The “I just had a sit down in the park with crisps” brigade

[Candodad]

You are the problem. The rules are simple. Go out and exercise and then go home. Just that, nothing more than that.

To be fair then problem is actually bigger than that and has been brewing for years as we increasingly become a country with rules but almost everyone has an excuse for why that rule shouldn’t apply to them/their child/family.

No one seems to give a toss how very difficult this is for those of us told not to leave our homes. We are just being expected to cope by some magical way not available to anyone else.

I feel desperately sorry for those shielding, and have met quite a few as I volunteer to shop or pick up medication for many. But it's a balance of risk that doesn't apply to those of us fortunate not to have to shield. And trying to make yourself feel better by preventing everyone else from doing what you can't simply isn't fair. For starters, I wouldn't be able to do those things for shielding people if we all had to follow your rules.
Sadly the risk to mental health is real, and I hope you're getting support to help you manage the isolation @Hearhoovesthinkzebras. But everyone else needs to manage their own health as best they can, under the guidance that applies to them.

And for everyone bleating about the 'long term mental and physical health implications' of not being able to leave your home...seriously

Maybe you should tell that to the women and children I deal with in my job who are now suffering horribly trapped in their homes with abusers.

PineappleDanish you are spot on. The Great British Public are behaving like sheep (and I apologise to sheep because they can’t help it). What happened to common sense? I will go out whenever I choose and as long as I’m socially distancing what on earth is the problem.

If someone is sitting on a park bench for 10 minutes eating whatever it is (is there something particularly heinous about crisps and would it be ok if it was an apple) and they’re keeping their distance or the park isn’t busy, please explain to me how that can cause a risk. What worries me more than anything is how the GBP are going to behave once lockdown restrictions start to be eased. Will the paranoia continue?

But you’re not saying how terrible it is for you, Hooves. Up until about 10 minutes ago. What you have been doing is misrepresenting that the guidelines actually say sbd pointing the finger of judgment at those who disagree with you. It’s clear that this is affecting you sbd I appreciate how tough it can be, having been socially isolated for some time myself in the past - but that doesn’t mean you get to berate others who are ignoring the tighter rules you’re trying to impose here via shaming and judgment.

No what I mean, Hear, is that just because you have been advised to stay inside does not give you the right to dictate that everyone else does the same.

You have been ADVISED to shield - that's not a law, or a mandate, nobody's going to fine you if you leave the house, the law accepts that as an adult you get the facts and make your OWN decisions.

It doesn't give you the rights to sit there on your high horse preaching and dictating to everyone else.

"Are there no.rules as far as you are concerned?"

You are only in favour of rules that suit you. You argue against ones that don't.

Even in the shielded group the CMO and DCMO have made it very clear that it is advice. No one is making you do anything. If you read the science properly you'd be able to assess the level of risk that is acceptable to you.

Of course it must be very difficult but there's no earthly reason everyone's life must be so difficult. How does that help you?

Oh, we're begining to get into the obligitory merail from HearHooves now, who at least isn't demanding a personalised risk assessment from the government for her particular personal situation unlike a on a related thread last week when the last 5 pages of a thread turned into a string of potentially helpful suggestions and rebuttals.

It's unchartered territory. There are no absolute answers. If you feel that on balance it's better to get out and exercise (with food and utilising benches if necessary) do that. If you feel it's better to hermetically seal yourself into the home and quarantine and disinfect all supplies, that's your risk assessment. If you are in an extreme shielding position, the use of benches and crisps has pretty minimal effect on your life and the hazards presented by C19 anyway.

The police are more interested in busting the groups taking 25 mile journeys to a different town for a burger or busting big house parties than low-level snackage.

I blame the bloody Calvinists and other puritans - it's their legacy here in the 'we must suffer and obey' brigade.

Off to watch Babette's Feast. I wonder if she provided crisps?

Sadly the risk to mental health is real, and I hope you're getting support to help you manage the isolation

From where? The non existent support services?

f someone is sitting on a park bench for 10 minutes eating whatever it is (is there something particularly heinous about crisps and would it be ok if it was an apple) and they’re keeping their distance or the park isn’t busy, please explain to me how that can cause a risk.

The risk is from touching a potentially contaminated surface ( the bench) and then infecting yourself by touching your face.

@PineappleDanish

Again, can you show me where I've said people can't go out? I haven't.

Can you show me where I've said people can't sit on a bench? I haven't

I've said it is an infection risk and I think you're foolish if you do it. That's not saying you must not do it or you aren't allowed to do it.

As for me not following the shielding rules - of course I don't have to. But I'm not foolish and I don't want to risk catching, for me, a potentially fatal illness. I don't need a law to force me to make sensible choices.

