Childminder pay

[Christmascaker]

Evening all. We’ve just received an invoice from our childminder for 100% fees for May. Just wanted to know if this was standard practice or if anyone had been offered a reduced rate? She seems to think she will be open again in May. I understand she has bills to pay but thought even a small reduction as she’s not providing for etc would be a gesture of goodwill? She’s great and we don’t want to upset her or lose our place but I can’t work out if we’re being unreasonable to expect a reduction however small?

Sorry, should say “providing food etc.”

We love our childminder and and have used her for years so we are still paying her the full amount though we are still working and only pay for 1 day a week. I probably not want to pay for a full week though.

What does your contract say?

I’m paying ours full - never expected not to as I’m lucky enough to be paid in full. She’s essential to us doing our jobs when we return to normal. We really value her and she’s amazing - she’s sending weekly challenges, resources and dropped bags of Easter crafts and eggs and then sunflower seeds to grow too.

It's very nice that some of you are willing and able to pay in full for a service you're not receiving. I don't know anyone outside of MN who is doing that- I certainly wouldn't and the OP doesn't want to.

Your childminder is not currently able to provide the service. Read your contract carefully. I know people who are paying because they are professionals and able to and want to support a person who is worse off in this situation. But legally speaking, unlikely that you need to pay. Check the wording of what it says if she is not able to provide the service. The same applies to most cleaners etc. So some people are paying in full for moral reasons, but they really are not obliged to. Unless the contract says you have to keep paying if she has to close due to eg force majeure (and it is widely drafted to include the current situation) I do not see why you would need to pay.

We are paying ours in full too, but I do wonder if she could claim the 80% furlough pay if we didn’t?

For example, I am paying most of my children's music teachers in full for lessons on Zoom. They are still providing a service. It is not optimal, but I want to support them. They are lovely and not very well paid and add a lot to my children's life. Quite a few other parents have opted out of these lessons as they can't e.g. tune the violin/make the piano in the living room available at X time.

Are you on a Pacey contract? If so, check point 43, your childminder cannot charge full fees.

I have paid 20% of fees to cover my Childminder’s fixed costs, clearly I wouldn’t wish for her to go out of business BUT she can furlough herself.

Ours asked for full pay for April, which we paid (our salaries are unchanged), but has refused payment for May as expects government pay to kick in at some point. Because our salaries are unchanged, it’s only a few days wraparound care per week, and we pay in vouchers, we did offer to pay for May or to pay half but she refused. If my pay or employment was affected by the situation, I might not have been willing to do this.

I think it is reasonable to pay something to retain the place but I’m not sure what that should be. I agree I’d expect at least a small discount to reflect the cost of meals not being provided, etc.

Thanks for everyone’s input. Our contract says if she closes for exceptional circumstances we won’t be charged however we received an email the week before lockdown saying if she’s forced to close we will still need to pay. A friend of mine said that we’re effectively paying £800 to charity every month and now I can’t get that out of my head. We are both being paid so I can see how it’s fair to continue to pay her, however, we are juggling looking after a 2 year old with work. She effectively isn’t working at all. I suppose we could give our months notice but I think that would cause a break down in the relationship we have built and leave us in the lurch if we’re all suddenly sent back to work! I keep going round in circles!!!

she could claim the 80% furlough pay if we didn’t?

No, shes self employed so will be able to claim that grant. And work.

Your childminder is self employed and will be eligible for the self employed grant payable in June, providing she has been working for the last four years and has filed a tax return. Because CMs usually have a lot of expenses, the payout for the vast majority will be much less than the 80% promised.
I really don't think you should be paying in full though as she will get some money to make up for not being able to work. The email you received isn't enforceable anyway as you have to agree to it as part of a contract review. Does she care for quite a few children do you know? Does she have assistants to pay?

I’d be slightly put out, because she’ll still be able to claim the 2/3 year funding.... so if all her parents pay full fees, she’ll essentially be making more money, for doing zero work?!
I’d certainly challenge it.

Up to you. But she sounds extremely cheeky asking for payment in advance for a service she is unlikely to be able to provide. She needs to apply for the self employed grant.

We have asked for a reduction but been told it’s not possible. She doesn’t qualify for the 80% or would get very little, not 100% clear from the response. No assistants, I think she has 3 under 3’s including us, the others are all in the government funding scheme.

Depends how much you want to keep her. But she'll be getting the money for the funded children presumably. I'd offer to pay a retainer or say goodbye. I Don't see why people should be ripped off. I certainly wouldn't hand over £800. It's sheer greed and exploitation. Especially since she's done it without even discussing it with you.

The issue is self employed help still isn’t even available to claim yet never mind being processed. Mid May was the last we heard. People’s bills are bouncing all over the place in the meantime if they have no other source of income

I run a day nursery. We have asked for 20% of fees (so an 80% reduction) for those who have not been financially affected by the virus. Those who have are being charged nothing. We have also put ALL children on term time only contracts to reduce costs down further. We do need fixed costs to be paid, and we are staying open for key worker’s children, so cant furlough all staff.
The vast majority of parents have been so supportive. A small majority are refusing to pay “On principle”. I am not keeping these spaces open.

Our contract says if she closes for exceptional circumstances we won’t be charged however we received an email the week before lockdown saying if she’s forced to close we will still need to pay.

Your contract overrides her email. As she can't just unilaterally change the terms of engagement without your agreement.

We gave our notice when our childminder did this. She was fully aware that we have no income coming in now and still wanted full fees- it was either pay her or pay the mortgage. And this could go on for several more weeks.

This might be helpful

Our contract says if she closes for exceptional circumstances we won’t be charged however we received an email the week before lockdown saying if she’s forced to close we will still need to pay

Clearly she has very little understanding of what a contract means, which would worry me in itself

A friend of mine said that we’re effectively paying £800 to charity every month

I believe your friend's correct, though whether or not to pay has to be your decision. As always on these threads, though, I'll ask how she's proposing to safeguard anything you pay in case she has to close permanently ... funnily enough nobody's ever answered that

@Thismummyruns it could go on for several more months e.g. childcare and schools not being open.

My relative is a childminder. They use Pacey contracts and were told by Pacey they were unenforceable in this scenario and they could not charge. They're still getting the 30 hours money from the government scheme and will hopefully get some of the self employed payout. I don't think they would have felt comfortable charging for a service they couldn't provide even if Pacey had said they could.