IDF uncovers ‘complex’ 4.3-mile Hamas tunnel network in Gaza’s south

[Twiglets1]

The IDF said on Thursday it had uncovered one of the largest and most complex Hamas tunnel networks found so far in Gaza, a route stretching more than 4.3 miles and descending roughly 82 feet. A video of the tunnel is available to watch on X and on various websites including JNS in the link below.

The underground route, which the military said ran under “a densely populated Rafah neighborhood and through an UNRWA compound, mosques, clinics, kindergartens and schools,” included 80 hideouts.

Defence Minister Israel Katz tweeted on Thursday, “This is the tunnel where Lt. Hadar Goldin was held. More than 8 kilometers and 80 (!) bedrooms.

“We must destroy the underground terror city that Hamas built in Gaza. The IDF is working non-stop to carry out the mission,” continued Katz, who added, “Until the last tunnel.”

“The major challenge for Israel after the [first] stage of returning the hostages will be the destruction of all of Hamas’s terror tunnels in Gaza, both directly by the IDF and through the international mechanism that will be established under U.S. leadership and oversight,” Katz tweeted.

“This is the primary meaning of implementing the agreed principle of demilitarizing the Gaza Strip and disarming Hamas,” wrote the defence minister. “I have instructed the IDF to prepare to carry out the mission.”

www.jns.org/idf-uncovers-complex-4-3-mile-hamas-tunnel-network-in-gazas-south/

Different countries have different systems.

A quick BING says Norway has 684 medical clinics.

BING also says Norway has 808 hospitals, not 27 as you posted.

What the overlap is in how clinics / hospitals are defined, no idea. Just doing super quick searches.

The country I live in does not use the primary care system the UK has, with doctor's surgeries spread through the community. Here there are lots of small hospitals.

As a genuine matter of interest, where did you get your Norway v Gaza comparison from ?

It seems such a random choice, Norway v Gaza.

DP sorry

This information doesnt matter to me, i do not live in gaza or in the united states or even in israel. But i support love, respect and dignity.

What do you think should happen to the tunnels @TomeTome ?

So you have 2 options. Either someone other than Israel should be destroying the tunnels. Who should it be?
Or, you think the tunnels should stay.
Lets say the tunnels stay and lets put aside the safety of Israel which you have made it clear you don't care about. How could a new non-Hamas government (you oppose Hamas, right?) and the civilians of Gaza, ever feel safe with such a network underneath them? How could they be sure Hamas was gone and all its weapons decommissioned? Who is going to help them rebuild on top if that network?

Must have cost an absolute fortune to build.

Hamas’ priorities are not the well being of Palestinians.

So it does make you wonder why someone who is supposedly pro-Palestinian is so blase about them.

Pro Palestinian does not mean pre Hamas.

That was my point.

Cool.

So why does someone who is pro-Palestinian people but opposes Hamas not see why the tunnels need to be destroyed?

i understand you feel that Israel is best placed to continue its assault on Gaza to destroy the tunnels that run under much of the region. The rest of the world don’t really buy it though. They see Israel as a rogue state intent on persecuting the Palestinian population. This is not a reasonable plan. More innocent Palestinians will be killed, more irreparable damage will be done to the area. London sits on a network of tunnels as do many of our cities and even quite small towns. Nobody would feel safer if the local county council decided they must be blown up. It’s a colossally stupid idea and in a region already ravaged by the horrors of Israel’s two year campaign of ethnic cleansing utterly indefensible.

So what should happen to the tunnels?

For sure, they can go ahead and destroy the tunnels, they have destroyed everything else after all.

I would not be getting riled up over a propaganda piece though. Of course the article is propaganda. Its war. Propaganda is a natural thing in war.

These 2 quotes from the article have different lengths, for example.

IDF troops uncovered one of Gaza’s largest and most complex underground routes, over 7 km long, ~25 meters deep, with ~80 hideouts, where abducted IDF officer Lt. Hadar Goldin was held.

Defense Minister Israel Katz tweeted on Thursday, “This is the tunnel where Lt. Hadar Goldin was held. More than 8 kilometers and 80 (!) bedrooms.

I noticed how "with ~80 hideouts" in one paragraph becomes "and 80 (!) bedrooms." in another.