True.

Me not sitting on a bench eating crisps sadly won't make your situation better, HearHooves. Me sitting on a bench eating crisps will make me feel better though. Why are you begrudging it?

And I promise I won't be touching my face. I can also sit down and get up without having to hold on the something.

It's only my bum in contact with the bench, the way it is when I use the Tube, which is allowed.

No one is making you do anything. If you read the science properly you'd be able to assess the level of risk that is acceptable to you

The problem is the science doesn't exist right now. It's all maybes and possibilities.

How much distance from another person is safe? There is no science that gives a firm rule about this.

Why are shielded people told not to go out at all? What are the risks of doing so? No guidance or science that k can see about this.

So, how do you assess the level of acceptable risk when no one seems to know what the risks are?

That's why I don't understand those who want to sit on a public bench and eat food. We do know that you can catch this from touching a contaminated surface and we do know that you infect yourself by touching your mouth - so why take the risk?

I'm bothered by runners ignoring safe distancing, but if the distancing is fine nobody should be getting so involved in another person's business that they care about when that random eats their snack. In full disclosure, we always take DS snacks and water because he can't walk / run a few miles without it, because he's only 2. A colleague occasionally needs a rapid snack in meetings because he's diabetic, I presume he'd have a snack as needed. My dad has to sit and rest his legs, he couldn't get enough exercise otherwise. Sometimes I get dizzy because my thyroid isn't under control, should I just risk falling or should I sit down? I'd be very confused by someone objecting to randoms eating or sitting in real life, can only presume this is a bored keyboard warrior who hasn't thought it through.

ChardonnaysPetDragon

I'm not begrudging you. Take the chance if you want, it's up to you. But I do think you then need to take every precaution to not put anyone else at risk if you've become infected.

Same as smoking. You have the right to smoke. I can think you are foolish to do so. But you don't have the right to put others at risk by smoking indoors in public places or even outdoors in certain areas. It's up to you to risk your own health but you don't have a right to risk anyone else's

Oh that's nice, HearHooves

So when I tell you that I am indeed taking all precautions will you be happy for me? I'll have some crisps in your honour sitting on that bench, not touching anything untoward.

And for everyone bleating about the 'long term mental and physical health implications' of not being able to leave your home...seriously?

If you dont think that this will have mental and physical health implications for some members of the public you are out of your tree

hear

I get that your own particular situation is difficult and you have my sympathy.

But trying to police others, over and above what the police themselves have been instructed to do is not the answer.

You must see that.

Exactly BOGOF

The risk is from touching a potentially contaminated surface ( the bench) and then infecting yourself by touching your face.

That doesn't make sense.

If you are the type that goes out, touches things and touches your face, you are more likely to catch it in the supermarket, the phramacy etc.

We are responsible for ourselves. If you go out without hand gel, or touch your face or don't wash your hands and follow the recommended hygiene, that's your own fault.

Not the fault of someone else sitting on the bench, that you also sat on.

LaurieMarlow

Perhaps you could point out where I am policing anyone?

You seem very hung up.kn the police and the law. I asked you earlier about handwashing and you didn't answer - handwashing isn't a legal requirement yet it is the government advice. Are you advising people not to do it, as it isn't the law?

Hooves, you’re doubling down and you know it.

The risk is from touching a potentially contaminated surface ( the bench) and then infecting yourself by touching your face. Don't know about anyone else but when I sit on a bench my backside is touching the potentially contaminated surface and I've never touched my face with my backside so I feel the risk is very small.

If you are the type that goes out, touches things and touches your face, you are more likely to catch it in the supermarket, the phramacy etc.

Possibly but food shopping is a necessity and sitting in the park isn't, so, if you are going to take risks surely it is better to minimise the number of times you do it.

Also, people are aware that going to the supermarket is a risk so may well be more careful. Wipes are available to clean the trolley down and you aren't walking around eating. At the park, people might be more relaxed and not perceive any risk, much like on holiday - people engage in riskier behaviour on holiday and do things they would be wary of doing at home.

So, maybe they are the type to not care wherever they are or maybe they just haven't thought about infection being s possibility in the park. Some people have even said it on this thread - if I'm social distancing how is sitting on a bench any danger?

I don't think that everyone does understand the potential risk involved.

When lockdown was announced Boris was pretty clear - "I must give the British people a very simple instruction - you must stay at home". I wonder if he has told Carrie off for leaving her London flat to join him at Chequers. Yesterday they said on the news that Dominic Raab had been to Chequers for a meeting with him. I wonder if he told him off for not doing it over the internet. These naughty people who break the rules, you'd think Boris would know better after what he's been through.