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The 'Positive Mental Health' Corona virus thread

999 replies

RapidRainbow · 13/02/2020 10:42

There are a lot of posts of people worrying. I thought it could be helpful to share positive and assuring information in one thread.

For me, the most reassuring thing so far is the fact that of approx. 1500 people in the UK suspected to have and tested for CV have come back as negative.

OP posts:
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DoubleTweenQueen · 28/02/2020 11:17

I just hate that the press are exploiting al the lovely gory details, and that many people will be worrying themselves sick - literally. I think the measures being taken and that may potentially be taken if we get transmission in this country, are reasonable and sensible.

We can’t always protect ourselves from illness and accident, but we can’t live our lives in fear.

RapidRainbow · 28/02/2020 13:38

This taken from a BBC article today.

"It is important to realise the UK does not have an "outbreak" of the coronavirus.

We are dealing with the ripples of large, uncontrolled outbreaks elsewhere in the world.

The cases announced on Thursday and Friday were all people who had been infected abroad before travelling to the UK - the virus is not spreading from person to person here.

It means the UK's strategy remains one of containment - isolate any infected people and perform rigorous detective work to find and test anyone they come into contact with.

Further cases are almost inevitable for as long as outbreaks in China, Italy, Iran, South Korea and Japan continue."

OP posts:
RapidRainbow · 28/02/2020 13:42

And I had this article suggested to me by a search engine (I wasn't looking for CV info!) and it's got a good message about the likely real impact -

Subscribe

Health

You’re Likely to Get the Coronavirus

Most cases are not life-threatening, which is also what makes the virus a historic challenge to contain.

James Hamblin February 24, 2020

Subscribe for less than $1 per week

Xiao Yijiu / Xinhua / eyevine / Redux

Updated at 7:43 p.m. on Feb. 25, 2020.

In May 1997, a 3-year-old boy developed what at first seemed like the common cold. When his symptoms—sore throat, fever, and cough—persisted for six days, he was taken to the Queen Elizabeth Hospital in Hong Kong. There his cough worsened, and he began gasping for air. Despite intensive care, the boy died.

Puzzled by his rapid deterioration, doctors sent a sample of the boy’s sputum to China’s Department of Health. But the standard testing protocol couldn’t fully identify the virus that had caused the disease. The chief virologist decided to ship some of the sample to colleagues in other countries.

At the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention in Atlanta, the boy’s sputum sat for a month, waiting for its turn in a slow process of antibody-matching analysis. The results eventually confirmed that this was a variant of influenza, the virus that has killed more people than any in history. But this type had never before been seen in humans. It was H5N1, or “avian flu,” discovered two decades prior, but known only to infect birds.

By then, it was August. Scientists sent distress signals around the world. The Chinese government swiftly killed 1.5 million chickens (over the protests of chicken farmers). Further cases were closely monitored and isolated. By the end of the year there were 18 known cases in humans. Six people died.

This was seen as a successful global response, and the virus was not seen again for years. In part, containment was possible because the disease was so severe: Those who got it became manifestly, extremely ill. H5N1 has a fatality rate of about 60 percent—if you get it, you’re likely to die. Yet since 2003, the virus has killed only 455 people. The much “milder” flu viruses, by contrast, kill fewer than 0.1 percent of people they infect, on average, but are responsible for hundreds of thousands of deaths every year.
Severe illness caused by viruses such as H5N1 also means that infected people can be identified and isolated, or that they died quickly. They do not walk around feeling just a little under the weather, seeding the virus. The new coronavirus (known technically as SARS-CoV-2) that has been spreading around the world can cause a respiratory illness that can be severe. The disease (known as COVID-19) seems to have a fatality rate of less than 2 percent—exponentially lower than most outbreaks that make global news. The virus has raised alarm not despite that low fatality rate, but because of it.