And there is a lot of conflation too. The article is about a newly discovered tunnel. but it has stuff about other tunnels thrown in, airstrikes, very specific claims with no indication how those claims were verified.

When I read an article such as this, my first thought is yup, nice bit of propaganda. It's not BLOW IT ALL UP.

For sure, they likely did find a tunnel. Add it to the list.

Sorry, not quite understanding your answer. Whether that particular article is propaganda or not, we know a vast network of tunnels exists.

What should be done about it?

@RedTagAlan @TomeTome

I don’t think there’s a lot of point talking about it, as you seem a bit resistant to logic.

Sadly, the political leadership of Hamas spent masses of aid and UN manpower not on making Gaza self sufficient and stable, but on plotting and planning for war with Israel.
Israel has had people taking potshots at it its entire existence. They occupy spaces used to launch attacks at Israel, to prevent further attempts.
This is another one of those actions, preventing further attacks.

If Reading had gone rogue, raised a terrorist army that raided London slaughtering and raping and kidnapping, had developed a tunnel network to move men, arms and hostages around unseen, do you think the people of London would sleep easy with that network and those units still in place?
I think we’d probably flood them.

Exactly. Of course they wouldn't and the really pertinent point is that noone would expect them to. Everyone would ubderstand why that network had to be decommissioned for the safety both of people in London AND Reading.

My post was saying that the article posted by the OP is propaganda. Designed to flame a reaction. " BLAST THE TUNNELS"

What should be done about, or with the tunnels ?

Well, I would not have gone in and flattened all that was above them for a start. Not if finding and rendering the tunnels inoperable was a major aim.

I would have left the infrastructure above intact, and gotten the seismologists in. There are loads of teams around the world have been working on tunnel and underground cavity detection.

For sure it's not easy, but I would say it's pretty certain the IDF have been working on the tech, and monitoring tunnel construction over the decades.

How to destroy the tunnels ?

Carefully and planned I would hope.

So you agree the tunnels need to be destroyed?

Quote " .....as you seem a bit resistant to logic."

I would say I was applying logic, by reading through the article and looking what is actually written.

It looks to me like propaganda. The big donate button at the bottom is a bit of a clue.

My logic says not to be inflamed and roused up by propaganda.

Carefully and planned is what I said.

The planning part would involve what is to be made inoperable or not.

Great, we are getting somewhere.

Who should be doing the work to decommission tbe tunnels?

No idea.

I assume that would be quite high on the list at the planning stage. Mining Engineers, demolition folk, subsidence Engineers etc. Maybe even cartographers to map them .Forensics teams to gather evidence too.

Maybe the same news outlet will do an article on it. That would be an interesting read, compared to the propaganda posted by the OP.

Back at you. Who do you think should decommission them ?

You may not like the source I quoted from in the OP (no source that isn't anti Israel seems to be considered reputable, I wonder why) but it's not propaganda to report that a massive underground tunnel has been uncovered in the south of Gaza. Whether the rooms within the tunnel network should be more accurately called "bedrooms" as Katz described them or "hideouts" is irrelevant. A different media source refers to them as "living chambers" and yet another one to "80 separate rooms" - so what?? You're clutching at straws making a non-point about different sources describing the rooms differently.

It's also silly to nitpik over different estimates of the length of the tunnel which is apparently somewhere between 7-8km long. According to the military, the tunnel is "over seven kilometres long" and "about 25 metres deep" - sorry they couldn't be absolutely specific for you at this point in time.

A massive new underground complex has been discovered, that is what the thread is about. Not propaganda to talk about something new that has been discovered.

But it is a propaganda piece, and it is having the desired effect on many.

That is what propaganda is designed to do.

Check what Media Bias Fact Check says about JNS:

Jewish News Syndicate (JNS) – Bias and Credibility - Media Bias/Fact Check (mediabiasfactcheck.com)

Quote the summary : "Overall, We rate the Jewish News Syndicate as Right-Center biased based on its editorial position in support of the Israeli government. We also rate them Mixed for factual reporting due to poor sourcing techniques and the promotion of one-sided propaganda."

I don't think it is silly to nitpick over propaganda at all. And the " non point" I indicated is a tell tale of propaganda.

I prefer not to be sucked in by it.

Is this post relevant to the thread and subject ? I reckon so, because we can see the effect propaganda has on some folk.