TTC/ pregnancy on Prednisolone or similar

[freelancegirl]

I am not sure there are enough people here to start a thread but have been chatting on one on the pregnancy boards and was wondering if I could find any fellow ttc'ers on Prednisolone or similar?

I have just received a diagnosis of very high NK cells. It was a bit of a shock actually as it turns out I have some of the highest levels - 3.79 when anything over 1.8 is considered 'very high'.

Am trawling through Dr Beer's book and Dr Google and trying to found out more. I have been recommended 25mg prednisoline steroids for two weeks starting with ovulation, increasing to 40mg if/when BFP and then Intralipids Cyclogest too. I still have 13 days until I pop my first Pred.

There now just seem like so many hurdles - actually getting pregnant being the first one. I was prepared for high NK cells as I have high thyroid antibodies but it was shocking to be in the top 5% of people treated at the clinic. I am not sure if that gives me much less of a chance of being successful.

It would be great to hear from anyone else who is undergoing treatment and of course also if you've had successful treatment.

hello :) Mind if I join you? freelance suggested that I pop in and say hello. I am off to see Dr Shehata in about 2 weeks.

I have had 3 MMC. one at 6 weeks, discoverd at 8 (twins), one at 9 weeks discovered at 12 weeks, and one at 12 weeks discovered on the 12 week scan. All this in the last 18 months. :( I have no children.

My own consultant can't find any reason for the MMC, but we are still waiting for the tissue samples from my last erpc which was just over 3 weeks ago. I gave got factor v leiden for which I was injecting clexane. I have had lots and lots of bloods done and hysteroscopys and scans, but obviously the one I need is the NK ones.

I will have a good old read of the thread, but I do know digi who I seem to follow around :) x

Neither, I made the difficult choice to terminate due to chromosome abnormalities. So even if I do get to 12 wks I still have that to worry about too.

Oh gosh yes, another worry to add to things. That must have been so very hard.

Battery welcome to the thread! We are picking up a regular little gang. I can't wait to hear how your appointment goes with Mr S. So sorry to hear about your losses, what an awful 18 months you have had. Things like that really change lives I think. I have no kids (yet?) too.

I really hope Mr S finds something so you can get treated and hopefully be a little bit more confident next time. If you have any questions about treatment fire away! We are all a cycle or a few ahead of you in terms of Pred taking.Great too that you have had all those tests, arm yourself with every tiny little result you have ever had so that you know you reduce the chance of having to pay for duplicates. What date is your appt and where?

Hey Battery, hello! Love the name! Wow, we have got quite a few of us NK cellers on here now. During my first appointment with Dr S I remember sitting in the waiting room wondering about who his other patients were and what their stories are. I am quite nosy curious, so this is really great.

Kittens - i also just use those cheapie internet ov sticks. I find them pretty good. I bulk bought about 300 of them (along with many cheapie preg tests too) so I don't have to worry about using too many!
That must have been awful to have to go through terminating. I can't imagine what that must have been like. How long ago wwas that?

Freelance - are the twingey things like little stretchy twinges in the uterus? Not painful, just weird and nothing like you hhave when you're not preggers? I had this both times I was pregnant early days and it freaked me out a bit but after quite a bit of googling i was satisfied it was the uterus stretching and expanding and is completely normal.

Thanks, yes, it was hell. A really massive shock, especially when it happened the second time. That was my 2nd and 3rd pregnancies so around 2 and 3 years ago. I'm quite petrified of it happening again, especially as age is quite a big factor for these risks and I'm even older now, but having had 3 miscarriages since I am sort of setting one milestone at a time to worry about. I'm sure if I make it past my 10 weeks scan and arrange a CVS for 11.3 I will be shitting myself further!

It's shite, Kittens that that chance of feeling happy and confident during a pregnancy has been taken away from you. And all of us really. That we just count days as they happen, rather than try to look to the future and plan ahead. What Louise said to me earlier by email was really interesting though and I think we should all bear it in mind. She said 'You are doing every thing in your power to increase your chances of a successful pregnancy!' and that is what we all have to do. As we really are all making every effort - physically, emotionally, financially...