Coronaviruses are similar to influenza viruses in that they both contain single strands of RNA.* Four coronaviruses commonly infect humans, causing colds. These are believed to have evolved in humans to maximize their own spread—which means sickening, but not killing, people. By contrast, the two prior novel coronavirus outbreaks—SARS (severe acute respiratory syndrome) and MERS (Middle East respiratory syndrome, named for where the first outbreak occurred)—were picked up from animals, as was H5N1. These diseases were highly fatal to humans. If there were mild or asymptomatic cases, they were extremely few. Had there been more of them, the disease would have spread widely. Ultimately, SARS and MERS each killed fewer than 1,000 people.

COVID-19 is already reported to have killed more than twice that number. With its potent mix of characteristics, this virus is unlike most that capture popular attention: It is deadly, but not too deadly. It makes people sick, but not in predictable, uniquely identifiable ways. Last week, 14 Americans tested positive on a cruise ship in Japan despite feeling fine—the new virus may be most dangerous because, it seems, it may sometimes cause no symptoms at all.

The world has responded with unprecedented speed and mobilization of resources. The new virus was identified extremely quickly. Its genome was sequenced by Chinese scientists and shared around the world within weeks. The global scientific community has shared genomic and clinical data at unprecedented rates. Work on a vaccine is well under way. The Chinese government enacted dramatic containment measures, and the World Health Organization declared an emergency of international concern. All of this happened in a fraction of the time it took to even identify H5N1 in 1997. And yet the outbreak continues to spread.

The Harvard epidemiology professor Marc Lipsitch is exacting in his diction, even for an epidemiologist. Twice in our conversation he started to say something, then paused and said, “Actually, let me start again.” So it’s striking when one of the points he wanted to get exactly right was this: “I think the likely outcome is that it will ultimately not be containable.”

Containment is the first step in responding to any outbreak. In the case of COVID-19, the possibility (however implausible) of preventing a pandemic seemed to play out in a matter of days. Starting in January, China began cordoning off progressively larger areas, radiating outward from the city of Wuhan and eventually encapsulating some 100 million people. People were barred from leaving home, and lectured by drones if they were caught outside. Nonetheless, the virus has now been found in 24 countries.

Despite the apparent ineffectiveness of such measures—relative to their inordinate social and economic cost, at least—the crackdown continues to escalate. Under political pressure to “stop” the virus, last Thursday the Chinese government announced that officials in Hubei province would be going door-to-door, testing people for fevers and looking for signs of illness, then sending all potential cases to quarantine camps. But even with the ideal containment, the virus’s spread may have been inevitable. Testing people who are already extremely sick is an imperfect strategy if people can spread the virus without even feeling bad enough to stay home from work.

Lipsitch predicts that within the coming year, some 40 to 70 percent of people around the world will be infected with the virus that causes COVID-19. But, he clarifies emphatically, this does not mean that all will have severe illnesses. “It’s likely that many will have mild disease, or may be asymptomatic,” he said. As with influenza, which is often life-threatening to people with chronic health conditions and of older age, most cases pass without medical care. (Overall, about 14 percent of people with influenza have no symptoms.)

Lipsitch is far from alone in his belief that this virus will continue to spread widely. The emerging consensus among epidemiologists is that the most likely outcome of this outbreak is a new seasonal disease—a fifth “endemic” coronavirus. With the other four, people are not known to develop long-lasting immunity. If this one follows suit, and if the disease continues to be as severe as it is now, “cold and flu season” could become “cold and flu and COVID-19 season.”

At this point, it is not even known how many people are infected. As of Sunday, there have been 35 confirmed cases in the U.S., according to the World Health Organization. But Lipsitch’s “very, very rough” estimate when we spoke a week ago (banking on “multiple assumptions piled on top of each other,” he said) was that 100 or 200 people in the U.S. were infected. That’s all it would take to seed the disease widely. The rate of spread would depend on how contagious the disease is in milder cases. On Friday, Chinese scientists reported in the medical journal JAMA an apparent case of asymptomatic spread of the virus, from a patient with a normal chest CT scan. The researchers concluded with stolid understatement that if this finding is not a bizarre abnormality, “the prevention of COVID-19 infection would prove challenging.”

