Sixth Form Common Room part III - post mc ttc & pregnancy

[ZamMummyInGabs]

Hoping to continue the trend of the lucky thread....

I use them! :)

LadyBee I know I'm posting from the o/side so please don't take this as condescending.

Towards the end of 2 years failing to conceive after my mc I was convinced despite all the tests showing that there was nothing wrong that my cycle had just been completely mucked up by the ERPC and was making me ovulate either at the wrong times (I'm restricted to no relations before day 12 for religious reasons) or too close after day12 to make it work. Anyway I gave up temporarily as all tests showed nothing wrong (and some of them were pretty unpleasant), you can't get funding for anything at all regarding secondary infertility on the nhs and I wanted to really consider IUI/IVF before throwing mental health and money after it, and I also started a new job and decided it might be worth taking a few months off to get my head into gear.

In those few months I did bc by use of ovulation stick and had relations at the same point on the first 2 months - day 15. On the 3rd month when cheapy amazons showed I wasn't ovulating at all for 2 months (they had before) I bought a CB digital for the 1st time had sex at the same point of the month as the previous 2 because that was when the smiley face came out and spontaneously conceived twins with no family history of them.

Equally amazingly my really good friend finally conceived the following month after 3 years of primary infertility following a failed IUI cycle.

So end result was getting a really great job which I wouldn't have had if I hadn't mcd or got pg at some point after as I would have been on maternity leave when the recruitment agent would have called, I was able to support my really good friend through a very tough period, and to all those wretched other mothers in the class who've spent their time being condescending because "you only have 1" I'm hopefully going to leap from 1 to 3 with no no. 2.

Does it make it any easier while you're going through it? No. I heard stories like this and never believed they would happen to me. I'm a big fan of giving up all hope as a method both due to mine and my good friend's story. If it helps try to believe there may be a purpose currently unrevealed to all your suffering. If it doesn't I'd recommend lots of chocolate instead...... (virtual mint magnums being sent overseas with this post)

Ooh dachs I'll have to quiz you then! I'm assuming I'll be under a different consultant and they don't travel from clinic to clinic though?! Any tips? It was refreshing phoning and getting in for scan and consultation within 10 days though, I've never gone private before, I've never had the need to. And it fits in with my cycle nicely, dh will not have to 'save up' when I need him and I won't need a fanjocam when I should be leaving my bits alone!

I'm not sure how far to go with it all if everythings fine or there's a problem that isn't easily 'fixed' though. I'm not sure I can put us though full ivf as we've already got dd, if we didn't I would be less wary of it all I think...I guess we'll just take it one step at a time.

I'm looking forward to a nice glass of later and tomorrow.

They don't travel from clinic to clinic, but the initial tests they give you should be pretty standard. They will prob do a fanjocam and take some bloods, as well as a sample from DH. If it's all fine they might suggest IUI, either natural cycle (so they just monitor you and then put in a washed sample from DH when you ovulate) or stimulated (using clomid) to make sure you are ovulating and producing an egg. They won't suggest you go to IVF until you've tried that. But they might not even suggest that, depending on what the results from the tests are! Good luck with the appointment. And enjoy the :)

Sorry about AF Tina getting proactive with the testing always made me feel a bit more in control of the situation, hope you get some good help from the clinic.

LadyB I'm jumping in late and everyone else has already said a lot of the things I wanted to say - just want to add that IMO the progesterone wasnt a waste of time at all. If you hadnt tried it you would still be wondering and worrying about whether its worth it or not, even if things dont work, its good to try and test everything and at least then you can rule that out. I'm still hoping that you get the right result this month. Hope this doesnt sound odd, but I think the emotional meltdown is actually a good sign!

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Thanks dachs. I'm definitely having a fanjocam but there's no mention of bloods. Good luck for tomorrow, I hope there's plenty of ripe eggs ready to go x

Tina can I suggest you try and get the fanjo cam appointment as close to, but before ov time as you can? Then you can ask what your uterine lining measurement is, anything above 7mm is nice and healthy plump lining. Also ask if they can see a "triple stripe" pattern (three, even layers which mean that the lining is evenly thick in all places, and doesnt have thin patches) You can only see the triple stripe pre-ov, after ov it breaks up so you wouldnt be able to see it. Ask if they can see pre-ovulatory follicles (that would be one or more large ones - over 11mm big) which will confirm that you are definitely pre-ov.

I am sure they will look for other things too, like any obvious lumps and bumps that shouldnt be there, but uterine lining measurements can only tell you something useful when done at this time in your cycle. E.g 2mm lining on Day 2 is "normal" but 2mm lining on day 13 pre ov, would be a sign that something is wrong (eggs cant implant on thin lining)

So, if you are going to pay good money for fanjo cam, best to do at the right time of the month.

