Being 'vulnerable' does not make you part of the 'Shielded' group - if you're confused, see below

[Clymene]

At the start of the outbreak, many people were told they were in the vulnerable category. This includes people with asthma, pregnant women, the morbidly obese and people with MS and diabetes.

The full list is here: www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-guidance-on-social-distancing-and-for-vulnerable-people/guidance-on-social-distancing-for-everyone-in-the-uk-and-protecting-older-people-and-vulnerable-adults

These people should be very careful with social distancing, ideally for 12 weeks.

The shielded group are people who are extremely vulnerable. They have been identified by the NHS and should not leave the house. These are people with cancer, organ transplants, cystic fibrosis and other serious conditions. This is why they have been issued with food parcels by the government. A full list of these people is here:

www.gov.uk/government/publications/guidance-on-shielding-and-protecting-extremely-vulnerable-persons-from-covid-19/guidance-on-shielding-and-protecting-extremely-vulnerable-persons-from-covid-19

You cannot self-define as shielded. If you are vulnerable, take precautions. Use your local resources. But remember there are people who are much more vulnerable than you.

If you do not fall into either of these groups, please leave the resources to keep the vulnerable safe and well. Not only to protect them, but to protect all of us. Not to put too fine a point on it, but if the vulnerable clog up all the beds, there won't be any space for the outliers who randomly get very ill.

My CD has asthma but has not received a letter. On reading the website it seems that her dose of symbicort is not enough to put her in the vulnerable group so could carry on at work. She works for Co-op who on learning she has asthma have sent her home which I am glad about as she was coming into contact with hundreds of people every day with not a lot of protection. Not sure what it is like in her shop because this was before they ramped up procedures.

I am T2 diabetic and again not sure where I fall into any vulnerability stakes (managed with medication and nuclear reading was below true diabetic stage) and my DH has cancer 5 years ago and had a lymph mode removed. We are just being very careful at the moment whilst trying to look after 3 other households.

I'm more concerned about DD than either of us.

Although I agree with you that it isn’t a reason why any asthmatic should be in a high exposure environment.

@NaturalBornWoman I know exactly what you mean. I'm being shielded, we are a family of 6 and I'd never ask someone to pick us up a weeks shop. We've been running very low as it's been over 2 weeks since my last shop was delivered.

As you say, when people offer to pick up bits of us in the meantime, I don't feel like I can be too picky or ask for too much.

Asthma U.K. have said to follow the advice of ACAS, which is this:

‘If an employee is still being asked to go out to work and they believe they're at risk because they're in one of the vulnerable groups, it's important they talk to their employer.

If they cannot follow guidance on social distancing at work or during travel to work, they should tell their employer they need to follow government advice and stay at home.’

Which is good, but not as good as the government giving clear instructions to employers. I don’t really want to risk getting sacked and win at tribunal. I just want the government to be clear with employers.

For anyone who is shielding (has received the relevant letter and/or text and cannot get a slot up to this point) try calling Sainsburys on this number 0800 052 5500.

I called today and explained I'm shielding due to chemo and cannot get a slot. They took my details and told me I'd be able to access a slot within 48hrs if my details correlated to the list the government have provided them with.

By this evening, I had an email saying I had been added to their priority list and I've been able to get my slot!! I can't get a delivery for a week but I don't even care. Unless you've not been able to shop for yourself for weeks, you won't understand how good it feels to be able to fill up your own shopping trolley ☺️

I hope this is of help to those who genuinely need it 🤞🏼

@Nameofchanges

Perhaps I was too general when talking about asthmatic people: though I think what I said applies to many, perhaps there some whose asthma is so mild that it wouldn't be likely to pose a problem. I really couldn't say. All the people who I know with asthma (including 3 in immediate family) are offered a flu jab.

I thought the friality score was mainly older people who couldnt walk or look after themselves..

Frailty score only applies to over 65s according to the guidelines.

Dont all asthmatics on inhalers get the flu jab?

Shmabel, I think you are right to be concerned for all of the groups.

Helen, when the vulnerable list came out, posters on here said who they were asthmatic and didn’t get offered the flu jab.

there ARE some*
whoM*
in MY immediate*
And probably other errors. It's late

Helen - so doesnt that mean they wont restrict treatment access for bog standard asthmatics who are younger? Its more those who are quite unwell. I think...

I think our surgery used to offer all asthmatics a flu jab, but in recent years its asthmatics on a steroid inhaler.

This is what the BMA said, that a poster quoted:
‘ COVID-19 include severity of acute illness, presence and severity of co-morbidity and, to the extent that it is a clinically reliable indicator, patient age.’

