Bus 9 - Donkey Cart departing soon, all aboard with ivf, pcos, endo, sub/unexplained fertility jump on

[Marvellouslymadmum]

New thread 😊😊

I'm looking for some advice please for those who may have experienced similar.

I had my first scan since starting stims (day 7) this morning and had 15 follicles on my left and 11 on my right.

They have said that if I get to EC (hopefully Wednesday) and there's more than 20 collected then I will have to do a freeze all and potentially wait a few months for my body to recover before the transfer.

Anyone else had this please? Or any advice on how to minimise the chances of this happening please?

@MammyandAva hi and welcome, I've not done ivf myself so I'm unsure but I know there are someone here who have and I'm sure they'll be able to offer some advice

@MammyandAva I am at risk of that due to pcos but not had it. They monitor you very closely with bloods and scans to ensure you're not over stimulated and not all follicles there will keep growing or produce eggs. If you do overestimulate it is much safer not to transfer as it can get worse with pregnancy. They are good at balancing it throughout though

Has anyone here ever looked into vaginally microbiome at all? X

Hey @kerrym87, you want to pop over the see the wonderful guys on the ERA / EMMA / ALICE board for microbiome advice - www.mumsnet.com/talk/infertility/4673547-era-emma-alice-testing-thread-6?page=3

@kerrym87 I believe @thislittlebird may have looked into something along these lines.

@kerrym87 hi, I’ve had a microbiome test with a clinic in Greece via their website, it’s called Fertilysis. I didn’t want the ERA (yet) because I do natural transfers (so far) and the thread recommended by @OrangeBengal made me aware of this test. They test menstrual fluid and a vaginal swab you collect at home and then a courier picks it up and you get the results a couple of weeks later via email. I showed my private consultant the results and he wasn’t sold on the non invasive one (Emma Alice era is invasive) but he conceded I had abnormal results on the report and gave me metronidazole and Co-amoxiclav to treat it.

I’ll update properly in a bit. I’ve felt very overwhelmed by the second egg collection we need and haven’t been coping well.

Hope you’re doing okay @thislittlebird

If anyone has any advice with injections or side effects of gonal f please let me know, start using that from next week for this cycle as it was decided to give up on letrozole and move on. Also has anyone been given any advice around exercise while going through it all?

Thanks @Alexis7890. yeah I’m ok but I’ve been better. Not in a good place but we’re doing our second egg collection cycle now and it’s proving incredibly tough and overwhelming for me.

I’m on day 5 of Gonal F stims today. No side effects from 150 but at 225 I seem to get headaches (only had 150 on the first cycle). What’s your protocol? Only advice is to ice the site really, that helps not feel it when it goes in. DH does the injections for me.

I think exercise is fine but I will say when your ovaries start to grow and you can feel them I don’t know how much you’ll want to shake them around.

So brief update from me. I’m pretty depressed tbh after the chemical but we had a consultation on Nov 3rd at the lister and they said we could start right away, so we did because I’m not getting any younger here. As I said up there it’s going to be my 5th injection of Gonal f tonight, then Fyremadel kicks in tomorrow.

The consultant suggested the failures could be due to chromosome abnormalities which we knew, so we agreed to PGT-A test any we freeze. We’ll do a fresh transfer so I don’t end up with nothing whatsoever, all being well and we get any embryos. I can’t say I’m 100% on board with testing considering we don’t get many as it is, so the odds on us having any or many embryos is slim tbh. So I’m feeling quite disheartened that we might fall at the first hurdle.

Also he wasn’t on board with me taking pred unless I have an NK cells test. It’s annoying because I know full well that result would come back bad if I had the test, all my issues are inflammatory and immune. ANYWAY, I tried to flag the fact I shouldn’t have intralipids because I have high cholesterol (saw this in a research paper) which the research on seems very iffy to me and I’m incredibly sceptical about them but in a very consultanty way he kinda looked confused at me mentioning this. If this untested fresh fails (which is likely will) then I’ll have to raise this topic and my concerns around it again. I hate feeling not listened to but I forgot my notes on the printer at home and the consultation was chaotic because I was trying to recall everything.

Other differences this time are we’re doing higher dose stims every other day, adding in clexane and also took antibiotics which finish tomorrow (as mentioned above) and then also vaginal probiotics. Oh and trying a fresh transfer if I’m ok.

congratulations to @OrangeBengal, fingers crossed for you x

Thank you @thislittlebird, I’m really hoping this is it and that everything is as it should be at our scan on Friday.

I’m really sorry that you’re going through a second collection. Anything I can do to help, please let me know. For what’s it’s worth I think PGS testing seems like a good plan, I just keep thinking of that podcast couple I mentioned to awhile back who finally got it to work and then had a miscarriage at 9wks due to a chromosomal issue that would have been picked up by PGS.

