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The virus is NOT airborne - WHO

245 replies

TheReelSlimShady · 28/03/2020 19:53

So the WHO have officially stated that the virus is NOT airborne as has been stated many times :

twitter.com/WHO/status/1243972193169616898

Their recommendation is to keep 1 metre apart , not 2 metres as many countries have been using (including in the UK).

Does this change anything? I guess it may calm the anxiety of picking up the virus when out and about doing exercise if someone gets a bit too close, or in the supermarket.

OP posts:
BeijingBikini · 28/03/2020 23:43

13 years I've been on MN. I've haven't seen anything like the outpouring of vicious, nasty posts as I have in the last two weeks. It's awful.

It's because everyone's going stir crazy in lockdown and has no-one to take all the rage out on, so they resort to personal attacks on total strangers.

freethinker987 · 28/03/2020 23:51

The WHO are just China's sock puppet. Don't believe me? Watch this clip when Bruce Aylwood is asked about Taiwan's response to CV:

mobile.twitter.com/wilfredchan/status/1243887606569590784

Pipandmum · 28/03/2020 23:54

You cough and sneeze your spittle can go 2m. That's why it is 2m.

YgritteSnow · 28/03/2020 23:56

13 years I've been on MN. I've haven't seen anything like the outpouring of vicious, nasty posts as I have in the last two weeks. It's awful.

I've been on here 12 years. I agree with you. People seem to have given themselves permission to behave and speak to others with utter contempt and much of what is said is dehumanising abuse. I find it quite frightening just how much certain people have allowed themselves to devolve and this site is by far the worst place I have seen on line for it. This isn't the MN way Telling It Like It Is or being robust, it's toxic, attacking viciousness and some people seem to be absolutely loving it.

Eckhart · 28/03/2020 23:58

@Roostersmum2

If this isn't airborne then there can be no explanation other than covid19 being transmitted to them by the HCP's treating them or friends/family visiting

Is there any reason why this isn't a valid explanation?

Keepdistance · 29/03/2020 00:16

I think they showed they had a few cases in hospitals already e.g.person who was maybe ic u who had come back from a cruise months ago.
But there are different strains so that was possibly not as contagious.
They never gave clear results from the sentinel testing. We may have had quite a bit circulating but if the people were elderly and not going out much or on public transport and the people nurses etc were young they might not have got that ill.

It's only the stage where it's getting right round a hospital or care home.

Wingedharpy · 29/03/2020 00:21

Is there any evidence anywhere, that having landed on a surface from someones cough or sneeze spittle, that the virus particles can be whipped up again by strong breeze or wind (or hairdryer!) and transported along said surface, albeit for only short distance?
Or, does the make up of the virus mean that once it's landed somewhere, it sticks, limpet like to said surface?
Any official advice anywhere regarding cleaning in an endeavour to keep home virus free?

Keepdistance · 29/03/2020 00:22

It's probably very likely is and eu had it growing slowly since when the guy came back from singapore. He went to France and someone in contact with him went to majorca? He was skiing in France wasn't he so imagine close to Italy border.
And then everyone will have been having visits from these infected cruise ships and planes.
Ours definitely came from Italy but then again that was presumably lots of young for kids and teachers and families who were then we'll enough to asymptomatically spread. But also I imagine people would have gone to Italy skiing etc the week before so likely some were infected there before half term.

SudokuQueen · 29/03/2020 00:27

You cough and sneeze your spittle can go 2m. That's why it is 2m.

MIT think it's 8m. I'd trust them more than bojo. And that research was done 5 years ago.

Honestly WHO might be right and it's not airborne yet. But with how quickly it mutated at the start, I'm not betting on it won't end up airborne.

MrsTerryPratchett · 29/03/2020 00:54

Not interested in dumb conspiracy theories but surgical masks aren’t effective at stopping viruses (they weren’t designed to) because there’s too much space left between the face and the mask. The N95 type masks that are fitted are more effective.

I work somewhere with a lot people coming to see me. We're observing social distancing. Except one worker who comes into my office. Because he is magically protected by his gloves and mask, which he wears all the time. I watched him tell me that this was the case while touching his mask several times and fiddling with it. Gloves I have no idea how long he wears them for but I've never seen him change them. And a bloody great gap between his nose and the mask. He hadn't even pinched it around his nose.

At least I can't see his nose hair any more. It's a ill wind.

Fieldofgreycorn · 29/03/2020 00:59

It’s still spread in water droplets coughed out on to your face etc.

By not airborne they mean not virus aerosol ie. it doesn’t hang in the air like an invisible cloud. It drops straight to the floor or other surface.

