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Conflict in the Middle East

Why aren't Egypt more helpful?

48 replies

Jelllytot · 22/10/2023 01:25

Given there are two exits out of Gaza, one into Israel and one into Egypt, why isn't Egypt more helpful to Gazans?

For example, why didn't they just let the aid in? The trucks were just sat at the border for days.
Or also, why don't they just allow them to escape/exit via their border? I read it's quite complex leaving via the Rafah border ie. One would have to apply weeks ahead and pay a substantial amount to use that crossing. Why do they make it so hard to leave? Is there an agreement between Egypt and Israel to keep Gazans within the borders?

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TomeTome · 22/10/2023 01:28

Presumably the same reason we don’t open our borders to an influx of refugees from Gaza.

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Hermittrismegistus · 22/10/2023 01:28

You must be taking the piss?

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Jelllytot · 22/10/2023 01:29

No I'm not.. sorry if it's really obvious. I've never paid much attention to conflicts in the middle east until now.

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Jelllytot · 22/10/2023 01:29

TomeTome · 22/10/2023 01:28

Presumably the same reason we don’t open our borders to an influx of refugees from Gaza.

That's fair enough, but why not let the aid in then?

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Jelllytot · 22/10/2023 01:30

TomeTome · 22/10/2023 01:28

Presumably the same reason we don’t open our borders to an influx of refugees from Gaza.

Also what is that reason?

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Hermittrismegistus · 22/10/2023 01:30

Well you could try paying attention now and doing at least a little reading around the subject.

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Graciebobcat · 22/10/2023 01:31

Because the government are twats I think covers it.

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Jelllytot · 22/10/2023 01:32

Hermittrismegistus · 22/10/2023 01:30

Well you could try paying attention now and doing at least a little reading around the subject.

I have. Hence knowing about how to cross the border etc and about the aid.

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Lorelaigilmore88 · 22/10/2023 01:32

Egypt has long standing agreements with Israel re who can and can't leave Gaza via Rafah.
Plus Egypt doesn't want a million refugees in Sinai... most Egyptians are sympathetic to the Palestinians but Egypt isnt a rich country.

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Hermittrismegistus · 22/10/2023 01:33

I have. Hence knowing about how to cross the border etc and about the aid

Well you should know then that it wasn't Egypt that was blocking the aid. Ffs.

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SeulementUneFois · 22/10/2023 01:36

Lorelaigilmore88 · 22/10/2023 01:32

Egypt has long standing agreements with Israel re who can and can't leave Gaza via Rafah.
Plus Egypt doesn't want a million refugees in Sinai... most Egyptians are sympathetic to the Palestinians but Egypt isnt a rich country.

@Lorelaigilmore88

Poland - also not such a rich country - has taken in way more than a million Ukrainian refugees.
Why is Egypt acting differently towards the Palestinian ones?

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Lorelaigilmore88 · 22/10/2023 01:38

Jelllytot · 22/10/2023 01:29

No I'm not.. sorry if it's really obvious. I've never paid much attention to conflicts in the middle east until now.

Thing is, mumsnet isnt the best place to get information on such a nuanced issue. Go to the bbc news website, there are a videos on there, bitesized, that give a good summary of lots of key questions.

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Flyingalone · 22/10/2023 01:39

Hermittrismegistus · 22/10/2023 01:30

Well you could try paying attention now and doing at least a little reading around the subject.

Or you could try either answering the question or moving along, without being a harsh....individual

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Lorelaigilmore88 · 22/10/2023 01:41

SeulementUneFois · 22/10/2023 01:36

@Lorelaigilmore88

Poland - also not such a rich country - has taken in way more than a million Ukrainian refugees.
Why is Egypt acting differently towards the Palestinian ones?

Show quote history

I don't know... perhaps they will over the coming weeks and months. There is pressure from Egyptian civilians to do so and King Abdullah of Jordan apparently wants Egypt too. But Sisi is corrupt so who knows

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lavender2023 · 22/10/2023 01:41

SeulementUneFois · 22/10/2023 01:36

@Lorelaigilmore88

Poland - also not such a rich country - has taken in way more than a million Ukrainian refugees.
Why is Egypt acting differently towards the Palestinian ones?

Show quote history

Read up on black September in Jordan..Palestinian militant groups attempted to overthrow the Jordanian king..don't think there is much a chance of ukranians in Poland staging an uprising.

There is a real possibility that Palestinian militia groups could shoot rockers to Israel from Egypt and then Israel would just bomb Egypt..if I was Sisi, I would not want that!