Even if Lipitch’ estimates were off by orders of magnitude, they wouldn’t likely change the overall prognosis. “Two hundred cases of a flu-like illness during flu season—when you’re not testing for it—is very hard to detect,” Lipsitch said. “But it would be really good to know sooner rather than later whether that’s correct, or whether we’ve miscalculated something. The only way to do that is by testing.”

Originally, doctors in the U.S. were advised not to test people unless they had been to China or had contact with someone who had been diagnosed with the disease. Within the past two weeks, the CDC said it would start screening people in five U.S. cities, in an effort to give some idea of how many cases are actually out there. But tests are still not widely available. As of Friday, the Association of Public Health Laboratories said that only California, Nebraska, and Illinois had the capacity to test people for the virus.

With so little data, prognosis is difficult. But the concern that this virus is beyond containment—that it will be with us indefinitely—is nowhere more apparent than in the global race to find a vaccine, one of the clearest strategies for saving lives in the years to come.

Over the past month, stock prices of a small pharmaceutical company named Inovio have more than doubled. In mid-January, it reportedly discovered a vaccine for the new coronavirus. This claim has been repeated in many news reports, even though it is technically inaccurate. Like other drugs, vaccines require a long testing process to see whether they indeed protect people from disease, and do so safely. What this company—and others—has done is copy a bit of the virus’s RNA that one day could prove to work as a vaccine. It’s a promising first step, but to call it a discovery is like announcing a new surgery after sharpening a scalpel.

Though genetic sequencing is now extremely fast, making vaccines is as much art as science. It involves finding a viral sequence that will reliably cause a protective immune-system memory but not trigger an acute inflammatory response that would itself cause symptoms. (While the influenza vaccine cannot cause the flu, the CDC warns that it can cause “flu-like symptoms.”) Hitting this sweet spot requires testing, first in lab models and animals, and eventually in people. One does not simply ship a billion viral gene fragments around the world to be injected into everyone at the moment of discovery.

Inovio is far from the only small biotech company venturing to create a sequence that strikes that balance. Others include Moderna, CureVac, and Novavax. Academic researchers are also on the case, at Imperial College London and other universities, as are federal scientists in several countries, including at the U.S. National Institutes of Health. Anthony Fauci, the head of the NIH’s National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, wrote in JAMA in January that the agency was working at historic speed to find a vaccine. During the SARS outbreak in 2003, researchers moved from obtaining the genomic sequence of the virus and into a phase 1 clinical trial of a vaccine in 20 months. Fauci wrote that his team has since compressed that timeline to just over three months for other viruses, and for the new coronavirus, “they hope to move even faster.”

New models have sprung up in recent years, too, that promise to speed up vaccine development. One is the Coalition for Epidemic Preparedness (CEPI), which was launched in Norway in 2017 to finance and coordinate the development of new vaccines. Its founders include the governments of Norway and India, the Wellcome Trust, and the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation. The group’s money is now flowing to Inovio and other small biotech start-ups, encouraging them to get into the risky business of vaccine development. The group’s CEO, Richard Hatchett, shares Fauci’s basic timeline vision—a COVID-19 vaccine ready for early phases of safety testing in April. If all goes well, by late summer testing could begin to see if the vaccine actually prevents disease.

Read: Coronavirus is devastating Chinese tourism

Overall, if all pieces fell into place, Hatchett guesses it would be 12 to 18 months before an initial product could be deemed safe and effective. That timeline represents “a vast acceleration compared with the history of vaccine development,” he told me. But it’s also unprecedentedly ambitious. “Even to propose such a timeline at this point must be regarded as hugely aspirational,” he added.