I too was sitting in the waiting room wondering who everyone else was Cheerful, wondering if any others were MN folk! I wonder how many people he sees who are NOT mn folk... We need to make sure we tell each other when appointments are as we might be there at the same time! I have been to Ashtead, Harley Street, St Helier AND New Life Clinic in Epsom now (although the latter was for the interview). That's where I will be on Thurs for intralipids. It's very swish. It's like those rare times I have been upgraded on airlines, makes you never want to go non-private again

Yes the feelings are definitely stretchy. Am bloated, to the extent that there no holding it in to make it look a bit prettier. I am going for the casual maxi-dress look. Nothing with a waist band would feel comfortable. Off to Wagamama with DH in a bit, keep forgetting that as well as work, hours a day googling and posting on here, trying to organise some serious health care, trying to create a documentary, trying to schedule in what now amounts to over 16 daily tablets... I also have to think about things to eat/not eat/do/not to do in pregnancy!

Battery did you see that thread I posted on here ages about from people who ARE pregnant and on Mr Shehata's plan? It's really inspiring. Am so looking forward to your treatment starting too.

Hi again - congratulations Freelance that is really fantastic news. I hope the intralipids goes well on Thursday. As for the question about the cyclogyest I have had it during previous pregnancies and definitely found that back is best! Going to start ttc in August - hoping that not sleeping will matter less during the school holidays as not sure how will manage that back at work. Is being on 40 very different from being on 25 (steroids)?

Not sure about how 40mg feels compared to 25 at the mo. Yesterday I did have some dizzy spells and I am totally knackered today but I have had trouble sleeping and also had to get up early. Fascinated to see how the iv works tomorrow so will keep you posted! I don't really feel pregnant but it is difficult to tell, what with the 17 tablets a day and lack of sleep! I just hope the drugs and iv work and also that we have caught it in time. I started the Pred on cd16 when ovulation might have been 14 and then the 40mg on what was cd30. I guess only time will tell. Thanks for the advice re the cyclogest! I think I will try it from behind tonight ... :)

Considering you got your BFP on 15/16dpo Freelance, I am now having second thoughts about my previous strategy of early testing and stopping the steroids early if I get a BFN at 10-12dpo! You got a -ve result on those days didn't you?

Thank god we are blessed with good humour and determination. We lay in bed for half an hour last night telling each other how much we didn't feel like having sex before we forced ourselves into it.

Cheerfulcharlie I have been buying my OPKs and Pregnancy tests in smallish batches because I've fallen pregnant so quickly in the past. My best friend suggested I bulk buy loads to see if I could active the "sods law" theory of buying loads and not needing them.

Good luck with your intralipids tomorrow freelance. I'm guessing it'll be some sort of drip.

hello everyone. Thank you for the lovely welcome :) My appointment is on the 3rd of August in London. I am still waiting for my first AF from my last mc, so there will be no chance i will be pregnant before I go.

My GP is lovely and I have told him that i am off to see Mr S and even though he knows nothing about it, he has told me to bring back the prescription and he will put it through for me which is nice. :)

I am re-reading Dr Beers book at the moment and I am finding it really reassuring xx

HI Battery. It's definitely good you can't be pregnant before you see Dr S as if you were found to have the NK cells you would need the treatment from ovulation. Have your miscarriages been getting earlier each time?

Freelance - good luck with the intralipids tomorrow. I asked a nurse friend and she said having the drip is no big deal if that is any reassurance! On the cyclogest - i always stuck up the rear too. I was told that you absorb it more from the front but it is also more likely to fall out and also you have the risk of introducing infection up there so on balance it's better up your ar$e!

Havingkittens, I love your friend's sod's law theory. I am also thinking twice about the strategy of stopping early if -ve test. Did you test using first response early, Freelance?

Hello all, yes it's good you won't get to try before the appt Battery. Mr S definitely believes in treating from conception and you want to give yourself the best chance of things going well. I have Dr Beer's book next to my bed and have been reading it most nights in the last few weeks! It is reassuring. I have read it all I think but I just keep dipping in and out of it to remind myself and get to grips more with the science bit.

Yes kittens I would definitely make sure it was a negative in the light of what happened to me. Cheerful I got a negative at 11DPO on First Response and another BFN on a Boots cheapie on 12DPO. The faint positive by 15DPO was on a Poundland cheapie and the darker positive the next day in the morning was both on a Poundland cheapie and the left over First Response I had. I still am a bit afraid to poas again as I am worried it won't have got any darker but I am going to do it tomorrow morning before I go for intralipids. I keep worrying I might have imagined it. And I am also terrified about my stupidly high rates. But what can I do? I want to be in the running, I've got to have a go, right?!

Waves at battery and ladybee

Also welcome comedy such a tragic story you tell. I'm so hoping for a happy ending for you.

