Rishi Sunak speech....

[unhappyclap]

What are people thinking so far?

@AlsoHuman Really? I'm surprised they're not holding them to restrictions also.

Small mercy I suppose.

Havent rtft but fwiw these are my thoughts.

I'm an employer and an employee and have self employed subcontractors on my books.

I can pay 80% of employee wages at least. It's 80% more than what I could have paid this morning.

My subcontractors can claim universal credit at a rate a bit more than usual and don't have to prove they have some work to be classed as self employed.

I don't have to pay my VAT bill. Or PAYE bill. I can use this for wages and square up later.

If I was self employed and had a tax liability due I have an extension on this until jan 2021.

Self employed are never ever going to be happy if they can't work. It's one of the drawbacks but compensated for in different ways and you should make your own arrangements for not being able to work whatever the reason. It's crap but that's how it is.

Also impressed with him. And begrudgingly with boris as well and I say that as a labour voter. No one would want that job right now, not in a million years.

"Why would your employer be entitled to claim 80 percent wages for you when you are not eligible for UK benefits and you are not a UK citizen??"

It seems to be a grant to the employer so they can keep their staff

It is not given to the individual

So, the employer should be able to receive this money for all employess, regardless of benefit entitlement

I live in Germany, where Frau Merkel announced a similar package - Sunak may have copied a lot of those ideas !

Workers - e.g. Brits - get paid regardless of whether they have yet obtained permanent right to remain

iirc, Merkel also announced special help for self-employed and small businesses, depending on the their last tax accounts

This is not my HA but have found it via a link on FB

www.myclarionhousing.com/about-us/contact_us/servicestatus/

Paying rent
Clarion still has to collect rent during the coronavirus emergency, but we can provide you with some guidance and support on the options that are available to you. If you would like to discuss this with a member of the Customer Accounts team, please complete this form and a team member will be in contact

There will be no evictions in Clarion homes for non-payment of rent during the coronavirus emergency, but we will return to business as usual after it has ended

"You should make your own arrangements, thats how it is"

Precisely how in the fuck do you make arrangements suitable for a fucking pandemic when insurance companies wont even pay out for it exactly, not a single sole trader is going to have 6 months or more of running and living costs. The astounding ignorance is getting mind numbing.

To pp claiming the grumbling is because people are against Tories:

In fact, the self-employed and small business people are a key voting group for them
but, Tory loyalty or not, it is natural to lash out when facing ruin

However, when you choose the freedom and potentially greater income of self-employment, there is generally a higher risk and usually also associated financial commitments

imo, as a floating centrist (retired in Germany)
Sunak had a brilliant day and spoke well, did all that could reasonably be expected of him

Looks a future PM, miles better than the current one, anyway

and yes, when Tories turn to full-on socialist policies, you know it is a real emergency
The massive bill will be paid by borrowing and maybe also higher taxes later

@R1R2 I am not ignorant. We (me and my husband) have been mainly self employed all my husbands career and probably half of mine. We are paid more because we are self employed and manage money accordingly. We will manage with a combination of savings, credit cards and cutting back for about 2 months. Then probably another few months with either support for the business via the government or benefits. Longer if necessary.

If you are self employed you need to understand that at any minute things can change. No one could predict covid 19 or insure against it but you can plan for short term losses. If you can't afford to donthat you cant afford to be self employed.

We learnt the hard way. Never rely on next weeks wage to pay next weeks bills.

It's fucking shit and I do understand why people are struggling and I hope that everyone manages but no government will give 80% of the self employed salary unless that salary is small. But they are making benefits available to the self employed when they wouldn't have been before.

my feeling is that further adjustments may be made, With the self employed they may look at the previous years tax returrns ultimately (and if youve been fiddling your books you may now find it was to your cost!!) and they may look at the agricultural businesses who pay not rates for the grants if they gain a certain amount for leisure and tourism. You wont know where the holes are until you start trying to float a policy, and given this is all being put together with the chancellor and loud shouting lobbyists, things may change. dont forget unions have been involved, and they mainly represent the employed, not the self employed. Now theyve secured a decent deal some of the other voices may get heard. Well I hope so

I'm thinking the country can't afford this and they must be planning to print money like it's going out of fashion...