Even if that idyllic year-long projection were realized, the novel product would still require manufacturing and distribution. “An important consideration is whether the underlying approach can then be scaled to produce millions or even billions of doses in coming years,” Hatchett said. Especially in an ongoing emergency, if borders closed and supply chains broke, distribution and production could prove difficult purely as a matter of logistics.

Fauci’s initial optimism seemed to wane, too. Last week he said that the process of vaccine development was proving “very difficult and very frustrating.” For all the advances in basic science, the process cannot proceed to an actual vaccine without extensive clinical testing, which requires manufacturing many vaccines and meticulously monitoring outcomes in people. The process could ultimately cost hundreds of millions of dollars—money that the NIH, start-ups, and universities don’t have. Nor do they have the production facilities and technology to mass-manufacture and distribute a vaccine.

Production of vaccines has long been contingent on investment from one of the handful of giant global pharmaceutical companies. At the Aspen Institute last week, Fauci lamented that none had yet to “step up” and commit to making the vaccine. “Companies that have the skill to be able to do it are not going to just sit around and have a warm facility, ready to go for when you need it,” he said. Even if they did, taking on a new product like this could mean massive losses, especially if the demand faded or if people, for complex reasons, chose not to use the product.

Making vaccines is so difficult, cost intensive, and high risk that in the 1980s, when drug companies began to incur legal costs over alleged harms caused by vaccines, many opted to simply quit making them. To incentivize the pharmaceutical industry to keep producing these vital products, the U.S. government offered to indemnify anyone claiming to have been harmed by a vaccine. The arrangement continues to this day. Even still, drug companies have generally found it more profitable to invest in the daily-use drugs for chronic conditions. And coronaviruses could present a particular challenge in that at their core they, like influenza viruses, contain single strands of RNA. This viral class is likely to mutate, and vaccines may need to be in constant development, as with the flu.

“If we’re putting all our hopes in a vaccine as being the answer, we’re in trouble,” Jason Schwartz, an assistant professor at Yale School of Public Health who studies vaccine policy, told me. The best-case scenario, as Schwartz sees it, is the one in which this vaccine development happens far too late to make a difference for the current outbreak. The real problem is that preparedness for this outbreak should have been happening for the past decade, ever since SARS. “Had we not set the SARS-vaccine-research program aside, we would have had a lot more of this foundational work that we could apply to this new, closely related virus, ” he said. But, as with Ebola, government funding and pharmaceutical-industry development evaporated once the sense of emergency lifted. “Some very early research ended up sitting on a shelf because that outbreak ended before a vaccine needed to be aggressively developed.”

On Saturday, Politico reported that the White House is preparing to ask Congress for $1 billion in emergency funding for a coronavirus response. This request, if it materialized, would come in the same month in which President Donald Trump released a new budget proposal that would cut key elements of pandemic preparedness—funding for the CDC, the NIH, and foreign aid.

Read: It’s suddenly cold out. Am I going to get sick?

These long-term government investments matter because creating vaccines, antiviral medications, and other vital tools requires decades of serious investment, even when demand is low. Market-based economies often struggle to develop a product for which there is no immediate demand and to distribute products to the places they’re needed. CEPI has been touted as a promising model to incentivize vaccine development before an emergency begins, but the group also has skeptics. Last year, Doctors Without Borders wrote a scathing open letter, saying the model didn’t ensure equitable distribution or affordability. CEPI subsequently updated its policies to forefront equitable access, and Manuel Martin, a medical innovation and access adviser with Doctors Without Borders, told me last week that he’s now cautiously optimistic. “CEPI is absolutely promising, and we really hope that it will be successful in producing a novel vaccine,” he said. But he and his colleagues are “waiting to see how CEPI’s commitments play out in practice.”

