Schools Reopening?

[Liveforever86]

When do you honestly think it will happen? And when do you want it to happen?!

I’ve no idea why teachers keep peddling this lie tgat they are not paid for holidays.

They are contracted to work 195 days a year and 32.5 hours a week. They are paid a full time wage for this.

Again teaching assistants and all other non-teaching staff need to work 37.5 hours a week. If they work 32.5 hours a week which most do as they work school hours then they receive a further deduction for the uncorked 5 hours a week as well as a deduction for all the unpaid leave they are forced to take as schools are not opened. This is why teaching assistants are so poorly paid.

Someone unthread said some rubbish that teaching assistants could choose to spread their pay over the holidays too. All councils pay everyone 1/12th of their salary each month but non-teaching staff get deductions for the holidays and the shorter school day (shorter than say other council workers who say work 9-5pm).

Teachers get no deductions for holidays or the shorter days.

I know, I used to manage all the school salaries. I was horrified when I was employed as a business manager and found that I had so many deductions for my shorter days and extra holidays. The teachers were paid 100% of their salary and anyone declaring anything else is mixing this up with teaching assistants.

If teachers are trying to suggest that they don’t get paid for the holidays or the shorter working week then they would all be on a starting salary of £60k gross before the deductions and annualization which is just not the case.

@scubadive No, teachers do not work 32.5 hour weeks. They are contracted for 1265 hours and are expected to complete additional work, as needed, in their own time.

@scubadive

You are wrong. My contract is for 195 days/ 1265 hours. That’s what my salary is for. Factored in is statutory holiday pay.

When a post is advertised that is what we know we will be expected to do....and the salary is for that amount of time. People have posted the evidence for you up-thread.

There are no deductions, because we are contracted for set time. I don’t know how many ways we are supposed to say that to you.

Teachers are not paid 13 weeks holiday and you are the one peddling misinformation.

Oh and there is no 32.5 hours a week. I have no idea where in all your experience you got that from?

We have 1265 hours of directed time, which needs to be calendared and accounted for at the start of the academic year.

Teachers standard contracted hours are 32.5 hours a week.

They may work more than this but then most people work more hours than they are contracted to do. How many professional workers do you think work a strict 9-5pm as their contract probably states.

The point being is that other non-teaching staff have their salaries reduced pro rata ie) they are paid 32.5/37.5 * their salary, even when they are ‘full time’ as their contracts state that full time means 37.5 hours a week even though school are not open for 37.5 hours a week and so they couldn’t work full time’ even if they wanted to. They also can’t work in the holidays when the schools are shut so again they can’t work ‘full time’.

Teachers contracts however, say full time means 32.5 hours per week for 195 days per year and so are paid their full annual salary if they fulfill these terms. How anyone can interpret this as they are not paid for the holidays Is beyond me. If you weren’t paid for the holidays you would have these uncorked days deducted from your full time annual salary as all other non-teaching staff do, but you do not have any such deductions because you are paid for the holidays.

Teachpaint surely starting term early would make an awfully long term. Most children can barely cope with 6weeks before a half term. Surely no-one can keep going from the end of July until the end of October?

@scubadive

If the 195 days are accounted for between September and the end of July, then how am I being ‘paid’ for all of the holidays too? I’m not.
If I’m forced to be ‘part-time’ as you say, then again part of the year I’m not being paid for.

When I started my job, I had the option of how I wanted to take my salary.

scuba are you dense?
There are 365/366 days a year.
104 of them are weekends when teachers cannot work - Saturday and Sunday, basing that on two days a week every week for 52 weeks.
That leaves 261/262 other days of the year. Of that teachers work for 195 days (190 child contact and 5 inset days).
That leaves 66/67 days. In Scotland we get 40 days paid holiday, inclusive of 9 bank holidays. Specifically 5 days holiday in autumn, 10 at Christmas, 10 at Easter and 15 in the summer.
That still leaves 26/27 days unaccounted for as they are classes as school closures. They account for the other days in those aforementioned holidays but we are not paid for them.

I get paid for 195 working days and 40 days of leave - 235 days. That means each year I am not paid for 131 days of work, weekend and school closures.

My salary is based on those 235 days, bit instead of splitting it in to different amounts each month to accommodate the different working/non-working days it is divided in to 12 equal payments.

Other employees working a 9-5 Monday to Friday will get paid for 261/262 days of work, x amount are holidays that they are paid for and y amount are the days worked. They are paid for all 261/262 days.
Teachers are paid for 235 days.

Can you not see that?

Your 1265 hours/195 days are 39 weeks at 32.5 hours per week.

Everyone else in the UK has a standard 47 or 48 weeks at 37.5 hours.

A full time salary for a teacher is not prorated. Teachers are paid for all the holidays. You all obviously feel guilty about this otherwise you wouldn’t try and peddle this nonsense that you are not.