Re the NK blood test, this can be taken at any point in your cycle and the results are back in 10 days, do you have time? Mine specifically said Prednisolone would be better than Intralips.

If this cycle didn’t work for us I was going to do something drastic - www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8083859/ - maybe something to look into?

@OrangeBengal i just really don’t think this is it. Mentally right now I’m preparing to be childless and fretting about how I’ll feel when my nephews and nieces all have babies in a decade and I have to spend Christmas with them. So that’s fun.

Was the podcast the Scottish couple? I’ve forgotten which one. No time for a blood test, is that all NK cells is? I thought they took a biopsy. I saw online that people with high cholesterol should not do intralipids so I’m going to keep pushing that, I’m not comfortable with it. Too late for NK now, unfortunately but I’ll ask to talk to the immune guy at the clinic if this attempt fails.

why is that drastic? It looks like research that’s done?

We have two more collections and we’re done I think. I don’t think we can afford or have the desire to do more. This one isn’t looking good at only 8 eggs on the scan and despite being on higher doses so I don’t have high hopes. I suspect this round will crash and burn and we’ll be straight into round three in the new year, done with it all by Easter or summer.

@thislittlebird sorry you are having such a hard time. I know platitudes don’t help but it only takes one embryo. Have you made plans for this Christmas? Do you know when the egg collection will be? Be kind to yourself and we are all here for you

@OrangeBengal good luck for Friday

Hey @thislittlebird, yes that doesn’t sound fun. Yes, the Scottish couple, not sure what actually happened to them in the end, but I don’t think they continued with the podcast.

Yes, the test I had from TDL was a blood test, I think there’s also a biopsy option, but it wasn’t suggested.

Oh and only drastic re the 3 and 5 day because I sure not sure that many clinics would sign-off on a double-transfer in the same cycle unless they had done in-house research. Maybe I’m wrong though?!

@thislittlebird hope you're doing ok with this next collection? I must say that made me giggle, the mental image of shaking your ovaries around whilst exercising! 😂

I want to look at the biome thing and also want to try and get inflammation down as I read somewhere that's the main cause of infertility! Adenomyosis doesn't help with inflammation unfortunately but I'm starting to look into whatever ways I can of reducing it. I have my scan tomorrow with the gynaecology department but same doc as I saw for fertility so that'll be fun!! She'll be on the search for my ovaries once again 🙄

@Alexis7890 egg collection is tomorrow. We're heading off in the morning to our private room at the lister and the menu of food I've been told all about by @Misty84! I'm a bit nervous this time, but maybe more about how many eggs they will or won't get. In-laws are coming to us at Christmas!

@OrangeBengal I think they gave up, at least for now. I was listening recently and they'd had 7 or 8 transfers fail, tried lots of stuff and decided to stop, possibly altogether. I wouldn't mind an NK blood test, I'll have to ask about it.

@Marvellouslymadmum my ovaries have definitely felt less shook up and very much there this time, but there's a fair few less than before. I'm sure my inflamed immune system is half the issue but oh well, if it fails I'll raise it next time. How did the scan go?

I really hope they survive as a couple @thislittlebird and they made a decision they could live with.

Although it’s pricy, I think it’s worth doing the NK blood test. It’a so straight forward too, standard blood draw, which I did at TDL in London.

Good luck this morning, take advantage of the food!

@thislittlebird hope the collection goes well 🤞🏻🤞🏻 scan was ok, won't know what they decide until I get a follow up call who knows when! They still couldn't see my ovaries though 🤷🏼‍♀️ I don't know about my immune system but they always tell me I'm very bloated and inflamed so I definitely need to try and reduce it somehow

Where have your ovaries gone @Marvellouslymadmum 😭

Thanks both. Procedure was fine but a lot more waiting around than in the nhs cycle where you were in and out pretty fast. At least we had our own room. We got ten eggs retrieved but the hopes for this cycle are very low. The doctor briefly popped by and said I’d responded a lot less than they’d expect for my AMH which I knew, but I responded well in my nhs round to a lower dose of meds so it’s not like I’m a typical poor responder. Kinda disappointing and then they couldn’t do IMSI because DH didn’t have enough sperm in the sample after preparation so we reverted to ICSI. It’s all very frustrating and I’m hoping most of my eggs were mature or we’ve got little chance of a good outcome with the sperm by the sounds of it.

@thislittlebird let's hope that one magic egg is in amongst them!! It's so frustrating that everything is different for you, hopefully they'll find out what works best.

They said the could just about spot the right ovary (same as last time) but it's right in the corner hiding and can't see it well, so no good! I think they may be stuck out the way with endo 🤷🏼‍♀️

I thought the NK test was a scam? There was an article about it in the guardian

Sorry, jumping in! Anovulation here, about to start IUI

@anotherscroller welcome! my gp said similar, I can’t say I’m convinced by it but if it gets me put on prednisone it might be worth it. I’m pretty sure my immune system is a big stumbling block.