LuluJakey1 · 29/03/2020 09:58

wingedharpy The virus is an 'envelope' virus, it is encased in an envelope of 'lipid'. Lipids are not soluble in water but are broken down by the active ingredients in soaps. The Coronavirus 'envelope' has weak bonds which are easily broken down by soap. That is why handwashing is so important and actually preferred -at home- by the PHE to hand sanitisers .
Hand-sanitisers need over 70% alcohol in the product to kill Coronavirus. Many sold do not have that, even if they say they do. Many are cheap imports at the moment being produced as a response to this virus and do not meet required standards or even contain what they say they do in terms of alcohol. Those used in hospitals, Drs etc are fine.
Thorough hand-washing with soap and water for at least 20 seconds is the best form of keeping hands clean of the virus and reducing 'touch/contact' transmission. We should all be doing it, often.

dementedpixie · 29/03/2020 10:05

I thought it was 60% to kill viruses, not 70%

chomalungma · 29/03/2020 10:05

The virus is an 'envelope' virus, it is encased in an envelope of 'lipid'. Lipids are not soluble in water but are broken down by the active ingredients in soaps. The Coronavirus 'envelope' has weak bonds which are easily broken down by soap. That is why handwashing is so important and actually preferred -at home- by the PHE to hand sanitisers

In my 'old life', I used to work as a lab scientist. I have been using this knowledge to help reinforce this message at work. Simple soap to breakdown the lipid membrane.

Viruses are such a simple form of 'life' - entering a cell and using the cell's mechanisms to reproduce itself.

Janemarpling · 29/03/2020 10:09

So can you breath fire it forward to?

Hence the who saying you can breathe it in up to 1m?

MarshaBradyo · 29/03/2020 10:22

It’s still spread in water droplets coughed out on to your face etc.
By not airborne they mean not virus aerosol ie. it doesn’t hang in the air like an invisible cloud. It drops straight to the floor or other surface.

This is interesting but it makes me think firstly no one will warn you they are about to cough so best to stick to the distance and MIT say it does linger for a period of time.

Not sure yet who is right

Dongdingdong · 29/03/2020 10:39

There was research published recently that actually showed that the virus can spread/transmitted from up to 4.5 meters away.

Well if that's really the case then I'd say we're all fucked - unless they can find a vaccine that is.

YogaLite · 29/03/2020 10:47

Virus particle size is A LOT (~thousand times) smaller than say pollen or even anthrax, so if pollen floats in the air and not just drops to the ground under the yree, I can't see why virus would drop 1m away only:

www.engineeringtoolbox.com/particle-sizes-d_934.html

As for science, well, that's based on lab tests not in real world.

YogaLite · 29/03/2020 10:48

Very good point re Japan and removing shoes!

Fieldofgreycorn · 29/03/2020 12:22

Som viruses cannot survive when dried out like pollen. They need to have high humidity or remain in a droplet or its envelope is damaged.

It is important because those paper masks that everyone’s wearing will help stop droplet spray. But if it’s truly airborne you need one of those masks with filters on.

I think it’s too early to know for definite. Do we even know if the original SARS was true aerosol or droplet only?

Gwenhwyfar · 29/03/2020 12:32

"If you pick it up from a surface and you’ve had it, you won’t get it again."

We don't know yet that you can't get it twice. There have been lots of people in Wuhan testing positive then negative then positive again. Could be for various reasons but they're not yet sure that you can't get it twice.

Fieldofgreycorn · 29/03/2020 12:41

Also the Spanish flu killed more in the second wave after an apparent mutation. Does immunity to one provide protection from a slight mutation? So many questions.

Gwenhwyfar · 29/03/2020 12:49

I've heard that there are at least two strains of this thing.

Branster · 29/03/2020 12:56

Yes re washing dogs’ paws, it is advised in a few countries.
There is no official published guidance as regards cleaning for prevention. Because there is not enough real conclusive public scientific analysis or testing let alone proper research. Because everything is so new.
A lot of advice is based on what is known about viruses of similar format and general strict hygiene rules.
Under current circumstances, we are piecing together the bits of info we collect along the way.
It is safe to say, if we do nothing else, we should view Warm soapy water as the holy water for now (not drink it obviously).
We know human skin is a (one of?) vehicle of transmission.
We don’t know enough about other surfaces yet but we should be extra cautious nonetheless. So we don’t know if rubber can pick the virus up and deposit it somewhere else. We don’t know if hair is a viable survival surface, we don’t know much. So we have to assume everything we touch with contaminated bare hands can become contaminated and remain so for some time.
Wash hands, don’t touch face - this message is clear enough.
Clean the bloody phone phone all the bloody time - surely this must be one of the biggest contributing factor based on what we know about transmission.

Coughing, sneezing, spitting, talking, laughing, shouting, singing - all release droplets which can contain active viruses. Again, let’s be over cautious. 2m is not enough.

I can’t remember who asked but based on what has been vehiculated,, there is no evidence to suggest that once the contaminated droplets fall to the ground, they get lifted back into the air by the wind. The water droplets that carry the virus will evaporate, the virus will remain inert on the ground and eventually it’s outer shell will deteriorate from UV light. We don’t know if it can be collected by shoes or paws whilst still active and then moved to a new surface like floor in the house. Theoretically, it can’t fall off the sole of a shoe (if it even gets there in the first place) and the contact between the sole and floor surface is not 100% so I don’t see how something that small can transfer through pressure alone. Unless the shoe picks up a blob of something that contains active viruses and then it deposits this on the kitchen floor and a toddler eats it. Not impossible but not a daily occurrence to be enough to account for the speed of the current spread.
It’s minimal knowledge, minimal advice, we don’t know and nobody knows enough to give clear advice.

Fieldofgreycorn · 29/03/2020 12:57

I didn’t know how reliable this source is but....

eu.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/03/27/scientists-track-coronavirus-strains-mutation/5080571002/

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