I was self-employed in my early 30s

I knew then that if for some reason I couldn't work for several months, I could be ruined
e.g. serious illness, car accident or recession - the last of which I couldn't insure against

I took that risk for a few years,
but then during a recession, I reluctantly decided to became a regular employee

The state can't always afford to support every small business or self-employed person
Being self-employed is always a gamble and the freedom it brings comes at the cost of some security and employment rights

It was good from Rishi.

80 percent of wages will definitely help in the sense that many employers will be able to keep their staff and that is better than letting everyone go which would be chaotic.

However, more help is needed for the self employed as well. They work incredibly hard and deserve 80 percent of pay as well.

There was a debate this week about Universal Basic Income. I feel like this is much needed in the near future as well. Considering that many people in 10 years will lose their jobs to automation.

@alsohuman

There are no words. Could you change your name to something accurate?

In Germany, they decided to look at the previous years accounts, for self-employed and small businesses
or even the previous 3 months for a new start-up

However, it adds even more billions to the bill
So it is a matter for each government to decide what they can afford, or want to do.

Every government would prioritise employees over self-employed, if there is limited money available

Reminder: that 80% of pay is limited to a maximum of £2,500 per month

So some employees will be suffering from reduced income
and some self-employed would suffer too, even if they did get that

The money is to pay basic bills, which don't include all that is involved in keeping a business afloat,
or to support a very high mortgage & outgoings

There's a very, very large gap between £2500 and £400.

It's very easy to 'get by' and pay 'basic bills' on £2500 - not so easy to do it on £400.

£400 doesn't scratch the surface, it's insulting to those who work their bollocks off to be told to go to the back to the UC queue for £400 a month when others are being handed £2000.

@Bigchoc - ah, that's OK then. I'll try to start thinking more positively about £480 per month (single person, no dependent UC benefit) that will cover all bills, my rent excess here in London, council tax and food for a month easily and I hadn't realised.
I will not begrudge any couples who will be getting £5000 per month for the next 3 months. Cheers to them 🍸I'll lift a glass of free tap water to them 🍾

It’s the same as SMP I’ve never had a proper maternity cover at full pay just the £400 or whatever it is. It’s the security you get with the former.

The government have put measures in place that have taken away all of my dads income.

Whilst I’m sorry for your father’s troubles, would you have preferred the public health measures NOT to have been put in place to protect the incomes of cab drivers?

It’s a global pandemic. The government are doing the right thing.

@Iamthewombat At no point have I said they shouldn't have implemented the measures.

They do, however, need to properly recompense the people they've left in the lurch. It's as simple as that.
Guaranteeing financial security for one group of people but not another is completely wrong; they're all in the same bloody situation! How can you justify a £1600 pm disparity per person?

You can't. It's unjustifiable.

Rushi is amazing! I feel so reassured. Self employed, sit tight & hold on. Monday he will announce what he will do for self employed. He will come through for you, just give him time. They’ve had very little time to get through all of this, he will come up with something he won’t give 80% salary to working & hardly anything to self employed

Reminder: that 80% of pay is limited to a maximum of £2,500 per month
So some employees will be suffering from reduced income.

Employers can also top up employees’ salaries over and above the £2500 if they so wish.

@TickTockTickTockT He just has though. They were the measures announced today.

He boosted UC by 1000/per year and point the SE in that direction.

Sold down the river.

They do, however, need to properly recompense the people they've left in the lurch.

Who are the ‘they’ who have left people in the lurch? Not the government. You can blame nature if you like, or the Chinese people who brought infected animals to the market, or the bats who are thought to have originated the disease, but you cannot say that the government have left self-employed people ‘in the lurch’. They haven’t.

I’ve been self-employed in the past, working through my own limited company. I knew that under certain circumstances I wouldn’t be eligible for the same benefits as an employee: no sick pay, no holiday pay, could be stood down by clients at short notice. It is part of the deal. It would not have been fair to expect taxpayers to compensate me for the majority of my income if I couldn’t work. The package on offer is enough to keep people housed and fed. I wouldn’t have expected more than that.

Employers can also top up employees’ salaries over and above the £2500 if they so wish

Yeah right, that’s going to happen, isn’t it?

If you would otherwise have been laid off because your employer couldn’t afford to keep you on otherwise I imagine you’d be glad of 80% of your salary whilst the cafe or restaurant or wherever you normally work is closed.