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Trulywonderful · 22/10/2023 02:02

Egypt doesn't want a million refugees because it cannot afford that. Especially if they never don't return to Gaza after the conflict.

Many Hamas fighters may escape into Egypt. They have had issues with terrorist attacks on foreigners before and that affects their own economy and tourist industry. They can’t afford that. Plus in the past Hamas has fired rockets at Egypt too. This is why they also built a blockade on their border.

Earlier I read in a newspaper report that they wanted to make sure goods went in but Gazens didn't flood out the gates. They were waiting for it to be confirmed that this wouldn't happen. I presume from either the UN helping by the gates or the security on the Gazen side. The news report didn't say.

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Jelllytot · 22/10/2023 02:08

Ahh I see. That all makes sense.

I want to say couldn't they just let the mums and children and babies out.. but I appreciate how they would also have dads and grandpas etc (in a completely sexist assumption that all of Hamas are men, but just for argument sake).

Thanks everyone for the responses.

I feel like people who are pro-palestine are forgetting Egypt could play a role in helping Palestine.

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Heelenahandbasket · 22/10/2023 02:30

Egyphas had previous problems with terrorism from Hamas related organisations in the Sinai. For that and other reasons, they do not want to let the Gaza’s into Egypt . Re the aid, there seemed to be that the USA wanted their citizens out via Rafah as a condition of the aid going in. Also the Israelis wanted to search to ensure it would not go to Hamas.

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MrsWimpy · 22/10/2023 03:11

I think there are multiple angles but Egypt wasn't going to open the border before Isreal agreed.

Isreal wants to be sure that weapons are not being allowed through to hamas. Egypt will want to be sure that the terrorists aren't crossing.

It's all very complicated. Biden of course wants his citizens out but that was a biproduct rather than the intent of the border opening.

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Trulywonderful · 22/10/2023 04:20

So did any non Gazens get out in the end? I haven't seen anything about that.

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iap · 22/10/2023 04:21

Egypt doesn’t want Palestinian refugees for three reasons.

They’re struggling with the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood and fundamentalism and they don’t want to make it worse by importing Hamas.

It is quite useful for them, and Jordan, to have Palestinians keeping pressure on Israel. That is one reason why Jordan has refused to assimilate its quite large Palestinian population or give it equal rights.

They don’t see Palestinians as the same as them. When Israel isn’t an issue there are lots of tensions between different Arab people.

Over half of the population in Israel is middle eastern and has come from the expulsion of jews from neighbouring countries, including the expulsion of Egyptian jews in the 1950s. All were given full citizenship in Israel. Egypt, Jordan etc will not do this to Palestinians any time soon.

(On aid delay, the argument was over the inspection regime.
“Both the U.S. and Israel were concerned that Hamas would seize or destroy the aid, Blinken said. This concern, along with fears that aid would be used as cover for weapons, hindered a planned delivery on Monday, two Egyptian security sources said.”
(Reuters)

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trampoline123 · 22/10/2023 04:21

Hermittrismegistus · 22/10/2023 01:30

Well you could try paying attention now and doing at least a little reading around the subject.

Aggy!

OP is just asking a question, maybe give some useful insight instead of being an arse wipe.

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Efacsen · 22/10/2023 06:14

The other factor apart from all of the above is that Egypt has elections next year [not particularly politically stable] so Al-Sisi will also be mindful of Egyptian 'public opinion' which at the moment is largely supportive of him

If however the humanitarian crisis reaches the tipping point and 10s of thousands of Gazans start dying then public opinion may well change overnight and Al-Sisi will then need to re-assess his position on refugees

As long as just enough aid goes in to keep them alive the tipping point will be avoided - it's obviously cruel but it's also precarious as an outbreak of cholera for example could make it all fall over in days - this is what the WHO/UN are so worried about

Personally I don't believe Egypt is the main actor in impeding aid it's really not in their interests

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BethDuttonsTwin · 22/10/2023 06:35

Hermittrismegistus · 22/10/2023 01:30

Well you could try paying attention now and doing at least a little reading around the subject.

And you could try not being so snarky and unpleasant. Maybe you don't really know either? Because if you did then why not let everyone know, share your expertise?

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Upwardtrajectory · 22/10/2023 06:59

Also, Israel had suggested letting Gazian civilians go to Sinai whilst Israel goes into Gaza and clears it of Hamas (I.e. destroys it). Then they’d let the Gazians go back. Realistically, they’d never get back, Israel would end up with Gaza and Egypt would end up with millions of refugees permanently. Rather understandably , Egypt said no to that idea.
The border won’t open whilst there’s so much international negotiation going on.

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