How to deal with friends claiming to be 'key workers'

[McDougal]

Just as the title says, really. I know a lot of admin staff in the NHS. A lot support inpatient services and have a real impact on keeping things moving. Others are PAs to managers who will be making decisions impacting upon patient care, but could do this themselves without a PA forwarding this communication on their behalf.

How do you deal with this? One friend is continuing to take her child to nursery as she's a 'key worker' when her husband is temporarily at home as his job has come to a standstill and I'm struggling to be sympathetic.

I think her husband probably REFUSES to look after his own child so your friend is in a difficult situation. She needs to support her boss at work right now, and if she bails now because her H won't do childcare that will cause more disruption. I think she's doing the right thing on balance. Her H sounds like a dickhead but she can hardly MAKE him do it right now and if she gets LTB this very week then she will need the childcare.

I left an arsehole like this.

Sorry, but I’m a PA in the NHS and frankly I do a lot more - pre-Covid and especially now - than sit on my arse passing on messages.

You say your post isn’t aimed at admin staff but it doesn’t feel like it with the example you’ve given. Your friend saying she has nothing to do isn’t representative of most of us and is her problem not anyone else’s. You didn’t have to bring in her job to make your point.

My husband is self employed and trying to make a living whilst at home with our DD because she’s not nursery age yet. The only “perk” I’m taking is to go to Tesco an hour early on a Sunday so I can buy nappies and snacks for my daughter without selfish morons emptying the shelves before I get there after working all day.

Our DS's school has sent out quite a firm email to parents asking for job titles and contact details, should they wish to continue sending their kids in, stating that they WILL be contacting employers to make sure that the family has no other option than to send their children in. Any two-parent household with a parent at home anyway who are cheeky enough to apply won't even make the first fence before being promptly turned down.

DH is a key worker and has been given a letter to show the school. All key workers will presumably have these. No one will just 'claim' to be one when they are not.

We don't need the school places because I can stay off work. I would rather keep the kids safe at home.

I don't agree with this. The children going to school should be kept to an absolute minimum. Otherwise it defeats the object. My friend works for the nhs in IT and she's been told she can work from home. Her husband is a lorry driver so I assume he has to keep working. She is not sending her kids to school. She's having to organise structured activities to keep them busy but she's going to manage. To me, this highlights the problems in this country. Often both parents have to work, childcare is expensive and up until now, the government has just expected people to muddle through asking grandparents and the like. Now, during a crisis like this, they understandably can't. And shouldn't be expected to. Employers might have to realise that people working from home when kids are there, might not get as much done, but sadly at th moment, everything is affected.

I think her husband probably REFUSES to look after his own child so your friend is in a difficult situation. She needs to support her boss at work right now, and if she bails now because her H won't do childcare that will cause more disruption.

Why are some of these deadbeat dads allowed to get away with this? What would happen if she refused to look after her own child? Maybe I'm being harsh, but if I were in the government and an adult with the capability of looking after his own child refused to do so, preferring to steal emergency childcare that he isn't entitled to, I'd want to send him to do a menial job that's needed for the current effort - unloading food boxes from lorries or similar. It wouldn't be paid in money but in the free childcare that he claims to need, because being at work prevents him from doing it himself.

We could technically ( very technically) have argued DP is a key worker but though we discussed the matter briefly we decided we were not going to do so and the children were best at home.. and so.tht is where they will stay.

On Friday I heard a mother arguing in reception at school. Her husband is definitely a key worker but she's a florist FFS ....School were urging her to keep them home but she was insistent and because of what he does will probably win.

Get a grip OP it's nothing for you to 'deal with'

The whole logic about closing schools is iffy to me in the first place, being as almost no one will practice persistent and stringent isolation with kids in tow. I already know people who have organised playdates and sleep overs with other children, taken their children to playgrounds and seem to think its ok to link up with other family members in different areas of the country.

