How can businesses slowly re-open if schools don't go back?

[trumpisaflump]

I've been thinking about this all day. A few of my friends are taking great delight I think in forecasting that schools won't go back until August (Scotland). And even at that it will be part time classes to allow social distancing. So an I wrong in thinking if this is correct them business will not be able to return as families/parents will have children at home?
It's been going through my mind all day and I don't know how we can have one without the other. Any ideas?

People couldn't afford childcare in times gone by neither, they had to manage.

One d the ways they managed was by grandparents and older siblings watching the children, and reciprocal childminding arrangements with neighbours and so on. Which we now can’t do. There are stories of women tethering their crawling babies to table-legs so they could go and work in the mills but even that was unusual.

I think you’re getting a bit too focused on whether individual mothers are and aren’t ‘entitled’ when it’s not about that. It’s about what will happen to the economy as a whole if school and childcare just stop existing for a while.

Italy has just announced schools wont return until September.

@Devlesko , aren’t you full of empathy!

People won’t cope, that’s the problem. People will lose their houses. It’s very difficult to survive on one wage these days. For my parent’s generation it was the norm but it’s not now. Child care is very expensive which is why people rely on grandparents.
I absolutely agree about not opening schools too quickly but even when we do open them I don’t think it will solve the childcare issue for many. My child is a toddler, so not school age. He goes to nursery a couple of days a week but usually looked after by grandparents the other days. He could go to nursery more but if everyone in the same situation does the same there won’t be enough childcare places.

The whole system is not set up for what we need it to do to get everyone back to work and shield the people that need to be shielded. I don’t have any answers but know it’s not as simple as just getting on with it.

@Italiandreams exactly, people will lose their livelihoods. It always drives me mad when people say schools aren’t childcare - they maybe aren’t, but if they weren’t there a lot of people could not afford to work. We need to recognise that school and nursery closures (but allowing other business to open - which need to happen unless we want the economy to implode) will cause problems and have a discussion about how we will mitigate this.

If schools remain closed are we going to be allowed to go into “bubbles” with other friends and family? What about those us without that option? Will schools/nurseries and or holiday clubs of some sort be allowed for those people?

I’m at the Bar we already have a massive problem with women leaving after 10 years (and childcare costs are a major problem). School and nursery closures will compound this.

@Devlesko there's no real point in saying 'well, people should cut their cloth and live on one salary' because that's not the way the world works anymore. People have their fixed outgoings and they have to be serviced.

You may as well try to bring back the cassette tape.

It has nothing to do with lacking empathy, I'm sorry for everyone in this position, I have my own dc wondering how they will cope with their mortgages and jobs, with no child care.
But the alternative to coping is not coping and floundering, so you do what you can to cope.
you have to compare to times gone by because our new future is nothing like the world we lived in pre covid 19. The world has changed and we have to adapt, rather than saying we need to go back to when we all had secure jobs with a thriving economy.

But what is this coping and adapting you are talking about.

If you cant meet the mortgage payments on one wage then it's a physical impossibility isn't it?

You dont adapt to that.

No ones moaning they cant have holiday or are having Tesco value beans . They are talking about not meeting the rent that requires both of them to cover. Rent which is not optional or an extravagance they can cut back on.

Moving is also an expensive business. You dont wake up and swap to a cheaper house one morning with no expense.

Looking back to previous generations isn’t helpful. Our way of life has changed so much since then and even post COVID no one wants to go back to the 1960/70’s way to life.

Parker

I think there will be a lot of disappointed people who don't want to do xy or z, tbh.
It's not about what we want, but I suppose that's typical of recent generations. It's about what we have and what we can do.
The position we find ourselves in with a killer virus, and the future we are given to adapt to.
We can shout about unfairness, or what we want as much as we want, but if it ain't happening it doesn't matter what people want, or what they were used to, or how they used to live, it's irrelevant now.

All I'm reading from this is if you have children then tough you don't get to do your job! I'm a ta so will have to work by my wage doesn't cover all our bills. My DH is already on furlough which is already causing a massive worry as we are losing a lot of money each month. So does he just quit his job to look after our children and then we can't afford to pay bills? He could work from home but I doubt his company would agree to that and unless the government make it a clause that you work from home then he would be expected to go in!

It's not about what we want, but I suppose that's typical of recent generations.

I will definitely try this one when it comes to paying my bills, thanks. "Well I'm sure you WOULD like that mortgage payment, bank, but this house would have cost a fraction of that in 1972 so I'm afraid that's all you're getting. You can stamp your feet all you like about unfairness but that's just the way it is now. Really, it's YOUR fault for being so entitled as to imagine you could just keep on getting paid the way you're used to, but I suppose that's just typical of your generation."

So, enlighten us, what can people do about not being able to go back to work when it opens because schools arent back, and the mortgage/rent cant get paid but they cant apply for new jobs without a school open date, they are currently on furlough so cant get another job now?

What is the answer here?

How do they adapt to eviction , small claims court and maybe even losing custody of their children through having no where safe to live?

I wonder if the tune would change if those on public sector salaries and pensions were facing significant cuts to their income?

@LaurieMarlow I think there will be a significant change in public opinion when the furlough scheme ends/is much more restricted after June (I don’t think it will continue as it is). So many friends in furlough are happy for lockdown for months, and also for schools not to go back. I think there will be a massive shift in public opinion when job losses start happening.

If the government don't extend the furlough scheme they will have to find a massive unemployment budget. There will literally be no housing for people who can't pay rent or mortgages as a result. So I think the furlough scheme in some form will be extended along with a mortgage/ rent holiday of some kind.

@upstar I think it may continue in some form, but it will be much more limited, so only for businesses that can not open (so pubs, restaurants etc). Unemployment budget will be less then the furlough scheme.

The government cannot afford to pay 80% of people’s salaries indefinitely.

The scheme will be scaled back significantly, very soon. Hoards of people will be made redundant and have access only to JSA. How the fuck they’re going to pay rent/mortgage is anyone’s guess.

@LaurieMarlow my husband and I are both public sector workers ( and key workers) , it’s highly likely one of us will have to give up work ( prob my husband he earns less) . So we will also face a significant drop in income. It’s affecting everyone.

@tinytemper66
Thank you for that news. So Italy, ahead of us in lockdown are going back in September. So it looks even more unlikely now that we will be back before then.

Which adds up with what previous posters said about the additional resources and lap tops being provided by government now, to see us over for a good few months.

@SophieB100 Italian schools were due to break up on 7 June. I imagine they felt no point going back for 2- 3 weeks. Difference in England is if they went back on 1 June they’d be back for 6-7 weeks.

I wonder if the tune would change if those on public sector salaries and pensions were facing significant cuts to their income?

What like the last 10 years you mean?

@StrawberryBlondeStar, I didn't realise that, thank you.

@LaurieMarlow my husband and I are both public sector workers ( and key workers) , it’s highly likely one of us will have to give up work ( prob my husband he earns less) . So we will also face a significant drop in income. It’s affecting everyone.

Why would one of you have to give up work? Because of childcare?

@StrawberryBlondeStar, just to add to that though, if the usually break up on 7 June, when do they usually go back? Presumably they only have 6 weeks break? If so, why aren't they thinking of going back late July/August?