protect the most vulnerable. The council is already delivering much needed food parcels to other vulnerable and isolated residents who have requested assistance through our helpline. 4 hubs have been set up in each part of the borough, along with a dedicated phone line for anyone who needs support.

The hubs can be reached by phone on 01706 923685.

www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/11-kit-kats-11-tins-18099530

*11 Kit Kats, 11 tins of beans and 10 bottles of cordial in government food package to area with thousands in need

Why can't the individual councils sort this out themselves?

Some things are tinned and healthy like baked beans tinned tuna etc. Agree the food in the boxes sounds like lowest common denominator stuff

I am a medic who has done research and can interpret the data and can understand what studies are really saying. Assume and you make an ass of yourself.

@Mominatrix
You sound like a classic nhs guideline follower...should have guessed!

Not sure what your point is, other than you is significantly cleverererer than everyone else

For those who are actively trying to lose weight and struggling with hunger and low calorie, I'd recommend watching The Magic Pill on Amazon Prime.

It explains the link between diet industry, low fat, processed food and weight gain. Is a myth that you have to starve yourselves to lose weight. You will but it's unsustainable in the long term which is why SW and WW have so many returning customers.

I've lost 2 and a half stone so far by eating butter, cream, oily fish, cheese, 20% fat minced beef, lamb, chicken thighs with the skin on, berries, salad and non starchy veg that grows above the ground and no more than 25g carbs a day. I'm never hungry and always satisfied. My carb craving have gone, food has enough natural sweetness...

I eat full fat 'real' food. And nothing that is created from chemicals in a factory or that is designed to mimic real food.

I don't spend a fortune on food - fatty cuts of meat are cheaper than lean. I've reduced inflammation and developing food intolerances.

Low fat is grim, miserable and unsatisfying. For people who love the sense of indulgence - herby pan fried chicken thighs with creamy garlic and mushroom sauce followed by berries and whipped cream... what's not to enjoy about that!

I don't regard most of that in those NHS boxes as being good food. It is food to make people ill. It is appalling. As for the question to me above about how do I know most doctors accept the tested clear Newcastle University research that you can in many cases stop type 2 diabetes I know a good few doctors including my sibling and I am not quote rubbish, but instead proper research.

However if the NHS continues to want to make people ill by suggesting they each junk carbs with few nutrients in them then that's fine but many realise it is not a good plan.

The last 2 weeks I have followed a calorie controlled diet which also has goals for carbs, sugar, fat etc.
In this time I have lost 4lbs so pretty average weight loss.
I've been eating things like rice, jacket pots, salad, fruits, veggies. To be honest eating normally but not snacking.
I feel it's very individual how you loose weight however at the moment by eating my normal foods but no snacks it's working and working well.
However what works for me will not work for others and I accept that. However some people on this thread think it's a one size fits all scenario which it simply isn't.

shelf life ( it can take days for them to be packed and delivered), and can't cost the earth

Are you saying that the high sugar stuff is cheaper? Well No Shit!!

Because the theme throughout this thread has been that eating healthily is cheaper! And its just those pesky uneducated people who dont realize this.

So which is it?

Baked beans although tasty are full of salt and sugar. Some healthy balance is required to complement them. Lentils and tinned chickpeas are a cheap and healthy source of protein. Very versatile too. Lots of simple recipes. Nuts, slightly less cheap, but you only need a handful a day to get a reasonable dose of healthy fats and protein. Oats. Cheap and good for the blood pressure. Worth including considering hypertension is one of the biggest Covid risk factors. Where are the vegetables? Lots of local farm shops and stores are doing fresh veg boxes. If the councils are unable to source these, perhaps they sell out quickly, why not include tinned veg.

Are you saying that the high sugar stuff is cheaper? Well No Shit!! Because the theme throughout this thread has been that eating healthily is cheaper! And its just those pesky uneducated people who dont realize this. So which is it?

Oh, did not realise we had all joined together to form one posted instead of being different people with different opinions, my bad. As it goes, if you can factor in frozen food and stuff that goes off very quickly then yes you can buy healthy food for cheap, but they wouldn't be suitable for this box.

@ToffeeYoghurt my aunt's box had fresh apples, carrots, satsumas and potatoes. Not an amazing array, but not bad considering to be honest.

It's good she got some fruit and veg Servers
So it's varied depending on the council? I assume many simply haven't thought about it. They're probably under a lot of pressure and panicked. Prioritised getting any food out. Hopefully with time to think and receive feedback and tips, all will include some healthy fresh options (as well as a few treats).

grumpy that’s kind of what I’m trying, Ive been trying to eat three meals a day, no snacks, and only what’s necessary to eat . So for example, yesterday I had;

Granola with greek yoghurt, 1tsp honey and berries
Seeded crackers with Brie, grapes, tomato, hummous
Pork belly (1.5 slices), apple slices, tomato, cucumber, lettuce, cauliflower rice
Two biscuits and a portion of chocolate in the evening

That works out at just under 2000 calories (MFP - weighed out per portion and barcode scanned), and I’m using about 3000 calories a day (or so fit bit says).

If I do that strictly, I’m losing about 2lb a week - I’ve lost 35lb this way since 1st Jan . That’s probably far too slow but it’s better than nothing .

I honestly think any more complex and I’d give up - I can cope with this though, I can work out my allowances with that calories knowing eg that I can have treat but have to adjust rest of day to accommodate it .

I am not sure to be honest, there are a lot of local farms that have been struggling to sell their stock as they normally supply the local restaurants, so maybe they were able to secure a deal of some sort? They are definitely packed locally so not out of the question that they vary.

This is anathema to me since I am very focused on health and exercise, I do try to understand that others have very different mindsets priorities and values.

It is sad that 'fat people' disgust you. I also feel sad that you can openly say this and feel no compassion. I am not overweight, but if I was, I would feel bloody awful about your judgemental attitude and your assumption that it is ok to use such strong emotive language when people are clearly struggling with weight issues compounded a lower expectation of surviving this awful virus. I know someone like you; they are not pleasant to be around.

XingMing Fat people die quicker, and more often than thin people. How fking hard would you like this stated? I am not wishing to be rude, but it sounds as if you are trying to deny the evidence.

If I had the chance to survive death and get a second, third, fourth chance of living, therefore dying too, I may consider upping my calorie intake 😁

not sure how they can die more often than thin people but it's an interesting thought.

Obviously lighthearted response, in case you misread or misunderstand my message