These considerations matter not simply as humanitarian benevolence, but also as effective policy. Getting vaccines and other resources to the places where they will be most helpful is essential to stop disease from spreading widely. During the 2009 H1N1 flu outbreak, for example, Mexico was hit hard. In Australia, which was not, the government prevented exports by its pharmaceutical industry until it filled the Australian government’s order for vaccines. The more the world enters lockdown and self-preservation mode, the more difficult it could be to soberly assess risk and effectively distribute tools, from vaccines and respirator masks to food and hand soap.

Italy, Iran, and South Korea are now among the countries reporting quickly growing numbers of detected COVID-19 infections. Many countries have responded with containment attempts, despite the dubious efficacy and inherent harms of China’s historically unprecedented crackdown. Certain containment measures will be appropriate, but widely banning travel, closing down cities, and hoarding resources are not realistic solutions for an outbreak that lasts years. All of these measures come with risks of their own. Ultimately some pandemic responses will require opening borders, not closing them. At some point the expectation that any area will escape effects of COVID-19 must be abandoned: The disease must be seen as everyone’s problem.

James Hamblin, MD, is a staff writer at The Atlantic.

OP posts:
RapidRainbow · 28/02/2020 13:53

I meant to post the first parts of that article that explain about the actual severity of it and why it spreads quickly. I don't recommend reading beyond that, it's got a contradictory tone talking about a vaccine to save lives not been available for a while written just after explaining why a vaccine isn't necessarily needed!!!

OP posts:
AskingQuestionsAllTheTime · 28/02/2020 14:32

For what it is worth, the World Service this morning was reporting that in China, for the tenth day running, more people who had tested positive had recovered, tested negative and been sent home than there had been new cases testing positive.

And the only case in the African continent (Nigeria, as if they didn't have enough on their plate) was someone who had returned from Italy and been isolated.

SubordinateThatClause · 28/02/2020 16:41

Glad I've found this thread. My mental health is really not good at the moment - I'm totally engulfed by a feeling of impending gloom.

brainfogg · 28/02/2020 19:00

Thank you @DoubleTweenQueen for your amazing and detailed post, that’s been very helpful to read. When you talk about the level of viral particles at the time of infection do you mean how much of the actual virus goes into someone? So for example a nurse or doctor treating primarily coronavirus patients will have a larger number of particles to deal with than someone who interacts with their friend for half an hour over a cup of tea and catches it that way?

Thank you @RapidRainbow for the article, I’ve read about half and am going to read more soon as want to take in the details properly and I’m not feeling too sharp mentally today.

DobbyTheHouseElk · 28/02/2020 19:09

I’ve been out doing various things child related today. Everyone else seems to be normal and going about daily business without worrying. Why am I feeling so awful about this?

I was pregnant during the swine flu thing and was so relaxed about it. It didn’t bother me at all. During the SARS thing I flew long haul and saw people in masks and again I wasn’t concerned. Maybe it’s the 24/7 news and internet I didn’t have access to in those times.

brainfogg · 28/02/2020 19:16

I don’t know either Dobby, it’s very strange isn’t it. I feel the same as you when going to shops and various other public places, everyone seems so chilled out and it really is like there’s nothing untoward going on at all 🤷🏼‍♀️ I think the constant news access isn’t helping for sure. And we live in a country where everyone expects their lives not to be disrupted, so they cling on til the last possible moment. We feel we have a right to travel when we want, do access the NHS if we need to. Not saying we shouldn’t expect to have those rights but maybe we take them for granted and when they are threatened it unnerves is.

Sorry I’m just musing about it and thinking out loud. Please just know you’re not alone ❤️

DobbyTheHouseElk · 28/02/2020 19:51

@brainfogg thanks. I normally love this time of year..the anticipation of spring and flowers emerging from the cold earth.

This time I’m so wracked with worry. I had pleurisy a few years ago and it was scary. Took so long to recover from it.

I’m watching too many news reports. Today I couldn’t get away from the news it was amplified everywhere I went. Wish I could be more relaxed like other people.

