Any anti-vaxxers around?

[Hermano]

Just wondering if anyone who would normally consider themselves to be an anti vaxxer, who hasn't given their child eg MMR would mind sharing if they've changed their mind following covid? If they'd take a vaccine when one is available, give it to their children etc?

No reason other than idle curiosity, vaccines are in the news a lot at the moment. I'm not a journalist, just a furloughed and slightly bored parent interested in hearing world views which are different from my own.

If you're interested I'm a scientist who is happy with the evidence base for vaccines and use them myself and for my children

@Userzzz

Hi OP. I know a few people whose children have had adverse reactions to vaccines (and eventually diagnosed with autism). My friend is a speech pathologist who works with autistic children and many parents report severe reactions to vaccines and subsequent regression. I believe these parents. Given the rates of autism these days, I did not vaccine my children. I will not be vaccinating them against Covid.

Aren't you scared that your kids might get measles or whooping cough?

Oh good, another thread full of complete nonsense and scaremongering 🙄

@Dowser

I have 4 completely unvaxxed grandchildren and one who has had one and one other who had all vaxxes including mmr. He has autism.

I know x amount of children who have been vaccinated and do not have autism. Your point is anecdotal and pointless. Try looking into the science behind vaccines and fingers crossed your grandchildren don't get measles

I had mumps, measles , rubella and whooping cough as a child.
Mumps and whooping cough were very unpleasant but not life threatening.
I don’t remember measles, so it can’t have been that bad and rubella I barely noticed.

Two grandchildren got measles. One never had a day of school and the other just took one day off.
They had one poorly day each and were fine for the rest of the time.

@screamingchild
I think you are reading too much into my post
I have 6 grandchildren
4 have had no vaxxes at all.
One has had one as a baby.
One had several including the mmr at thirteen months.

Ok that's interesting. I thought measles always resulted in children being very, very poorly.

All right, Dowser, but dh’s brother died from the measles when he was 10 years old.

@IrmaFayLear

All right, Dowser, but dh’s brother died from the measles when he was 10 years old.

That’s sad. Had he been vaxxes as well

I’m not anti vaxx but did refuse Rotavirus for DD3 (wasn’t offered for the other 2). I read up on it and the likelihood of her becoming seriously ill was minimal Vs a risk of twisted and dying bowel from memory!

So I would reject a vaccine if the risk to my children from the disease was small Vs risk from the vaccine. So for example they had TB because of family that posed a risk of transmitting it when it wasn’t usually offered I requested it. Undecided on Covid but suspect I’ll have a LONG time to decide!

I had one but wouldn't have another. Tried a upright Hoover but that was cumbersome and difficult to get under furniture. Then had a Henry but found that rather heavy to drag about. Now on a Dyson cordless which I find very good, limited battery life but I can cope with that.

I only know one person keen on the Covid vaccine tbh. You cannot say they are anti Vaccines in general but with only with this one. Also, they are from different part of the world and backgrounds. Some highly educated others average.

Some of them are very concerned about the origins of the virus and the indifference of governments around the world.

@Newdonewhugh

you said Anti vaccine is not necessarily about being anti vaccine but pro natural health, immune system etc. It’s a belief that you’re body is far more intelligent than any scientist.

The intelligent body you talk of struggled with so many diseases that have been eradicated or vastly diminished with since vaccines were used. Think smallpox, polio, Hepatitis B, tetanus, Diphtheria, whooping cough..... Indeed many people died prior to vaccinations. I think of vaccinations as a bit of help. It doesn't mean I am anti my own body using it's own immune system. Our immune systems are all different and some work better than others.

Don't take vaccines - that's fine. What I struggle with is the mass of misinformation that is spread by people that don't want them - eg the link to autism when numerous studies have shown there is no link to the MMR. Other weird things that some anti-vax people share is laughable. Some people are just scared of vaccines and that is different - it's the rubbish that is spouting that is the problem.

@Newdonewhugh

🙋‍♀️ I won’t be back to this thread because I know Mumsnetters can’t take any theory that questions vaccinations but I’ll give you a quick (ish) answer. I think you’re be very hard pushed to find a true anti vaxxer who will have changed there mind over Corona. Anti vaccine is not necessarily about being anti vaccine but pro natural health, immune system etc. It’s a belief that you’re body is far more intelligent than any scientist. Despite what you think of anti vaxxers, most spend hundreds of hours reading through scientific paperwork and studies. There’s this weird belief from people that do not study all the available information that scientists all form a collaborative view. I’ve heard so many times during last year “the scientists say..” I find it crazy that seemingly intelligent people say this! For every scientist that says one thing, you can bet your life, there is another somewhere trying to disprove the same theory. The scientists on TV say Corona is a disaster, but there any many out there saying differently. However they don’t get on mainstream TV as it’s not the Government’s narrative. The same goes for vaccines. There are many medics, scientists, professors etc. that bring forth evidence or there own views about vaccines but it’s not and TV and it’s not in YOUR narrative to look for it.

