Immune/NK cells pred thread #34

[Hopeandfaith1990]

Hi all, started a new thread as the old one was full. Not sure if this is the way to do it but I've c&p'd the list of people on the previous one as much as poss:

Old thread here: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/conception/5228367-immunenk-cells-pred-thread-33?page=40

@Jecca88
@Gizmo1983
@Deerdancer34
@Objectiontime
@SWMum9
@TammyinCork
@Newbeginnings22023
@Fletchasketch
@Morgan236
@CarpeDiem75
@ALittleLight
@MC8
@venusStarr
@Gizmo1983
@Carportforme
@Meg310532
@Newbeginnings22023
@recurrentmis
@hopefulH
@v60
@lozzmax
@fleur89
@motherofshihtzus
@sunflower360
@kea1990
@sprinkleofbabydust
@star2022
@rumandspinach
@ems123456789
@rainbowsunshine81
@mamaw05
@thornters
@elarcoiris

@Fletchasketch So glad your results are ok! My WBC was always high and I never knew why but no one seemed bothered 😆 Ooo I'll have some lasagne please!

@Fletchasketch lasagne sounds lovely! I baked a very TTC-unfriendly Bruce Bogtrotter chocolate cake but I've sent it into work with my husband to do damage control 😂

I'm 2DPO and have a horrible cold - weirdly my first thought was 'oh great I've got a cold so my immune system must be down which could be great for implantation!!'

@Gizmo1983 Ahhh, bless you. Yes, every twinge or unexpected change puts us in panic mode doesn’t it xx

Hey ladies,

just catching up again.

sorry to find you hear @SunsetVibe - it's a safe space. CRP is about 4K for tests, Fertylsis does the same for about 1.5K and you can send them off to Greece, through a pharmacy running the bloods. I have now had 7 losses, 4 of them with CRP clinic. Changed my meds several times and adding in something out. I too was told my AMH was low at 4.4 - have you had a scan to look at Follicle count - because AMH is not always the best indicator. I just went through IVF and luckily i did get it NHS funded. I paid additionally for the PGT-a. Can I ask why you can't get it funded? The reason i went through IVF was because i had a loss with CRP at 12.5 weeks and it was a chromosomal issue. So I wanted to ensure that doesn't happen again - even if the % is low.

@Hopeandfaith1990 that Bruce cake sounds wonderful and so impressed you managed to resist. You know what i have had colds and felt awful in some TWW and have been pregnant so know what you mean about immune system down lols.

Got my PGT-a results. So we tested 10 out of the 12 embryos (mainly due to affording it as its £450 per embyro) We have got 4 Euploids, 1 Mosiac and the other 5 are abnormal. Then we have the two untested still. I feel pretty positive about it and know we have 4 chances. Hoping that these are my two babies.

Going away tomorrow for my break and just want to switch off. xxx

@SunsetVibe I'm sorry to read about your loss. I've come across this thread when I was researching intralipids and I am in a similar situation to you, not knowing for sure whether my previous losses are chromosomal or immune. I've just done an egg collection in Athens with a clinic called Ark. The Dr there is very knowledgable and I went with them because he treats NK cells as well as doing IVF, and I don't have the funds to do multiple rounds with Kings (I'm 40 and so wanted to plan for not getting lucky first time and I'm not eligible for any help with the NHS as I have a 3 year old). So I'm awaiting PGTA results but I'll be doing a similar protocol Dr Shehata had me on (maybe not intralipids as my results with Dr Shehata were only ever borderline, although they offer them at Ark). Otherwise as someone else has said, Fertilysis offer NK cell testing too

Ahhh @Jecca88 thats so wonderful I’m so happy for you! 4 is great. I really hope you have an amazing time away and manage to unwind. I did a similar trip before my FET and it was so restorative. 🩷🩷🩷

@Jecca88 Great news! Enjoy your time away!

Thanks everyone for your kind words, truly! 🫶🏻🙏🏻

@Hopeandfaith1990 I didn't have genetic testing done to the MCs. I've had an appointment with the NHS fertility team and she basically said to do IVF with pgta privately and no point in doing karyotyping of the parents because it doesn't change future management considering the pgta. So I guess if I want to do karyotyping I have to do it privately.
I haven't been on any meds for my pregnancies, I did take baby aspirin for the last one which is the one that lasted longer so I was hopeful, but nope. Regarding timelines I think I need some time to heal but aiming for stim in Jan abroad. So I want to do other tests beforehand just to see.

@Deerdancer34 thank you for the virtual hug 🫂 I've had 1 chemical around 4w, then 1 at 5.5w, then 1 at 5w and then 1 at 12w (MMC, baby stopped growing at 9w-ish). Like you, I don't have a problem getting pregnant (this all happened in less than a year) but I can't keep them. So you say so many losses quite early on is likely immune and not chromossomal? 🤯
When you say Superovulation is that like Duostim for IVF? And also like you, I found the NHS advice and investigations quite useless as well (and I have a soft spot for them as I've worked 7 years in the NHS). Hence I'm feeling a bit lost, they basically said they can't help me or do more investigations (only have the clotting test pending now and then I'm on my own). So glad Dr S programme worked for you ☺️

@Fletchasketch thank you so much for the tips, I really don't want to pay 4k at the CRP if I can avoid it so will look into the cheaper clinics that you mentioned. Will also check that podcast for sure, thank you 😉

@Jecca88 they said I couldn't be funded in the NHS because I'd need to be trying for 3 years and it's usually for people that can't get pregnant but I can as I've had miscarriages 😑 I read the guidelines and it sounded like some exceptions could be applied. Having AmH 2 and after several miscarriages I'd expect to qualify for an exception as I probably don't have 3 years to try lol very disappointed.
I am considering IVF with PGTA next, but I'm scared I'll find out afterwards that failure it's mainly due to immune issues rather than chromossomal and I have to go back to square one (because of low AMH I probably won't even have any eggs to freeze). Hence considering doing the tests before IVF.
Well done on the 4 embryos, that's really great news 😃👏🏻 and enjoy your break 😊

@Taurus26 all the very best of luck with the PGTA testing 🤞🏻 we're considering a clinic in Spain but didn't ask them if they are knowledgeable of NK cells, that's a good point. I might do the test and then see. I'll check fertylitis if it's that much cheaper, thank you 😊

(Sorry for the very long post but I wanted to address each of you as you were so lovely! I'm starting therapy tomorrow to help process it all and gain strength for the next steps 💪🏻).