DoubleTweenQueen · 28/02/2020 21:13

brainfogg - I am not a medic, but basically yes. A patient in critical condition, at the height of their infection will be shedding very large amounts of virus. If someone is then infected with a high titre/large number of particles, which then infect cells in the body to replicate and cause those cells damage as the new virus is produced from them - this will be a more significant event to the body than a much lower dose at infection. I feel the body’s immune system may have greater chance of keeping the latter in check. Particularly thinking of the overwhelming early situation in Wuhan compared to our benefit of having some prior awareness. I feel we are very fortunate to be forewarned. Does that make sense? I may well be wrong, but that’s how DH & I are viewing it.
I also popped on to share this: www.gilead.com/news-and-press/press-room/press-releases/2020/2/gilead-sciences-initiates-two-phase-3-studies-of-investigational-antiviral-remdesivir-for-the-treatment-of-covid-19?fbclid=IwAR26dvz5AWDb4ewEaEvQr-LL9QFtt0WLh956wn1XKJ-222NI8j0UOHpmrBA There are lots of good people working tirelessly on this.

  • and also to say please try to keep away from the internet and the press on this, and only go to sensible sites - WHO, PHE, and reputable science news/journals. I am shocked at some of the purely sensationalist pseudoscience being published! It is criminal - or should be! Be aware, take sensible steps, look forward to Spring X (DH had swine-flu when it was about, with subsequent pneumonia, however with awareness it was caught early and although took a few months to be completely better, he was. I didn’t get it at all :)
SubordinateThatClause · 28/02/2020 21:58

Thank you* @DoubleTweenQueen*. I really need to get a grip of myself and you talk a lot of senseSmile.

brainfogg · 28/02/2020 22:05

@DobbyTheHouseElk it’s a beautiful time of year isn’t it? Nature is gorgeous and actually I was thinking that might help to be out in it. I’ve only been out 3 times in the past week and that was for work, I’ve had to ask DH to do all shopping as I just can’t cope with supermarkets. Luckily he’s very understanding about my anxiety and takes me seriously when I pass info to him and ask him to wash his hands a lot!
Oh gosh if you had pleurisy I can totally understand you being worried, I’ve heard that’s not nice at all. Maybe we should try to limit ourselves with the news? Easier said than done.

Thank you so much @DoubleTweenQueen I’ve found your posts very interesting and calming. It also makes me feel so incredibly humbled and grateful to any medical staff all over the world for what they do. I’ve always had a high appreciation and admiration for HCP who work on the frontline but this situation has made me even more in awe. I think I’d want to run and hide if I was a nurse or doctor in Wuhan when this all exploded, and I think they are incredible for staying and helping others.
Thanks for the article too Flowers

DoubleTweenQueen · 29/02/2020 10:29

I suffer with anxiety too, as does our younger daughter. I find the current concerns are highlighting to me how lucky we are and am feeling a heightened sense of appreciation of the small things. The snow flurries the other morning made the place look so beautiful (gone by lunchtime!) and a barn owl flew across the road just in front of me in the early morning sunshine which was very special :)

fuckingterrified · 29/02/2020 10:36

Just wanted to say thank you to @DoubleTweenQueen. Like most people I am getting very anxious and making myself worse by following the news closely. Your posts are reassuring and I'm going to try to step away from the news and internet.

DoubleTweenQueen · 29/02/2020 11:05

I am keeping away from most news reports, apart from R4. I am sceptical that all agencies will be using this opportunity to rake in advertising revenue through clickbait: the tabloids are particularly disgusting, but they are all making the most of it - including the FT.
I also take with a pinch of salt what some scientists say or are quoted to say - bearing in mind it's a good opportunity to raise a profile which may help when applying for lucrative grants that will inevitably be on offer subsequent to a shiny new emerging virus.
I will look at published studies, and get an idea of what we're dealing with, but the truth is we won't know for sure for some time yet; until the full data can be assessed. It's an ongoing thing, but I'm comfortable that PHE, my daughter's schools, and we personally are taking proportionate measures. This is just my opinion, but I am confident with it based on my & DHs experience and understanding.
Sorry for the long posts :)
Keep well, in all ways Flowers

magimedi · 29/02/2020 11:51

@DoubleTweenQueen.