P.S. If anyone here remembers GlitteryBits from the recurrent buns thread. She has just had her baby and can be found here.

mummya the appointment is a week on tues, I'll be day 9 (providing I come on as expected on Monday) and I usually ovulate around day 14, does that sound ok in terms of lining etc? I know that my previous scan was done after ov and the scanner commented that the lining looked 'thick'. We had to fit the appointment in around work and dd being in nursery. That would be the closest to ov time I could get (particularly as day 14 is a Sunday) and it means dh can give a sample when I dont actually need the sperm for baby making! It's great to have such an expert to turn to, thanks

Hi Tina sounds OK to me. I went in on day 10 and then ov'd on day 11 (i am usually a day 14 girl, so that was unusual), but its always better to be pre ov than post (so you can check out the triple stripe) I had lining isshoos so I really wanted to be sure that I was closest to ov as possible (my best measurement was 5.5mm, too thin really but I did conceive) but if you have no reason to suspect a lining problem, then its just a double check really - if you get a nice fat number on day 9, then at least you know its going to get even thicker over the next few days and not be a problem. However, if you get, say 4mm on day 9, this could still be "normal" and you wouldnt know because the lining might grow more over the next few days and end up nice and thick, or it might not and the only way of telling would be a re-scan nearer ov time. DO ask about the follicles on your ovaries (what size the largest is) as this can tell you how close you are to ov and help you get a better picture.

I am really sorry but I cant remember your past history, is there any reason why your lining might be thin/damaged? ERPC? Traumatic birth? Interuterine infection? Surgery? If not, then its not crucial you go on day 14. I had to time it exactly because I already knew I had a lining problem and I wanted to find out how thick it was at the peak moment (right before ov) which in my case was not very thick (because of Ashermans Syndrome)

By the way if the sonographer is doing a really good job, they should take three measurements and then give you the average (and if your lining is in good shape the three measurements should be very similar)

ok, I think I am rambling now... best of luck for a week on tues!

I had an em cs with dd (for brow presentation). We conceived her first month of trying though so I am worried about scarring but whenever I've mentioned it to the gp I've been fobbed off. I don't have any symptoms of Ashermans but I would like it ruled out and I'm prepared to pay for that, I definitely intend to mention it at the clinic. I didn't have a erpc when I mc for precisely that reason, I went for medical management.

I got fobbed off a lot too. It was in fact very hard for me to get a diagnosis even though I had no periods for 8 months following the last ERPC (big clue there!!) Thickness of lining is a marker of AS. I had 2 and 3mm linings for ages and doctors just kept scratching their heads and saying AS was "highly unlikely" (After surgery to remove scar tissue, I got my periods back, my lining did increase to 5.5 and I conceived 2nd month trying)

Other markers of AS are very light or non existent periods - do you have that? I think conceiving straight away is a bit of a red herring with AS. I had scar tissue from ERPC for retained placenta after DS's birth, then got pregnant first month (actually first day!) trying (but 2 years after DS's birth) but the scar tissue caused the MC (placenta cant attach to uterine wall properly), then I had an ERPC which caused more scar tissue and lost periods altogether. Basically, conceiving quickly doesnt rule out AS or make it less likely, especially if that pregnancy is not carried to term!

Thin lining can be caused by things other than AS though, I feel its something that doctors should check more often as it is so easy and simple to do so. Its so much more expensive and invasive to check your fallopian tubes are open, and they are prepared to do that in infertility cases, why not rule out other options first with the easy tests?

Anyway, hope yours comes up with a nice fat number first time, let me know how you get on.

Izzy hi, going back to nipple talk for a minute ( ) I just received my amazon order of Lansinoh nipple cream and it came with a leaflet advertising this latch assist product - any good for you?

mummya guess it couldn't hurt to try, and it seems there's some good reviews out there, thanks

tina sorry it seems af is here, good that you're being proactive and have a plan though x

dachs good luck for scan today x

ladybee how are you doing today?

I'm up at my parents' this weekend - they've had the dcs for first week of summer holidays while I've been at work so it's lovely to see them again

Thanks mummya

I'm on my phone again so apols for random errors etc.
I tested when I woke up with an Internet strip, blankety blank - not even a whisper of a second line. I'm 14dpo so pretty sure that's a true negative. Just waiting for Progesterone to drop and let AF start.
I was ok-ish then found DS watching videos of himself on my phone. First when was a baby gurgling on the grass at about 4 weeks, and then his 3rd birthday. If this cycle had worked the due date would have the same as his was in early April, it was my last chance to get pg before the gap became more than 4 years. In itself it's not worrying, it's just yet another milestone and seeing him as a gorgeous baby made me very very sad for the babies I've missed out on meeting with these losses. I feel their loss very strongly at the moment.
Thanks for all the encouraging words. They really do help. MummyA you're right, it wasn't a waste taking the prog. I did learn that it does work to extend my LP, but that day-to-day it doesn't have a major effect on my temps, so perhaps that will help me to relax about my temps overall, and perhaps if I just use a little in the late part of the cycle to ensure implantation gets enough opportunity then that might be enough.