Thought I'd de-lurk to update on my treatment so far...

After 4 months on Metformin my pcos has gotten worse rather than better. So in light of the whole 'steroid from ovulation' business Mr S has suggested the Superovulation program for next cycle - so we can attempt to bring my cycle length down to 28 days or 35 at the most. This involves taking a clomid-type drug from days 2-6 of my cycle. Then having my follicles monitored via a scan from day 11-13. Once follicles have reached a certain size I have to self-inject a trigger drug which should help me ovulate. The hilarious bit is that they'll be telling us when to have sex. Er, think we'll probably be having it anyway. Then they'll tell me when to start the pred.

He wouldn't start this cycle because even though I've had no follicular growth and my lining is still thin I'm already cd19 and they don't like starting this kind of treatment halfway through a cycle.

So in the meantime I'm going to try some Chinese herbs and see if they'll help bring on ovulation - and continue temping. And in light of freelance's late bfp I'll prob keep taking the pred till 14dpo. Hoping we get lucky this cycle to save us a whole heap of cash - but seeing as I'm nowhere near ovulating and I'm cd19 I'm not holding out any hope for a decent egg turning up.

Sorry to hear about your ovulation issues Digital, how incredibly frustrating for you! It must be so infuriating feeling like this is even further out of your control. I am glad Mr S has a plan of action for you. I love his undefeated, positive attitude.

Can I have a moan? I really need a rant. Sorry! I'm now on my 4th cycle of the steroids and although I am not feeling manic or spaced out (yet) I am feeling very moody and down and have had stomach ache for the last 3 days due to heartburn, bloating etc. My OH comes home yesterday afternoon and has a go at me for not going out for a walk and says "It can't be good for your eggs, not getting any exercise". Yes, OK, I know exercise is helpful and recommended but I can do without comments like this from him when, if we do manage to have a baby it will be 100% down to me, my time and effort researching, reading all the books and forums etc, all the shit that I have to go through, feeling like crap on these bloody drugs, feeling like a failure because of my eggs (as they keep telling me, the cause of miscarriages are mostly down to the woman), pushing for tests, appointments, chasing up, following up, blah blah blah. Then he can't even be bothered to take in, and remember, the details of when we are supposed to have sex. He complains that he's too tired or, like last month, ducked out on the most important days because he had a stomach ache which was probably nowhere near as bad as the stomach aches I get from the steroids! Bloody men! Grrrr. I have the famous 'roid rage, I think!

Oh Kittens, you moan away! That's what we're here for. I hear you completely. It just feels like we have to do SO much. All the research, tests, checking, decision making, weighing things up, remembering to take a million pills (not only that but with food, not with food, early in the day , late in the day), eating certain foods, not eating certain foods, trying to be healthy, trying not to put on weight, the googling, the calculating when to have sex, the OPKs / temping. I just feel like it's constant, all around in everything I do and it's not really possible to get away from it. Even when you aren't thinking about yourself, someone will show you a pic of their new baby or you read about another celebrity getting pregnant, or your colleague will ask you why you have no children when you have been married for a whole 3 years.

It does all seem to be us that have to do all the work. I had asked my DH just to take a multivit every day a couple of months ago. A couple of weeks ago i found out he hadn't been bothering even though they are right on his bedside. He sees me taking, what, 10 pills a day and can't even be bothered taking his bloody multi vitamin (specially flown in from the UK because the ones I got over here 'made his tummy hurt'). I think if it was down to the male our future babies would never make it here at all.

Like you I am also feeling really crap and exhausted at the moment (and rather tearful). If it makes you feel any better, you aren't the only one to feel completely fed up but I do think it's completely justified. Would be great to be able to do as my DH suggests and just not think about it all (!), but that's way easier said than done!

Oh and if you need cheering up, read this thread, it had me laughing out loud yesterday..

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/mumsnet_classics/1254799-Overheard-in-a-change-room-yesterday

Hi all,

Just a quick update from the other side of my first intralipids treatment. It all was fine, quite weird at first as I have never had a drip before but just a lot of waiting around. I met a lovely girl who was going through the same treatment and sitting opposite me so we were able to pass the time getting straight into the nitty gritty conversation of mcs, ttc, Pred etc. Digi she had had 45-50 day cycles ovulating on around CD25 (!) until going on the same programme it sounds like you will be on. Her cycles reduced to 28 days and she conceived in the third month of trying. She was still as slim as anything I was most jealous to see! No steroid bloat for her. Maybe I am just using steroids as an excuse to eat more! She fell pregnant really easily first time too and already has a toddler.

