Hamas leader believes civilian deaths are ‘necessary sacrifices’ in Israeli war, leaked letters show

[blackcherryconserve]

From the article
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2024/06/11/hamas-leader-leaked-civilian-deaths-necessary-israel-sinwar/

Correspondence between Yahya Sinwar, the terror group’s military leader, and officials tasked with brokering a ceasefire with Qatari and Egyptian officials indicate he is more interested in securing his own future than peace.

“We have the Israelis right where we want them,” Sinwar said in one of dozens of messages to ceasefire negotiators obtained by The Wall Street Journal.
The messages display a calculated disregard for human life and a belief on the part of Sinwar that Israel has more to lose from the eight-month war than Hamas.

In one message to Hamas leaders in Doha, he cites civilian losses in national-liberation conflicts in places such as Algeria, where hundreds of thousands of people died fighting for independence from France, saying, “these are necessary sacrifices”.

In a separate letter, sent on April 11 to Ismail Haniyeh, a Hamas political leader, whose three sons were killed in an Israeli air strike, Sinwar claimed their deaths and those of other Palestinians would “infuse life into the veins of this nation, prompting it to rise to its glory and honour”.

How about this man needing to do better? Or the Palestinians supporting him?

Spell it out! What do YOU think she was saying?

I've told you before. Stop ordering me about!

This thread is not about the hostage rescue mission... so no, obviously I was not referring to that one particular instance. I'm talking about the whole thing!

I also said it, and was then accused of hating Jewish people 😳 (deleted by mumsnet).

So no... it's not just you! (At least that's something)

Ok well don't spell it out... continue with your own 'ambiguous vagueness' or however you put it.

This is a thread about "Hamas leader believes civilian deaths are ‘necessary sacrifices’ in Israeli war, leaked letters show"

NOT about how Israelis or indeed any other people could do better.

Doesn’t surprise me either, murdering thugs the lot of them.

Well, I hate to be pessimistic, but I'm not convinced that this particular man has capacity to change. Some people don't. The rest of us (including radicalised people if they have capacity to change) need to hold ourselves and others to higher standards than this man.

It doesn’t really make sense does it. If the Israeli government think they need to kill thousands of Palestinian civilians to weed out Hamas, and Hamas think the more Palestinian civilians the Israeli government kill the more the world will see them for who they really are and Gaza will be free. then who wins?

The only clear thing to see is who is suffering the consequences right now, and that is mostly the people of Palestine, and actually the conscripted young adults in Israel being sent to wage war. Not forgetting the remaining hostages.

Don’t people find it unsettling knowing that at any moment someone could decide your civilian life could be ‘rightly’ taken or put at risk to make the world a better place (which usually means a better place for the ones making the decisions and not always the people they represent).

Yes - he is an appalling man. The Hamas leadership don’t care about the suffering they cause their own people never mind any one else.
Why is it wrong to say that “we” ( meaning those of us who don’t support Hamas ) must not let ourselves become indifferent to human suffering in the way that they are .

I think we all agree Sinwar and his supporters should do better. This will be a short thread because there is not a lot else to say if you don’t want the thread to go beyond that point.

Hamas wants all Jews wiped off the face of the planet, and Israel wants Israel to itself. Where you go with that I have no thoughts. Hamas will sacrifice its citizens to its purpose, siphoning off aid, not investing in building shelters or protecting civilians. Netanyahu will do everything he considers necessary to rout of all Hamas operatives. Palestinians know whether their apartments, hospitals or refugee camps have Israeli hostages in them but what are they supposed to do about that without further putting their own lives at risk.

I am from an Orthodox Jewish family. I am proud to be Jewish and I believe Israel has the right to exist. I have never felt so terrified or as loathed as I nave since 7th October. Im glad my DPs and DGPs aren’t around to see all this. They grew up fearful and desperate to integrate so as not to draw attention to themselves out of that fear and anxiety, but had gradually come to believe we were safe and not despised by the country that had given us sanctuary and a chance to rebuild our lives.

Thanks to centuries of horrendous conflict, prejudice, unworkable mandates, terrible interventions and agendas , from both overseas and at-home, neither Jew nor Palestinian has any hope of a safe, prosperous and peaceful co-existence. It breaks my heart. If you placed my family next to a Palestinian one, you’d be hard-pressed to tell us apart. Tragically , the hatred, trauma, utter distrust and need to avenge the other, that ripples through generation after generation , condemns us both to this horrific cycle.

For better or for worse, we both live here and our government and Hamas need to start to accept that and build a relationship based on acceptance of that reality. I don’t see it happening though.

Thank you for this. That is one of the most honest and moving posts I have read on this.

Thank you, @DayIntarnishedarmour - such a moving post that sums up so much of the tragedy of this situation.

This.

Exactly this. I am a non observant Jew but am proud of my heritage and what my forbears have suffered. To find the level of antisemitism (Jew hatred for want of another word) that abounds now is horrifying and dangerous, 100 years since it began in Germany when my mother was a child.

blackcherryconserve. That’s how I feel. Its clear that we have been despised to the same degree all along but it’s been simmering under the surface and this latest flare in Gaza has been the catalyst for people to let rip how they have always felt about Jews. I used to try convince my DPs things had changed since their time. Seems they were the ones who were right. I would love to live somewhere I felt accepted and safe, but there are no options.

Looks like we have the first signs of the coalition I talked about months ago as being very important in the long run in terms of security & stability in the Middle East.

Interesting development.

See attachment. 👇

Sinwar will absolutely hate this development AND will step up his disinformation campaign against Israel, in particular the one aimed at the United States which also seeks to manipulate American youths to pressure Biden to pressure Israel. Such behaviour is designed to help Hamas achieve their war aims.

TBH - I did not need a letter/document etc as I already knew how they operated.
Like most leaders who are tucked up away from the fighting or hiding in bunkers, its easy to make "sacrifices" on other peoples behalf and not telling them about it

US CENTCOM head Gen. Michael Erik Kurilla was there and Saudi Arabia was also represented.

The group discussed various matters relating to security. Details are under wraps due to the ongoing war in Gaza.

This kind of coalition will be very important in the long run which will also contribute to the deradicalisation of Gazan society.

Keep an eye out for Hamas and Iranian disinformation.

Like most leaders who are tucked up away from the fighting or hiding in bunkers, its easy to make "sacrifices" on other peoples behalf and not telling them about it

Exactly this. And not use any of the aid that has been provided to build bunkers for the civilians caught up in their war.

The vague possibility of a coalition sounds positive. How the hell you even attempt to deradicalise Gazans though, especially now, I have no optimism about