Tina was sorry to hear about your spotting starting - what's your chart look like now?

I know what you mean ladybee, we hit the 4 year gap a few months ago. I really wanted a 3 year gap but I've started to think of it this way - I get to have dd all to myself for a bit longer, and my years of having little children (my favourite age) will be longer

My chart still looks good, temp was 37 earlier. It's the spotting yesterday that led me to think I'm out this month (although I realise I'll look pretty stupid if I've just made an appointment at a fertility clinic and I'm actually pregnant! )

Wish I could think of something comforting to say to LadyB I really want this to happen for you and soon, so there are no more milestones to mull over

Tina I also had an mmc. It was detected at 14 weeks, baby measured 11 weeks at that time but I was told it could have been bigger at some point and shrunk, so I will never really know when the heart stopped beating. The way I understand my case is that the placenta attached where there was scar tissue meaning it couldnt provide adequate nourishment for the baby, it also meant that it wouldnt detach easily. I had 7 rounds of medical management to clear the uterus, which still didnt clear it completely, then a manual procedure and then finally an ERPC (which caused scar tissue on the cervix) At the time I too thought the my uterus "hanging on" was a good thing, but in my case it "hung on" because of damaged uterine lining, so it really wasnt. I am quite worried about retained placenta/placenta accreta with this pregnancy because of that. (fingers crossed I get lucky though, stats say I could be just fine)

Its good that you have normal periods (mine were light before pregnancy, and then stopped completely after last ERPC) and AS really IS rare, so I wouldnt be too worried about it, unless you find some other evidence (like say, thin lining or something comes up on a HSG/sHG test) It is something that is little understood by most doctors though. I got all my information from an amazing international group of 2000 women with AS and some of their doctors, who share their experiences on a yahoo forum. You can access them/find out more about AS through their website www.ashermans.org.

So the scan didn't go too well. Follies still v tiny and not responding particularly well to the drugs. They given me an extra drug to take as well, but I'm feeling pretty depressed now. :(

dachs, I hope the new medicine does the trick. When will you be rescanned?

Oh dachs, I hope the new drug helps. Will be keeping my fingers crossed for you.

We're also at the 4 year point. DS was 4 a few weeks ago, meaning he'll be at least 5 before he has a sibling. We started ttc when he was 2

tina Back for another scan on Monday, then prob again on Wednesday.

Oh Dachs, sorry to hear that. Did they give you any idea of why your follicles aren't being cooperative?

Tina and Lady boo hiss about AF and rumours of AF.

at everyone else

Just a drive-by post tonight again due to being too damn tired after a busy week. I'll stop being so crap about posting, honest. But probably not soon as we're going on holiday on Friday and there are a million things to do before then. And still no AF.

Oh Dachs that sucks Is this a different drug to last time? Fx the new drug kicks things into action.

LadyB I so hear what you are saying - I rode home on Thursday in floods of tears and am really feeling beaten down by how this just isn't sorting itself out for us - but I think I am with tigger - I have a feeling this for me is happening for a reason - my dh has been extremely stressed and if I had had any of the pgs work out - I wouldn't have been able to go back to work to take the financial strain off his shoulders and I wouldn't have been able to help him emotionally as I would have a 6 month old and been sleep deprived and extremely irrational!! I think this bean is waiting for us to get ourselves sorted out so they can be born in our new house! Don't underestimate how much of what you are feeling is part of your overall move - it is such a big thing. How horrible to have two robberies - makes you feel so vulnerable As one of my wonderful Aunts says ' You are storing up a mighty lot of good karma there'

Seem to have lost my ability to look back at other posts so I am sending good karma to all of us - I still have my fx for you tina ...

On the 2ww here - have a feeling we would get a 'poor' result for this month! Oh well I am sure I will have my hopes far too high in any case!

tomboy sorry AF still hasn't turned up.

re: the follies - last time it took a few days for them to get going and they had to increase the drug dose. I just need really high doses of the hormones to get things going. I'm just a bit depressed this time because I was hoping after all the weight I've lost I wouldn't need so much to get things going, and I want things to start happening quickly to make sure I've got plenty of time to complete the cycle before i start back at work. Plus I was hoping I'd produce more eggs this time, and it doesn't look like that's going to happen.

Dachs - sending you lots of growing thoughts. I hope one or two of them come through (I'm not sure how you feel about triplets so I'm not putting three down...)