Lebanese Christians - are the marchers marching for them?

[mids2019]

30% of Lebanese are Christian in a historically Christian country get this seems to get little attention. These are Christians suffering in Lebanon and sorely dislike Hezbollah who have brought war into their country?

I understand the protesters are concerned with civilian suffering and death which in itself is reasonable but in reality are protesters aware of this? With Lebanon being such a diverse society do the protesters only have concerns about those of one religion or all the people?

Yes. Every civillian life lost is tragic. If doesn't matter what religion that person is.

Some people will be aware that Lebanon has a lot of Christians, some will be ignorant of this. Not all the protestors will think in the same way.

Probably not. They are probably saying ceasefire now for everybody but the Lebanese Christians🙄

Edited to say my post is obviously sarcastic in case that wasn't clear enough.

Most people who have knowledge of the Middle East know that Lebanon has at least a third of its population is Christian. The President is always a Maronite Christian. Some Christian parties have had an alliance with Hezbollah. (Michele Aoun).

From Wiki

Aoun was elected to the Parliament for the first time in the same year, while his party won 21 seats in the parliament, forming the largest Christian bloc, and second biggest bloc in the Parliament. In 2006, he signed a memorandum of understanding with Hezbollah, starting a major alliance that has remained ever since.

I simply say this because Lebanese Christians are apparently oppressed by Hizbollah. There would be groups that would want to see Hizbollah removed from the country but of course are suffering due to the impacts of the war. I just wonder if protesters know Lebanon should have a Christian president?

I actually was intrigued to find Lebanon had a vibrant night life with many nightclubs and bars. The diverse make up of Lebanese society seems to be omitted by the media and in reality I don't think Israel is targeting Christian or Druze neighbourhoods but mainly areas of Hixbolah strength which are Muslim.

As I said if protesters are wishing to highlight suffering in Lebanon then OK this is reasonable but if they are in effect wanting to support Hizbollah in Lebanon then not OK.

I feel the fact that this terrible war impacts non Muslims may be missing from some people's minds as it doesn't help a simplistic narrarive.

I have read your post many times and I don’t understand the point you are making.Are you saying that people against Israel bombing Lebanon, are only concerned about them bombing the Muslim population. Cannot make head nor tail of your strange posts on here…

I think many in the west (including me) probably don’t understand Lebanon very well. It has a very distinct culture and is actually quite diverse. There are a lot of Lebanese where I live. I’ve actually never met one who wears a hijab (these are sunni not shia and I know a few Christians). They are practicing but they are not arabised (the ones I know at any rate).

Hezbollah is not popular with any group that is not Shiite. They are seen as prioritising Irans aims in the region above the wellbeing of Lebanese by many. I think this conflict has probably bought that into sharper focus. I genuinely hope this doesn’t descend into another civil war later. With hezbollah damaged theres definitely a chance that anti-Hezballah groups try to assert themselves and get rid of them permanently (which wouldn’t be a bad thing for Lebanon).

I’ve just assumed that anyone holding a “we love hezbollah” banner is an Iran supporter or a shiite. Anyone who’s just concerned about civilians I would hope cares about all of them regardless of religion.

I think some Christian villages have been hit. Tripoli was hit which caught everyone by surprise, a hamas member was installed there.

Do you think that every Lebanese Muslim is Hezbolla? Why wouldn’t the marchers care about Lebanese Christians? They are there for every innocent person who has been harmed, killed or oppressed by the Israeli government.

I think Op is making a point about the people with pro-hizb signs. Hizb is a shiite militia anyone holding up a sign with that is indicating that they basically support a shiite Iranian proxy, it would not be unreasonable to assume that they are therefore anti whoever hezb is anti as well.

I think it’s a bit more complicated than that, hezb happens to be shiite but I don’t think they are religious fanatics as such, it’s more of a political bloc from my understanding. Some will be religious fanatics ofcourse but Lebanese politics is a mess of alliances etc and a lot of these will be pragmatic rather than motivated by religion.

YABU to think that every Muslim Lebanese person supports Hezbollah (and it also tells me you've never been there). Plenty of Christians in the middle east, including of course in the OPTs.