Kittens I think these situations make marital tensions rather tense sometimes! DH and I get on fine most of the time but I don't think they can ever really empathise we what we are going through and the amount of time and effort it involves when this is your every day body-reality. They aren't walking round with it 24/7 as we are. DH and I had a row this morning as there wasn't any food in and he is generally responsible for the shopping round here as I don't have any disposable cash at the mo. All I wanted was something for breakfast before going off to get yet more hard core treatment and he moaned when I asked for some cash to run round the shops and get some cereal! I was really pissed off! This was obviously all just a catalyst for some of other bigger stresses but it is still frustrating to be stressed with each other I know. I just wanted to let you know you're not alone with annoying rows and a lack of understanding sometimes.

Hi Cheerful - crossed posts. But it seems we can all empathise about less than understanding DHs sometimes! Mine is great at other times and I am sure yours are but you are SO right about us having to do so bloody much. Taking medication, trying to get pregnant, trying to stay pregnant is a full time bloody job for us! My DH was the same with conception vitamins. And last weekend we had a row about him having had two many pints. I don't want to be a bloody kill joy but I wanted his sperm to have a good as a chance of possible. When we are taking steroids for two weeks of the month in the hope we will conceive we want every chance we can get to let it go right.

I was also feeling crap and exhausted and tearful last week. I am just feeling confused this week. Oh and exhausted. I don't really feel pregnant which of course has me mentalling. What can I do though?! Nothing!!

Thanks you two. It really helps to have someone to empathise with. My OH is exactly the same with the bloody vitamins too. FFS! I asked him to take Selenium and Zinc and he couldn't be bothered to remember, so I took it instead!

Thanks for that thread Cheerfulcharlie, I've only got halfway down the first page but it's very amusing. I love the fact that someone as up their arse enough to call their child Quentin (I assume) and then abbreviate it to Quent. If she was as sophisticated as she thought she was she would know that Quent is a Chaucerian term for Cunt!

Sorry, pressed post to early. Meant to say, I'm glad to hear your infusion went ok and was not too traumatic freelance. Try not to worry about not feeling very pregnant yet. Remember what Mr S said about steroids masking symptoms, and also that symptoms often don't kick in 'til 6-8 weeks. The weeing in the night is a good sign though!

Ha ha. The Ones that made me laugh most were the overheard couples conversations! Gerald and the RUINED day, Keith and the forbidden banana and Lawrence and the basil pizza that made him fart were the best!

Good to hear that the intrallipids went well - doesn't sound like the most pleasant thing to have infused into you - I know that if I'm going to have fat I'd rather eat it! Just as having kittens said the steroids will mask most pregnancy symotoms - I have always got really sick in the past so perhaps this might be a positive!

OOh, yes good link Cheerful! On that subject, kind of, I was really surprised when watching the apprentice the other night to see the two people left one one team thought Columbus was British!

Yes Comedy the infusions are certainly weird. How annoying to have to consume 1000 calories and not have had a morsel pass the lips. They looked after us with tea and biscuits (to add to the calories, miscarriage weight, steroid general bloat...that is plaguing me). I worry whether I have caught the NK cells early enough but what else can I do. Yes am trying not to worry too much about lack of symptoms. Boobs feel fine, tummy is bloated and there are weird stretching and pinching feelings still, definitely hungry, definitely weeing more so I guess that is something. No nausea yet but the odd dizzy spell and of course lack of sleep from Pred anyway.

Hi there, just wondered if anyone has seen the thread on the miscarriage board regarding NK cells. Bit controversial as it questions Mr S's approach (although not directly him). Good reply though from ilovemysleep who is currently 28 preg on Mr S's regime.
I am going to see Mr S on Monday to get my blood test results then I may join you (if thats OK!) depending on the results. Congrats to Freelance for BFP

Freelance - great to hear the intralipids weren't too bad. My gynae over here looked it up, sucked her lips and grinned saying oooh 4200 calories!! So have no idea if it's 1000 or 4200 but I hope you're right on that one.
Sounds like you're having preg symtoms anyway even though the pred is supposed to mask them. It's all sounding good! What's the next step with Dr S? Do you have a check up soon?

Hello Libby! I don't think I've seen that thread so will check it out. Good luck for your Dr S results!