Relaxing the lockdown won't affect deaths in carehomes?

[Heartbars]

Will it? Read on here today that schools shouldn't open because there are so many deaths in care homes.

The care home deaths are tragic and really upsetting but I genuinely can't see how sending kids back to school will affect them one way or another.

I've name changed as for some reason I am fully expecting lots of robust answers.

I'm so sorry to hear that @parkheadparadise

@LangClegsInSpace
Some areas are setting up interim care facilities that would fit your criteria no 4
On no 3) Care homes are largely privately owned and charging the elderly or the state handsome fees to live there. I maintain it is time the home owners put their hands in their own pockets to pay what is needed for PPE instead of expecting the state/NHS/us to do it. My local FB page has had a group of private homes appealing for help and donations despite the fact that company info shows their last statement registered assets of approx. £15million and their directors were paid over £500k each last year

Problem is it is now too late to protest care home residents as the virus has spread there so rapidly. Current deaths in care homes could be as high as c25,000. The government have now said they will provide numbers.

Not only is the increasing covid 19 death rate in care homes a major issue, for concern but so is the exorbitant increase in deaths that are not covid related. What is the reason for this? Neglect?

Not seen any figures for non COVID care home deaths - do you have the details?

Some areas are setting up interim care facilities that would fit your criteria no 4

That's hopeful.

I suppose it's pissing in the wind to expect them to do anything useful with the nightingales now. They are too useful empty - 'Great Britain and the NHS were exceptionally well prepared, look at our great big empty hospitals!'

Private care home owners should absolutely stump up for PPE but it doesn't solve the supply issues.

Care homes are often short staffed and we don’t get nowhere near the same ppe as NHS do. Infections spread so fast because there is often only 2 or 3 carers and 1 domestic to about 25 to 30 residents and we are in and out of rooms numerous times a day. Also small spaces and a lot of people living in them. Air conditioning spreading germs etc.

Infected residents can’t be forced to stay in their rooms and we can’t lock them in. Dementia residents cannot be told not to go near people or to stay in one place. They just don’t understand.

Care homes have always been used to take the pressure off the NHS (free up beds) and residents are often sent back to us to die. We can’t just leave them to die alone and lock them in a room, we still have a duty to care for them in their final moments.

Also we don’t just wipe people’s arses you know

wobbly.
Thank you for everything you do.

I think the ONS have said that care home deaths are much higher this year in comparison to the five year average. Some have said doctors not putting covid 19 down on death certificates as untested. Also with hospitals shutting down everything non corona this must of led to lack of treatment/ hospital admissions. Maybe some neglect whilst everyone's shut away and no relatives to keep an eye as awful as it may be.

Biggest risk to care home residents is those caring for them bringing the virus into a care home with elderly vulnerable residents

No, the biggest risk is the government guidance that forces care homes to accept people discharged from hospital with virus symptoms.

Luckly we have no one in the care home I work in, with covid 19. Hoping to stay that way too, we as carers as so scared if it comes in.

Does this work?

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iI was on the BBC earlier.

From what I am reading, covid-19 is also being put on Death certificates without tests having been carried out. So, it might be swings and roundabouts with those tested and those who have not. And, let's face it, most care home residents probably hadn't been tested.

Thanks for the slide - scary numbers

The test is not particularly pleasant so I would imagine testing residents with dementia would be problematic. Holding someone down whilst swabbing the back of their throats and up their nose would be immensely distressing for the resident and would raise ethical concerns.

Care home reality -

Jane wanders out of her room cuddling a cushion which she knows is her baby. The baby needs putting down for a sleep, so Jane wanders into toms room and tucks her baby into its crib (toms chair). Jane decides its time to tidy up the breakfast things and heads for the dining room. She passes Graham’s room and enters to say hello to him. She thinks it’s her husband.
Jane tidies then dining room touching everything and heedless of social distancing.
A member of staff tries to encourage Jane back to her room, but Jane needs to go to work and take her children to school...

Times this by 40 or more residents and only 6 staff - that’s why social distancing does not work in a care home.

As others have said - few care homes will have spare rooms for staff, not that many staff would or could be away from their families for weeks at a time especially on minimum wage.

@Bargebill19
You have described my mum. She would roam about with her doll. She had a habit of going in the rooms of bed ridden residents to make sure they were ok( thinking it was her parents).

It is all very well a couple of posters suggesting carer's move in with the resident's during this pandemic.
With all the goodwill in the world, most carer's have their own families to worry about on top of going in to the unknown at work every day wondering what they will face. Naturally their own families will come first at the end of the day and yes I work in a care home although not as a carer.

Carers are some of the lowest paid workers in society and some people are expecting them to move into their place of work 24/7, leaving their families and putting themselves at even greater risk? Would you do it?

My mum moved into a nursing home today she has been in hospital for 10 days and apparently doesn't have covid - I have been told she will be locked in her room for 7 days and barrier nursed.

Fortunatley my mum is competent enough to understand if they do this for her they will do it for new people coming after her so the system is about 'protection' but she is quite claustrophobic

@ParkheadParadise

Im sorry I didn’t mean to upset anyone. Just posting for the OP.

I was told I was stupid when I challenged my care home policy of accepting known covid positive patients into a covid free home. My argument was we had successfully managed four weeks covid free - a sister home already had both vacant rooms and covid positive patients, so use that home instead.
The lack of duty of care to residents and staff was appalling.
Care homes are not built to easily be disinfected from top to bottom daily. They are homes not hospitals. Many older ones do not have en-suites either. So that’s a lot of commodes needing emptying or sharing is communal bathrooms. All good ways of spreading infection. Add residents who wander here and there - and its no wonder covid19 runs rampant through a very vulnerable portion of our society once it’s through the front doors.

Most care home worker are women with young families. If they live away who looks after their children.

It's a myth that care homes owners make huge profits. Its expensive and labour intensive to look after patients with long term multiple needs.

Care homes are used as step down from hospital.

Risk of infection comes from staff and new residents.

The only thing that will help is testing and adequate PPE. Like theyve been doing I other countries. And a better systemic approach to care but that costs £.
Although were finding that some of the decisions we've made as a country were quite frankly stupid and have cost more and will cost more in the medium/long run.

Carers are some of the lowest paid workers in society and some people are expecting them to move into their place of work 24/7, leaving their families and putting themselves at even greater risk? Would you do it?

I'm not expecting anyone to do anything. I'm trying to pick through how we could stop the awful level of deaths but also relax the lockdown. I don't see what being low paid has to do with anything?

It's a myth that care homes owners make huge profits

I'm not sure it is a myth in all cases tbf

There was an interesting radio 4 programme on last year about the collapse of the car home sector. What care homes can charge and what it costs doesn't match.

It the same issue as 'free' nursery hours.

Southern Cross and Four Seasons, the two biggest companies, both collapsed last year, I think with high debts.