Israelis should be welcome in Birmingham

[mids2019]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-15206171/Parts-Birmingham-no-area-Jews-says-Ed-Miliband-ministers-scramble-allow-Israeli-fans-attend-Aston-Villa-football-match.html

The government need to act on this. West Midlands police have more than enough man power to police a football match with at most 1000 away fans. I watched West Midlands politics today and there was a politician brazenly saying part of the reason for effectively banning the Tel Aviv fans was they there was 'a moral point about Gaza'. We cannot have local councillors, community leaders and MPs agitating for the anti Semitic ban of fans of one of Israel's premier football teams.

We have to face reality want know that a lot of local residents are anti Israel and have taken this opportunity for VIlla Park to become a no go area for Jews.

Let's hope the decision is overturned and quickly.

No military support

Exactly @SharonEllis dead children did not start a war but Israel stilll killed 20,000 plus of them….,and we are meant to think that proportionate

It's antisemitic to make false claims of antisemitism!

It wasn't 'what they wanted'. It was what was necessary for safety based on the intelligence provided by UEFA and European police forces about the violent and racist MTA fans, but sure...

intelligence provided by UEFA

UEFA issued a statement in mid-October urging that the Maccabi fans be allowed to travel to the match;

^UEFA, the governing body of European football, has urged local authorities to allow Maccabi fans to travel. The organisation said in a statement: “UEFA wants fans to be able to travel and support their team in a safe, secure and welcoming environment, and encourages both teams and the competent authorities to agree on the implementation of appropriate measures necessary to allow this to happen.”^

Blame hamas. We've been through this. They started it, they didn't protect their civilians and even purposefully put them in harms way.

No military support. Really.

Have you heard of Iran? Of hezbollah? Of rich hamas bosses in Qatar?

Do you think poor old hamas are busy making DIY guns in those tunnels, no one sending them weapons?!

No. The Israelis are 100% responsible for the death of every single child they have killed.

No. Hamas are.

They sat in their tunnels beneath schools, homes and hospitals whilst their civilians were unprotected. They're now shooting them in cold blood, not much outrage from the pro pals about that.

Stay in denial @Gloriia Israel is responsible for who it has killed

Stay in denial @everexpanding hamas committed an atrocity, they knew exactly what would happen and they placed themselves among the civilians thus causing more deaths. They are responsible.

Do you know they're murdering their own people, shooting them in cold blood. Don't you care?

Thats simply untrue under international law.

Yes @Gloriia i do care, I don’t believe in extra judicial killing and am capable of caring about two different populations, I am not a racist unlike many posters on here

Please enlighten how many of the 20,000 children did Israel kill lawfully?

Racist? Who on earth is racist and do c&p any racist comments. What a thing to say, we condemn murderers and that is racist? Ive heard it all now.

It was a war. Combatants/terrorists set up shop in civilian areas.

@Gloriia there is a large Israeli wedding happening 830 guests including children, grannies, aunties etc a lovely celebration there are 170 terrorists in the basement of the hotel, they are not a threat to the guests they are hiding but may at some unspecified time in the future launch an attack somewhere, but not on the guests, am I entitled to drop a bomb on the wedding that day killing all the 830 guests in order to kill the terrorists or should I try to target terrorists on an occasion when I can capture/ kill then without wiping out the 830 Israeli guests and injuring the 200 Israeli hotel staff who are prepping in the kitchen and dining room?

Sorry, what? I'm not into hypothetical scenarios really.

I'll give you a real one though, 'me and my pals have slaughtered hundreds, abducted and tortured hundreds. We've got ourselves and all our weapons hidden in tunnels below civilian areas. Am I unreasonable to be surprised that to get at me and my fellow murderers civilians are harmed?'

?

The average civilian to combatant death ratio in armed conflict recorded by the UN was 9:1 in 2022.

In your hypothetical scenario, that would have meant 1530 civilians killed for 170 terrorists.

Obviously that would not have happened anyway as the IDF have taken unprecedented steps to avoid civilian casualties. If the boot was on the other foot and Hamas had access to IDF resources, they would have wiped the whole lot out in a heartbeat.

The IDF also do not hide under civilian infrastructure so as to deliberately use civilians as human shields so it’s an irrelevant hypothesis.

https://press.un.org/en/2022/sc14904.doc.htm

www.ynetnews.com/opinions-analysis/article/r1moukwhr#

Obviously under international law some people are killed lawfully. Obviously I would not know the exact number. Obviously to say Israel is 'responsible' for every casualty is factually nonsense. As ever you absolve Hamas of all responsibility when, objectively, regardless of what side you are on, they bear responsibility for some peolle killed by Israel.

I hold Hamas responsible for the 1,200 people they killed on October 7th, I hold Israel responsible for the 69,000 people they have killed since

So at the recent anti semetic attack at the synagogue in Manchester two innocent people were killed and one terrorist killed.

One innocent person was killed by the terrorist- I think we can all agree that he was responsible for this death.

One innocent person was killed by the armed police who when shooting the terrorist trying to break into the synagogue, bullets went through the door and killed the innocent person.

So in your opinion a) are the police responsible for killing the second innocent person and b) if so are the actions of police just as bad as the actions of the terrorist ?

If someone killed my child do I have the right to murder their entire extended family? Can I starve them to death? Aunts, grandparents etc we can trade hypotheticals all day, we won’t agree, I think Israel’s response has been a collective, intentionally cruel and disproportionate punishment of a trapped civilian population you think Israel”s actions including war crimes are always excusable with “but Hamas”

The police shot one civilian, which could be an accident, if they had decided to bomb the synagogue knowing there were civilians including children inside and had killed 8 or 9 civilians there would rightfully be public outrage