I think the gov gave into pressure from school unions and petitions from parents over government advisors and health experrts and now everything has shut down and teens have had their exams unnecessarily shafted.

So no reason to get upset. Get more peed at those flouting the rules for SI after insisting everything stop.

And she is a keyworker anyway so

DH is a key worker and has been given a letter to show the school. All key workers will presumably have these. No one will just 'claim' to be one when they are not.

No, they won't get away with that - but as you said yourself, your DH has been given a letter which he could legitimately and properly use if the children didn't have another parent who is available to render his using that letter unnecessary for his family.

I am a key worker by definition and so is dh but I can do it from home at the moment so dd will be at home. I am local authority though and I don't know if mass home working has been as easy for the NHS with their systems.

Also if dd was younger it might not be possible to do this. But what is key work and what is not might indeed become more narrow over time.

Dear god, this virus has provided a lovely excuse for curtain twitchers to be able to tut and judge - and even report their friends and neighbours for incorrect behaviour. You can see how social control works so effectively in communist societies, some people will always be eager to grasp the tiniest opportunity to excercise any petty influence they can. It really is exposing both the decency and unpleasantness that lurks in people.

I get you OP, I work in a special school so all our children have an EHCP. Despite this we have less than 25 children attending next week because most parents prefer to isolate their already vulnerable children at home. Those coming are there because their parents literally have no other way of them being cared for.

Speaking as someone who would be a key worker according to the list available but doesn't feel like one and will be keeping kids off, I really don't think NHS admin staff are the example to make your point here. And she's probably being pretty optimistic to think she'll be doing nothing. You would be better focusing on those who are key workers but have other options they're choosing not to use.

Anecdotally, I've definitely seen more people choosing to use the school childcare when the parent who would otherwise be looking after the kids is the dad. I think different expectations on mothers and fathers during this pandemic is a topic worth discussing.

I don't think your friend is wrong for claiming to be a key worker, because as it stands from the government list, she is one.

I am admin and a "key worker". My DP is working weekdays as usual so to continue to work my usual times I would have to send DC to school.

However, I am not a critical key worker and to support the whole point of closing schools(!) I am taking a reduction in pay by working less less hours during non school hours. So I don't have to send DC to school.

Your friends husband is actually home and their child is still being sent which is not fair imo.

The problem isn't whether she's a critical key worker. It's that they are both abusing the "child care".

Admin staff are just as essential as clinical, clinicians are not going to have time to do their own admin! However if there's one parent at home who can have them they shouldn't go in to school. They are only there for genuine emergency childcare if there are no other options.

Anecdotally, I've definitely seen more people choosing to use the school childcare when the parent who would otherwise be looking after the kids is the dad. I think different expectations on mothers and fathers during this pandemic is a topic worth discussing.

I thoroughly agree. Why do so many dads seem to see their children as an optional extra to their lives and/or a job beneath them to parent them? We should not accept this as the norm - it gives the bad dads the excuse and validation that they require, it's a gross insult to all of the good dads and it generally loads more pressure on mums all around.

So basically it's a gripe about your friend and in particular her partner for not stepping up and looking after their own children. I think you'll find that in any system people will find a way to unfairly take advantage or cheat.

The unpleasantness and resentment coming through in your posts though is all to do with the fact that managers still have PAs and you don't think they need them etc etc Unless your role is to restructure and you're in charge of organisational change of the NHS, I don't think you're using your time wisely during this crisis.

I work in local government. We are all deemed to be key workers (although I am working from home). My employer said that although they class us as key workers it is up to the childcare setting whether they take us or not (not sending my lo in even though we are both key workers).

I’m in a professional role, but I very much expect to be redeployed either to county level or another internal service to support them. I imagine our admin staff and pa’s will be in a similar position.

It’s easy to be on the outside and judge what people do in their job on a daily basis, but unless you actually do that job, you have no idea.

I think the gov gave into pressure from school unions and petitions from parents over government advisors and health experrts and now everything has shut down and teens have had their exams unnecessarily shafted.

