Vulnerable children locked up in flats, deep recession, mental health eroded a future generation screwed

[Borkins]

I hope it flattens that curve. I hope it saves lives. Because huge sacrifices are being made.

I work as a youth worker and am petrified on the impact this is already having on my youth group.
Teenagers 13yrs + and the week before we had to all stay home there was so much confusion, worry and misinformation. I had many that I was giving 121 support to. Seeing CAHMS for various things and a whole bunch of other things going on. I'm scared about the kids that have terrible home lives that now have no escape. Hopefully
when this is over we can invest in helping and funding services

Unfortunately funding will reduce even further due to the economy being fucked

Absolutely agree with @Effic.

We, in western rich countries, spend far too much money keeping old people alive for too long with multiple conditions.

Why not build the gas chambers now and get rid of all of those who you deem should not live? The attitude of some people on here is absolutely disgusting.

"I think the title is a tad hysterical, it's just (hopefully) a few months out of their lives. They might actually learn something."

What might vulnerable children learn from this?

it's just (hopefully) a few months out of their lives

If you think the impact of this on vulnerable children will last only a few months you’re living in cloud cuckoo land.

I’m with you OP. It’s very worrying.

On extending life at all costs - my mother had dementia, the last six months of her life were pure misery, she was disorientated, terrified and in constant pain from a pressure sore. It was a blessed relief when she died and I was thankful it was months rather than years.

it's just (hopefully) a few months out of their lives. They might actually learn something.

I'll be amazed if we don't see a massive spike in child abuse, domestic violence and suicide because of this. So plenty of children and adults won't learn anything out of this because they'll be dead. And to all the posters on other threads calling people who dare step outside for a walk selfish, stfu, it will be the only respite some people get.

@kersh33 I don't disagree that in the very short term destroying the economy is the lesser evil to save the nhs. But let's not forget the biggest strain on the nhs before this was the elderly. That's not blame or criticism, simply fact. It's not their fault, the nhs and welfare state weren't set up to provide decades of retirement. But the consequence of successive governments placing the burden on working age people, and disproportionately on the poorest and most vulnerable is an nhs that was already on its knees. (Of course I'm not ignoring all the other factors, simply looking at the discrepancy in contribution versus what they take out between generations)

To those mentioning the ethics of choosing whom to keep alive, we were doing that already. Reducing lifespans because the treatment was deemed too expensive. It's nothing new.

It's not anything like post ww2. Does anyone seriously believe our dc will all have access to a council house for life, or the chance to buy a big family home on the average income? Secure jobs for life? One income families with disposable income? Pensions at the current level? Was anyone actually stupid enough to think that would be the general experience for the next generation even before this?

The one positive that could come from this is looking at the distribution of wealth and how we look after the poorest. Especially as many of those nmw and/ or zero hour contract victims still earning are doing a disproportionate amount of the essential work.

It astounds me that anyone lives such a sheltered life they are completely oblivious to the reality of life for so many in our society. My dc have never experienced anything but privilege, and I'd have hung my head in shame if at 10yrs old they'd expressed such a narrow view of the world as some adults on here.

Matthew Parris in the Times had an interesting article on this a few days ago.

I think that in the future there will need to be an honest review on whether invoking this much economic damage to save people who already have poor health has been worth doing. I suspect that it won’t.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/crashing-the-economy-will-also-cost-lives-l9kz50dqb

What am I doing?
I prepped a month ago so my family and I are not a drain on scarce resources, got all our shit organised, rewrote my will, sorted finances, tried my best
Keeping working
Volunteering with the nhs

You take it too personally. It's a virus. It's spread worldwide. Choices and options are now limited. I'd like to isolate the vulnerable and let life continue as normal now it has spread, rather than fuck over my kids future pointlessly.

I think that in the future there will need to be an honest review on whether invoking this much economic damage to save people who already have poor health has been worth doing. I suspect that it won’t.

This misses the point.

It’s not (really) being done to save people in poor health. It’s being done to avoid mass death of all ages and health states and to avoid the total collapse of the health service.

Just imagine what life would be like with no functioning health service, collapsing infrastructure and bodies piling up on the streets.

These messages are just awful.

What if I was to say who cares about the vulnerable kids? After all, with parents like theirs it’s most unlikely they’ll be remotely productive in society, in fact, they are more likely to be anti social and to end up in prison.

And SEN children, the same. They won’t contribute, will they? So what value do they have? The same as an old person? Maybe less than a diabetic 45 year old still working.

Doesn’t sound very nice, does it?

I'd like to isolate the vulnerable and let life continue as normal now it has spread, rather than fuck over my kids future pointlessly.

Your kid (if over 10) could die of it. Not everyone who dies of it is old or has an underlying health condition. Some are just unlucky.

Like this woman:

www.google.com/amp/s/news.sky.com/story/amp/coronavirus-briton-21-with-no-existing-health-conditions-dies-after-contracting-covid-19-11963451

She had as much chance of dying from it, statistically speaking, as a healthy ten year old.

I am not in anyway advocating disregarding the lives of older people
I just get sick of the black and white thinking of some and the complete lack of acknowledgment of the other side of this.
My Facebook is full of, Just Stay Home it's simple slogans and patronising bullshit.
It's not that simple!
Also all the posts about frontline NHS workers and their sacrifices. Of course I'm grateful to them but they aren't the only ones making sacrifices

The empty vacuous “do anything to save even one life” argument which is being screamed at the moment has many horrible consequences that people are too stupid or shortsighted to consider.

Exactly @Bartlet

Black and white thinking is a curse in this world

Yes Bartlet.

Just think about what happens if ppl don’t stay home though.

Clue - it’s not just older, health-compromised people who will die.

My children are extremely unlikely to die of it. We are only shown those anecdotes to make us compliant. The data is very very clear. Young people are incredibly unlikely to die. It is really really rare. In which case, why am I giving them a lifelong debt with a fucked up future?

Wondering has anyone attempted a QALY-type calculation on this situation?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quality-adjusted_life_year?wprov=sfti1

In which case, why am I giving them a lifelong debt with a fucked up future?

Because what does their future look like when the disease runs rampant, 100s of thousands of people die, including many of their caregivers, the health service collapses, infrastructure breaks down, there’s rioting on the street?

Do you really think the economy will be ticking over nicely in those circs?

Which country has rioting because of this virus? Have I missed something in the news?

Well that apocalyptic position is something that should also be considered when assessing what is the correct response to a pandemic.

This particular one probably won’t be the last and has a relatively low death rate (even in the elderly) and mainly affects already people already in poor health. Can’t see our country coping with a serious one in which large % of healthy people were dying.

I think we need a public announcement about the price some people are paying for this lockdown, and how astonishingly entitled and ungrateful it is to continue to ignore restrictions and take chances in the light of that sacrifice. With a plea for everyone that can help in some way to do so. Whether that's donating the cost of a tin of beans to a food bank, doing a vulnerable neighbours shopping when you do your own, or making substantial donations to help people out of the mess when it's over.

Sitting safely in our nice homes, with our online shopping ordered whilst we criticise some poor bastard for taking their dc on a bus to buy cheap essentials at Aldi when they don't have a choice, or treating it like a holiday and flouting the guidelines for our convenience simply isn't acceptable in light of the cost of this lockdown.