All the best to you all!! 💞

@Jecca88 that is a brilliant result, I’m so pleased for you. Hope you enjoy your well deserved break.

@SunsetVibe I'm glad you're doing therapy, that really helped me and actually I had to have an enforced break after my ectopic and that really helped too, even though it was the last thing I wanted to do.

I don't know enough about it all tbh because I was in a fog when I had all my early appointments & I don't want to give you wrong info. But I remember asking Dr S about kareotyping and he did say it was pointless because my losses were all early, so I think he meant it was immune issues. It would make sense in my situation I think because I felt it was my body not holding onto the pregnancy. I'm not sure what he would say about a 9 week loss for example. If you got a bit further maybe medications may help but I don't want to send you off down a wrong track or anything as I don't know enough about IVF etc because I never ended up going down that route but there are plenty of ladies here who can help there!

Superovulation is where you take letrozole Day 2-6 of your cycle to encourage up to 3 follicles to grow rather than just 1. You then have a scan to see size of the follicles and when best to trigger ovulation with Ovitrelle and then you're told when to dtd. I'm not sure what Duostim is, so don't know if it's similar to the above!?

May be worth seeing if you can get cheaper testing done to see if medications or something like Superovulation would help as it's less invasive but also I know it's tricky trying to balance time and money spent....

Love and hugs 💕
Ps Cannot believe you didn't get funding, sometimes you just feel so cast adrift when you want to be scooped up and looked after...

Does anyone who takes Hydroxy know if you can source it online? I’ve come to the end of my supply and I’m not sure I’m going to be able to get my prescription repeated on time!! Gah

@Hopeandfaith1990 Ask them to email it so you can get the prescription from a local pharmacy and then you can give them the hard copy when it arrives. That's what I did, I also called the pharmacy beforehand because they had to order in the 300mg ones which arrived the next day. Would that work?

Was this an NHS one? Thank you that’s really helpful. I’ll ask them to email it to me - not sure if it’ll work as it’s NHS

@Hopeandfaith1990 Oh, no it was private but they should still do it,surely!?

I’m not holding out much hope tbh 😔 I’m going to try and buy it online and pretend I’m going somewhere that has malaria problems - this feels like a new low 😅

@Hopeandfaith1990 🤣🤣🤣 I love this, you just have to laugh at how ludicrous it can all be! Let me know how you get on! (I might use it if it's a good price!!)

I've put it an order from doctoronline.co.uk - not 100% sure it'll get approved, I had to upload a photo of my previous prescription but I'm hoping for the best. Been so stressed about it all day lol. I said that I was buying it for a trip to Kenya but my previous prescription also had the Pred and Prog on there so I'm not sure what they'll think when they see that... fingers crossed please!!! lol xx it was £38 for 60 tablets - I think that is more than I usually pay

@Hopeandfaith1990 🤞🤞🤞🤞It's so annoying having to wait and it makes you feel so anxious. Hope it gets accepted!

Thank you lovely!!!🥰 will let you know if it does as it’s a helpful hack xx

@Hopeandfaith1990 fingers crossed for you! I was in the same situation not long ago. If it doesn't work then I can share the details for a pharmacist in Greece who can order them if you like x

Hello all, I just tested this morning and it's a big fat negative, on my first cycle with Dr Shehata's complex plan. Feeling quite taken aback, as last time, just a few months ago, we had gotten pregnant on the first try. Remind me, is the purpose of taking progesterone from ovulation to make the lining more "fussy" and less likely to implant a poor quality embryo?

@TammyinCorki totally feel you, I have been on Dr S plan (hydrox+pred+prog)for a few months now and I have not been able to get pregnant while I was able to be before when I was doing ovarian stimulation. I am starting my 4th cycle! Losing a bit hope here… I really want to find out if all these medicines would work!!! So frustrating!!

Sorry to hear that - what DPO are you?

progesterone is multipurpose I think according to D S. it supports the lining and pregnancy if there is one (creating optimal conditions) and then he also thinks that starting it from before implantation has an immune impact too. I learnt that from the podcast he was on with Hannah Pearn, it was really interesting

@TammyinCork I'm so sorry, its gut wrenching isn't it. I remember being shocked because I thought the meds would be the magic answer and work straight away. Your chance of pregnancy is still the same as a normal cycle, so I think it's 20% every cycle when you're in 30s and then declines with age (joy...). I think the medications are to support the pregnancy, so everything needs to align - a good quality egg, good lining etc. Are you just on medications at the mo? I felt broken after 3 cycles of it not working and then they offered Superovulation which took more cycles too. Try not to be disheartened but do know it can still take time all this... Sending you love and strength, its really really tough 💕

@TammyinCorkim so sorry to hear this 💔. It’s such a tough journey.
I got pregnant first round with Dr S and had a chemical shortly after. I’m now on my second round and on letrozole but I went for my follicle scan on Monday and I only had one follicle and my lining was 3.5mm… Dr S basically said I’m out for this cycle so I’m not holding any hope.

Its so overwhelming to think that you have to do the whole cycle again and the trips to have intralipids etc xxx