Thank you for your measured & intelligent posts. It is good to hear a calm opinion in the midst of all the panic.

And I agree with you 100% about the media.

PineappleDanish · 29/02/2020 12:27

I'd MUCH rather take advice and perspective from someone like @DoubleTweenQueen who clearly has scientific knowledge than people reading the newspapers and "prepping".

Prepping doesn't mean preparing. It means panicking and being paranoid. That mindset is far more contagious than any disease. I'm not an anxious person by nature but caught myself in the supermarket wondering whether I should be stockpiling loo roll, cans of soup and UHT milk. Then I realised that actually I don't want to live my life scared of every disaster just around the corner. It's not healthy.

So I'm really trying hard not to be worried at all. Kids have been reminded to wash their hands but not obsessively. We have loads of soap in the house and hand washing is good for general hygiene anyway.

We are almost out of winter and into spring where hopefully the weather will improve and in 6 weeks we'll be seeing a sharp drop in cases.

At the moment have a teen hurtling towards Scottish Higher exams with little evidence of doing any actual study and that's stressing me out a lot more.

Oh and DS is intending applying to uni to do something Microbiology or Immunology related and is very interested in all aspects of coronavirus. We're talking about it a lot in this house!

namechangerblob · 29/02/2020 12:31

Am I right to find the low numbers/lack of deaths in under 10's reassuring for those of us with DC with fragile immune systems?

PineappleDanish · 29/02/2020 12:32

I think some posters on the other threads will be disappointed if it doesn’t kill everyone.

The same posters who predicted mass riots, civil disobedience and shortage of everything from medicine to chocolate on 31st January after Brexit?

Once this is over it will be something else. Some people just live in a state of fear and paranoia the entire time.

userxx · 29/02/2020 12:42

Some people just live in a state of fear and paranoia the entire time.

It must be exhausting to live that way. I dipped into one of those threads and quickly came out when it was suggested that people should wear bin bags to go to the toilet. Wtaf 😬

3luckystars · 29/02/2020 12:44

Thank you for this wonderful thread.

My mother was describing a painting to me recently of Daniel and the Lions. ( I'm not sure of the story exactly but some guy Daniel was thrown to the lions but he survived.)
So in this painting she was saying that Daniel was painted as looking at the light, there were rays of light and he is looking at them and not the lions.
So she was saying to me that in a situation where we are scared to look at the light and not the lions.

Thanks again for this ray of light!

SubordinateThatClause · 29/02/2020 13:04

@userxx It is exhausting. I'm trying hard to take control of my anxiety which hasn't been an issue for me on a day to day basis for a long time. I have 'prepped' a bit - tins, UHT, paracetamol / ibuprofen, bleach. It helps me to feel a bit calmer an in control.

Generally things just feel a bit surreal at the moment. I popped into Boots for some tampons earlier and a guy was restocking the paracetamol shelf for the 2nd time this morning. Hand sanitizer shelf empty, with a sign saying that stocks were limited to two items per person. Clearly they've sold out now.

I just want to hide.

DobbyTheHouseElk · 29/02/2020 14:31

I have been to M&S food hall today. Full shelves of hand gel there. It reassured me a little.

Rassy · 29/02/2020 18:22

There is an article in The Washington Post by someone who has coronavirus, they were on the Diamond Princess, titled I Have the Coronovirus. So far it isn't too bad

www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2020/02/28/i-have-coronavirus-so-far-it-isnt-that-bad/?outputType=amp

Is quite reassuring. He is in his late 60s, said he has been more ill previously with bronchitis and would be at work if he didn't know it was coronavirus.

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