Lebanon's complex and weak confessional system of government is one of the reasons they're there in the first place.

This is quite an odd post. For the most part people after a ceasefire want one because they care about humans and want to see less division and persecution based upon religious lines.

I do agree with your point about Lebanon though. It's a beautiful, fairly cosmopolitan place with an almost Mediterranean vibe. Parts of it remind me a lot of Cyprus. Also a country that has done a lot to help Syrian refugees, possibly to its own detriment down to its smaller infrastructure. I don't think it's portrayal in the media is reflective of what the country is actually like at all and I'm not sure why that is. If I was being very cynical I'd say the media were having a push to make sure we don't see it as a country that is too similar to us - far easier to see it as one of those tricky Middle Eastern countries that are always involved in complicated fighting.

Actually my heart breaks for the Lebanese people who have worked so hard after the war in the late 70s/early 80s to turn the country into what it is now. It must be horrendous after forty odd years to be right back in a war zone again.

Beirut was actually really trendy and seen as a weekend away destination with great restaurants and bars. What a tragedy!

I don’t think she’s talking about Lebanese people, I think she’s talking about western protesters.

@school

Yes, what a terrible thing for them. I agree with all you are saying.

I think the media is very careful to not introduce religion unnecessarily into reporting but in doing so possibly has not given context to Lebanon or its history. Maybe people are trying to avoid divisive arguments about whether Lebanon is a Christian country or not.

The recent history of Lebanon is a tragic one and this is more tragedy.

The persecution of Lebanese Christians hasn't made headline news though and the exodus of Christians from the country has been a long term trend. The complexities of Lebanese society are glossed over in the news in my opinion. In a sense certainly not all of the Lebanese people are enemies of Israel only a subset which makes this particularly tragic. Hezbollah does not equal Lebanon and I would not want to think protesters thought so.

I think we have slightly different perspectives on this. I think the majority of Lebanese people see Israel as the aggressor, certainly the perspective of the people I know is that Israel has been acting in a hostile way with Lebanon for years, and there has for a long time been a concern that Israel wants to take some land from Lebanon - hence the not a metre less slogan.

Actually I'd like to rephrase my last post because obviously I don't know the majority of Lebanese people! It should just say the people I've spoke to!

FFS of course they arent. The marchers are marching primarily for themselves.

The history of Lebanon is very complex and to be quite honest I suspect the sort of person who carries a pro Hezbollah sign doesn't know it very well, or if they do, remembers snippets like how Christian forces aligned with Israelis during the civil war. It was Phalangist (christian) forces who carried out the massacres in sabra and Shatila, as revenge for the assassination of Bachir Gemayel, while the IDF let them in to the camps and kept the residents from leaving. (This does not mean that they like each other, which is a point that is simetimes missed.) I honestly worry about some people who read pro Hezbollah propaganda. You don't need to support the war to distrust and dislike them, and not just because of their role vis a vis Israel. Hizbollah aligned with Syria during the Syrian civil war.

I haven't read the whole thread. I am a Christian Palestinian. I have been on every march because I am marching against human beings being killed. If you go on these marches you will actually see that the majority appear to be non Muslim.
It has never been about religion on our part. The levant area has always had Christians. Muslims, Christians and Jews had lived peacefully together. Many Muslims also dislike Hezbollah and Hamas. These groups did not spring out of nowhere. That's all I'm saying. Now waiting for the usual poster to lay into me with her misinformation and whataboutery.

Here we go again.

Mmm, I think there is a distinction between everyone marching and a subset of people who think Hezbollah are just freedom fighters.

i would also say, as a Jew, that the "everyone lived peacefully" is something of a modern myth that's become popular as a counter to Zionism. Speaking to Jews specifically, things never got as bad in the Levant as they did in Europe, but it was not always peaceful. (See, for example, the Damascus affair.)

Yes I wondered that too. It does seem a bit like there is a whiff of purity spiral/purity politics about it. My guess it will be some version of “If you aren’t vocal enough about the Christians in Lebanon, then you’re bad and it’s OK for Israel to commit genocide in Gaza”

Well said 👏