And I don't know where you got 32.5 hours from.
In Scotland our contracted hours are 35 per week. 7 hours a day, not paid for breaks and lunches.
Others who work 9-5 and have an hour's break/lunch they aren't paid for also only work 35 hours paid.

Scuba you will need to completely re-write the SNCT agreement that all Scottish teacher contracts are based on.
It is obviously false.

scubadive

I can only talk about Scottish teachers.

We are paid for term time and 40 days annual leave a year. We are not paid for the 5 weeks that are classed as school closure. We are also obligated to work 1 week equivalent cpd per year and are employed for 35h per week (fte).

Our pupil support assistant are band 2 or 3, pay differers as do duties slightly. Their hours vary and jobs are advertised at fte pay, which is misleading as the school year is a part year.

They are very badly paid and should be far more respected and better paid. They recieve 32 days paid holiday a year (pro rata) rising to 37 which is equivalent of 24/25 rising to 28/29 paid holidays a year. Within our council support assistants voted to receive their pay over 13 pays, their annual pay is balanced over this period to give 13 equal pays.

Teachers are on an annual salary which is split 12 ways to be equal each month. They are not paid for the full holidays but to avoid breaks in service their contract runs for the full year and unpaid holidays are covered by school closure days.

So many people don't appear to read or understand contracts or payslips. Others just make things up.

As to when schools will opwn again, who knows? It depends how we manage to deal with this virus and if any form of treatment is found. I for one hope sooner rather than later, i miss my class, my kids miss their teachers and friends and we all miss that sense of community.

@scubadive

I’ve just read the gov.uk school teachers pay and conditions and nowhere does it mention 32.5/37.5 hours a week. I’ve screenshot the ‘Specified Working Hours’ for you. It’s there in black and white. I don't feel guilty about anything, but you should for the crap your peddling.

As for everyone else on 37h per week. What rot, my poor husband works 46h + and that is down from the original contract of 48h +. Our local council working week is 36h 1h more than teachers, and trust me most, not all, but most teachersnwork far more than 1h extra a week just like lots of other jobs. There is always someone else that has it harder or worse.

It concerns me that a person who claims to have been responsible for teachers pay, has so little clue as to how it’s calculated.

DBLM

To be fair our payroll are awful, however our school secretary are the best and know or can find out everything. Another group who deserve a pay rise, always sorting out others mistakes.

@scubadive

Teachers are contracted for 195 days per academic year.

They are paid for 195 days of service per academic year.

Their 195 days worth of pay is spread across the 12 months.

When I used to be support staff, my salary was also spread across the 12 months just like a teachers. Oh and guess what, I was only contracted to work 220 days per year.

No teacher on the main pay scale earns 40k. Even the upper pay scale isn't 40k.

You sound like a bitter member of support staff.

@scubadive

I know, I used to manage all the school salaries. Of course you did ...

Oh dear @scubadive
You clearly don't have a clue about Teacher contracted working days/hours, which has been pointed out to you countless times.

195 days contracted per year (full time)
1265 hours of directed time
Nowhere in the teacher pay and condition document does it state the hours per week you're mentioning (I'd love to work those short hours - my average week is around 46 hours per week minimum and I'm part-time)

We ARE NOT PAID FOR THE WEEKS THAT MAKE UP THE SUMMER HOLIDAYS.

We choose to have our pay spread over 12 months for ease of financial planning and budgeting but there is an option to be paid over ten months.

There is NO WAY teachers can roll over any leave. Leave cannot be accrued in teachers (do you suggest our classes teach themselves...?!!)

I highly doubt you were in charge of teacher's pay from the utter crap you're pedalling on here. Maybe some kind of admin assistant with a seriously poor grasp of the way things work...

After two weeks home schooling (I've been working some days too as fall under 'key worker' category) I think teachers are worth their pay! At my daughters school they go above & beyond to do after school clubs / activities etc which I'm sure they'd rather spend time lesson planning there's always a TA still there at 5
It's not just teaching 9-3.30 there's a lot more goes on!

My daughter is in Y6 and there is so much important stuff at the end that requires minimum organisation (leavers church service, assembly, party, transition days to high school, sports day).

I take it that you’re not a teacher, Daffodil?

Lord King has conceded that it will be all but impossible for the lockdown to continue for months and months, it is simply not realistic to expect people to remain inside for so long, and should not even be attempted. The public must be on side for this to work, and the government will have to produce an exit plan in the next couple of days.
So we will soon know what the plan will be for all of us.

Once the peak eases estimated to be early to mid April, we will see the plateau, and by May we will be easing restrictions slowly. There will be no reason to keep schools closed for another four and months plus after that.

Or the government may decide to extend the Easter holidays and then ask all schools to open in July and August, anything is possible!

The resounding feeling I have had reading this thread is how many teaching staff truly hate their jobs, and would happily stay locked inside forever if it meant they didn't need to return to school. It is disturbing to say the very least.
Poor kids

Cornish you are reading the thread to meet your own issues. Have you conceded your school does not have extra insight?