Rather than following scientific advice and working out the likely scenario of deaths using Italy's example? No, I'm sure it was all the fault of the workshy teachers and blobby unions, and we should just keep calm and carry on, it's just like a bad cold, etc, etc. Really have heard it all now.

If there is an unpleasant tone to my posts, this is due to frustration at the complaints from my friend at having to go in when she doesn't feel she's needed but still being happy to make use of a space in school whilst also having a husband at home. Whether her role is different tomorrow isn't known yet but I based my OP on her comments yesterday.

Again, I worked in the NHS for a long time, some of that in admin roles, and am absolutely not saying that what they do isn't essential to keep the NHS functioning.

The crux of the matter for me is that schools have closed other than for children of key workers or to those children with an EHCP/social work involvement. Surely anyone that doesn't absolutely need to send their kids shouldn't be? For the sake of their own children's health as well as that of the other children there and the school staff who are also making an incredible sacrifice?

OP, I am an Executive Assistant with an NHS care provider.

As you will probably know, all NHS organisations are now mobilising their emergency planning teams/control centres/command centres etc. I am supporting our operational team with this work. Our work has completely changed over the last two weeks, and most of our 'business as usual', meetings etc have been stood down. We are only doing things that are related to patient safety and governance.

The operational team are not working from home, that would not be possible. They wouldn't be able to access the NHS systems that are needed for one thing. Sometimes a group of people need to be together to get things done quickly. Decisions have to be made in an instant, and you don't get that done working at home.Think of it as being like a crime investigation, like you will have seen on TV. The pace is frenetic!

A member of the admin support is always there to facilitate requests quickly, arrange the many conference calls, webex's and lots of other things. There is a lot of demand on us PA's to get things done quickly and find solutions. I personally have to make decisions (not patient related obviously) that are higher than my grade and keep things moving along. I am coordinating recruitment of additional key workers, including medical, and I am trying to turn this round within a a really short timescale whilst also mindful that we go through the correct procedures to ensure that we keep patients safe. In addition, we try and do little things, just making a drink or popping out to get a sandwich, for those that just don't get a break.

I would say our team need their PA's more than ever at this moment, and I know that they consider me to a key worker. They are working so hard to respond to this crisis, and I am really proud to work with them.

Thank you, NHSEA. Your post has really given an insight into what goes into helping the NHS function. I hope you don't feel that my post was targeting support staff as that genuinely wasn't my intention. Just venting some frustration at what I saw as taking advantage of a school place when not necessarily needed.

In times like this, it's too easy to get angry at others so thank you for being so measured in your response.

Hi McDougal. Thanks, no offence taken 😁. These are very strange times. My DC are grown up now, but don’t agree with people taking advantage of key worker childcare

There’s a shrill, shaming quality to the discourse about this, and, online at least, people are not coming together. They are instead having a lovely time “calling people out” (yuck) and endlessly discussing and nitpicking at what people are doing. It really won’t be long before the “reporting” starts. Luckily our government seems more benign than its people at the moment.

Our school cheerfully told everyone they would be open for business as normal Monday and just bring your kids along if you needed to. There were no diktats or questioning or teachers crying about potentially being exposed. We had a very sensible and pragmatic email about keeping kids at home wherever possible but if you couldn’t, the school were there to support you.

I’m a key worker, front line. We now have a COVID ward in my department and I will be rotated there from next week. DH wfh, not a keyworker but paying all the bills with his work (s/e, business owner). He can’t do that with two smalls so they’ll be going to school whilst I work. Otherwise we will lose our home, our savings will be gone, and when life goes back to normal we will be utterly fucked. If that’s a problem for anyone, if anyone seriously expects me to nurse COVID patients for a year and then be homeless with no money and take years to recover from it, then please fuck off. It would make vastly more sense for my family for me to leave work to let DH work and that’s what I’ll be doing if the Government stops the childcare.

Attending school is not free childcare, in any shape or form.