It's not about restricting treatment automatically. If there is someone with no comorbidities but otherwise identical to someone with a comorbidity but only one ventilator then, well the situation is fairly obvious. In the actual situation there is far more too it though. Same with resuscitation, they can only resuscitate if there are the intensive care facilities available otherwise it causes more harm than good.

I dont believe (and I'm happy to be told I'm wrong if there is evidence to the contrary) that any of it is clear cut "shes shielding, we'll let her die". Whta it comes down to is where resource is limited, those who are.more likely to recover and recover quickly at that are likely to get the resources.

@LonginesPrime signed up the first day. Nothing yet. I don't have a letter or text to say I need to shield so I'm not sure how that will work
(I do need to shield, I just appear to have been missed)
I'm ok for food for now, but I am kicking up a small fuss as there will be people who aren't

And what if the supermarket list doesn't match the government list, I guess I'll be refused a slot? It's a complete shit show
I've said this before but I am bolshy and gobby when I need to be but some people aren't
And if you say you haven't got a letter or text. People are "oh well you don't need to be shielding". Yes, yes I do, my condition is on the bloody list! And you ring the GP because you haven't got a letter and they don't know what to do after reception tell you you aren't vulnerable

I have a podcast interview tomorrow for this exact story, god help them

Some people who should be shielded haven’t received a letter. Others have received one and don’t know why they have.

That’s why it’s important for people who know they are in the shielded group to self identify.

ClientQueen
What is the podcast? Can we listen?

Some people on Twitter are getting messages about slots.

my point is, that in the team I manage we have 4 asthmatics, I person whose husband has had heart surgery, 1 person whose mother died young of pneumonia and whose partner wants her not to resign her job, another person prone to chest infections, plus a couple of staff with extreme anxiety. There are about 2 therapists in a team of 15 who do not have a good reason not to be at work. And yet, there is a job to be done and we work with poorly infectious people all the time, we also all get the flu jab as we are in NHS so recommended for all. It would be lovely to protect ourselves at home but we also have a duty of care to our patients. I do not expect those with asthma to treat known Covid patients but even our green non covid wards have cases becoming symptomatic after a few days. I am very thankful that my team are willing and committed and no, I cannot guarantee no one will get poorly, but I never could prior to Covid anyway.

@ClientQueen yes because the ordinary person on the street doesn't understand what your and my conditions are.

They only have an idea if someone close to them has had cancer, had an issue with their neutrophils and they understood what the issue with this is.

I've even had to explain my condition to GPs but other people with blood conditions, lupus and MS said explaining to GPs is normal. I actually left a GP practice as the senior partner couldn't get it but a nurse practitioner and a GP trainee did. The GP accused me of making a fuss every time I went with a bacterial infection that caused me nasal and ear problems.

Although a manager, I will add I am also clinical today and today will be only therapist in on my team so will be seeing Covid19 patients if needed to. I am on Symbicort 200 4x daily. I am also obese. I know these are risk factors but not a reason not to do my job. This is war and I intend to fight the battle. I don't want a medal, I am just saying that we all have a good reason not to be here but the job still needs doing. Our teams job is to get people out of hospital safely so we are crucial at the moment with pressure beds.

@goodbyestranger you are catastrophising. That is not how dnr letters work. I don’t think it’s helpful to post things like that when it is completely untrue

cinnamonbuns I'm the opposite of a catastrophiser by nature. Medics have told me different from your version I'm afraid. Anyhow, I'm very dubious about the first letter in my own case and even if I wasn't, I wouldn't sign up to the second, for the simple reason that I would like medical treatment. Are you a medical doctor currently working on a Covidward?

@MangePasTesOnglesVilain I'll post a link when I can
@LittleLittleLittle sounds sadly familiar. A doctor told me i didn't have neutropenia because my neutrophils were ok. I asked if a diabetic with normal blood sugars were still diabetic or if they were magically cured

How can you have neutropenia if your neutrophils are ok? Also, surely neutropenia doesn't make you 'extremely vulnerable' if you're in otherwise good health with no frequent infections etc?

@goodbyestranger because I have a condition called autoimmune neutropenia. It falls under the rare conditions with increased risk of infection on the shielding list
Some days I am neutropenic, some I'm not. It depends how many of my neutrophils I've killed off that day and also when I injected my GCSF. My haematology consultant who has treated me for years has been very strict in the need to shield. I am likely to have neutropenia for life, and my injections and appointments have recently been increased due to a cluster of infections
Anyone diagnosed with it is on the shielding list, there are various types but the autoimmune one is the least found in adults