My body's thick as shit. It's been identifying my own tissue as foreign invaders since I was an infant (long before MMR ever existed). Just as DP's has been - and he was completely unvaccinated.

It would be interesting to see if anti-vaxxers changed their mind if everyone stopped all having all vaccinations.

@Dowser

I had mumps, measles , rubella and whooping cough as a child. Mumps and whooping cough were very unpleasant but not life threatening. I don’t remember measles, so it can’t have been that bad and rubella I barely noticed.

Two grandchildren got measles. One never had a day of school and the other just took one day off.
They had one poorly day each and were fine for the rest of the time.

Are you saying your grandchildren went to school with measles? If so this is incredibly irresponsible and they could have been responsible for the deaths of people who can’t be vaccinated.

@RizzleDrizzle

I am not trying to upset anybody at all here, so please dont be rude and snappy.
I just read on google it can be genetic and something to do with mutations - now a vaccine could maybe interfere with this?

Like we will ever find out the truth anyways - its not as if we have an honest government, who would confess if anything was caused by a vaccine.

I agree with HarrietOh.

Most anti-vaxxers rely on everyone else being vaccinated. I’m quite sure their principles might take a dive if there were no herd immunity to rely on.

• I am not trying to upset anybody at all here, so please dont be rude and snappy. I just read on google it can be genetic and something to do with mutations - now a vaccine could maybe interfere with this?*

No!!! It’s a life long neurological developmental condition - possibly genetic in the same way as heart issues, sight issues hearing issues can be.

Nothing to do with mutations and nothing to do with vaccines!

[quote ThisShitDontMatter]@RizzleDrizzle

I am not trying to upset anybody at all here, so please dont be rude and snappy.
I just read on google it can be genetic and something to do with mutations - now a vaccine could maybe interfere with this?

Like we will ever find out the truth anyways - its not as if we have an honest government, who would confess if anything was caused by a vaccine.[/quote]
How were there Autistic people before vaccinations, then?

How were there Autistic people before vaccinations, then?

There were! I think that’s possiably your point!

They might have been called savants
Or just eccentric.

But, Hans Asperger described what would become aspergers in the 1920’s before vaccines

I think this part of the problem, people don’t understand it’s not come from no where it isn’t just teachers and parents trying to label children

It’s a very real disability, it’s not caused by. Vaccines, mutations, and any other theory

Please stop trying to cure look for a reason we’re not acceptable for you. It’s massively disrespectful and othering

Thanks

Re: MMR and autism - my eldest was due the vaccination at the absolute height of the controversy, before the autism connection was discredited.
I decided not to give him the MMR, although he had the other childhood vaccinations on schedule.

He eventually had the MMR aged about 16 when a school nurse noticed and asked if we’d like a catch up? He said yes himself, having been diagnosed with ASD by that point.

My younger child had the MMR on schedule.

Agree with PP that all meds can cause side effects. Just have to weigh up the pros and cons.
Will be a while before the Covid vaccines are cleared for paediatric use, so plenty of time to see how they do in the adult population.

@RizzleDrizzle

How were there Autistic people before vaccinations, then?

There were! I think that’s possiably your point!

They might have been called savants
Or just eccentric.

But, Hans Asperger described what would become aspergers in the 1920’s before vaccines

I think this part of the problem, people don’t understand it’s not come from no where it isn’t just teachers and parents trying to label children

It’s a very real disability, it’s not caused by. Vaccines, mutations, and any other theory

Please stop trying to cure look for a reason we’re not acceptable for you. It’s massively disrespectful and othering

Thanks

I think it's more that they want an easy answer/something to blame for their child being noticeably different.

They're not at the stage as they would have been centuries ago where 'they just are/it's God's will' would have been accepted (assuming the kid survived with the infant and child mortality rates prior to vaccinations), but they still want the same certainty 'because of...'. answer - preferably without anything that could suggest their genes/family line had something to do with it.

The best part of two centuries of Eugenics is hard to shake off for some, I suppose.

I used to work with a young boy who was autistic, non verbal and with sever developmental delays. He was never vaccinated as his mum refuses to vaccinate any of her children. So his autism certainly not from the MMR!

Autism is hugely genetic. I recommend anyone who is interested in the rise in cases reads Neurotribes by Steve Silverman. There are plenty of reasons the rate of ASD is rising and none of these are vaccine related.

It’s also interesting how many ASD traits you can often spot in parent’s of kids with autism. You know, like obsessively researching one topic online and becoming stuck on one viewpoint and unable to have a logically debate about it. A bit like anti vaxxers...