Planes cheaper than trains. Not right.

[TryingToSeeTheFunnySide]

I live in Sussex. I'm hoping to visit the Scottish Highlands later this year. I don't have a car, so train or plane are my options.
A return train journey from my local station on the south coast costs around £250 (some slightly lower, and some slightly higher). I can get a return flight for around £50.
Obviously, as someone on a very small budget, I have to go with the latter. But surely it's the wrong way round? Flying is so much worse for the environment. I don't mind the time the train takes, but simply can't afford it. Can someone explain why flying is so much cheaper. I'd have thought planes are more expensive to run?
Awful that sometimes lack of money forces you to be less eco-friendly.

You could consider taking a coach? There seem to be a lot of long distance services and I am sure would be cheaper than train or plane. Less comfortable of course, but perhaps even for part of the journey it might be worth thinking about.

They're cheaper but they take longer and aren't as frequent

I've thought about this. But, didn't give it much more than a moment's thought, as no buses in that direction from where I live, so I'd have to get a train to London first anyway. So, not sure it would work out much cheaper overall. I'm also prone to travel sickness on long distance buses. I'll look into it though and see what's available.

The airlines make their money if you need to check a bag in. Trainline is good to get split ticket options. I would fly from the South Coast to Inverness though as its a long train journey.

To be honest, I wouldn't mind the long train journey, and I could bring work with me to do; as I genuinely love train travel. It's just the cost. Even with split ticketing, it's still several times dearer. I don't think our governments are taking climate change nearly seriously enough. It's an actual emergency, but they don't encourage us to take the steps we need to. Or even make it possible for us in some instances. Mind boggling!

I wanted to visit my friend who lives about 40 miles away. She lives right by a station so I thought maybe we'd get the train rather than drive. It was £80 for us as a family of four. Fuel to drive came to less than £20. We drove.

Sorry, only just seen this post. It was on the previous page.
I love the train and am not keen on flights, for all the reasons you mention. I'd far far rather go by train. It's purely, 100% down to the difference in cost. As I'm on a budget. Hopefully one day it'll swap round - cheaper trains than flights...

Don't blame you. £60 is a big difference.
If governments are serious about getting us off the road, and keeping us away from airports, they need to subsidise train travel in a big way. It's much more subsidised in other European countries, so it could be done here. It's surely an important part of addressing our climate emergency. The onus is on the government. They can't expect us to pay so much more to get from a to b in the middle of a cost of living crisis.

A plane will make multiple trips back and forth from London to Scotland. A train will probably only do one.

That's a point.

I think all this is rather disingenuous. If you truly wanted to be green, you wouldn't travel to go on holiday at all as it's unnecessary.
But that's a bit extreme unfair. However you say you would love to get the train but...it's too expensive. You'd take a coach but...you get travel sick. Once you're the other end of the country from where you live in the Highlands of Scotland you say you'll use public transport, walk or cycle everywhere, making your holiday very restrictive. Realistically you'll need to hire a car for some of the time to see and do the things you want in the time you have available. So you'll end up flying for time and budget reasons, like most people, and hiring a car to get around, like most people, because ultimately cost and convenience trump good intentions. It's the way of the world, and the people in power are the only ones who can change it.

Put aside your concerns and enjoy your holiday, Scotland is beautiful, and far 'greener' and unspoilt than the South East could ever hope to be.

Are you travelling with your daughter this time? Is she a child or an adult? Could you get a ‘two together’ railcard?

It's not disingenuous. I can see why it might seem that way. But, this is an anonymous forum, so, I've got no reason to make myself look more virtuous or whatever.
Actually, I won't be hiring a car there, but that's another matter.
I was just wondering why trains are so much more expensive than planes. It didn't make sense to me, that's all 🤷‍♀️
I really do worry about climate change. I try to do my best, and I've forgone other stuff; but it's blooming hard work at times, especially on a budget.

If you truly wanted to be green, you wouldn't travel to go on holiday at all as it's unnecessary.

I think that bit's a bit harsh to be honest. It's not all or nothing with climate care.
I do indeed want to be green. Hence posting on a the climate change board rather than one of the more general ones. I do what I can. Get my clothes second-hand. Try to never waste food, eat local where possible etc. I'm a vegan, but to be honest that's for animal rights reasons, not the environment.

I hardly ever fly. I walk, cycle and get public transport loads. I get the train and ferry to Ireland etc.

I've been longing to visit the Scottish Highlands for many years. But, put it off for various reasons.

With the best will in the world, the difference between flights and trains for that journey is huge. I'm not perfect. That doesn't mean I'm not trying or don't genuinely want to be as green as possible.

Not a very helpful post. The OP was asking for reasons why the trains are more expensive than planes for some journeys. A reasonable question, that I've also pondered. Not sure why she'd ask it if she didn't care about the environment.

Apologies, my post reads like a personal attack, it wasn't intended that way. I just think many people say they would like to be more green, but cost and inconvenience prevent them from doing so, and they use it as an excuse to do what they actually want to (fly, get takeaway coffees in disposable cups, order regular Amazon deliveries, and so on). But I appreciate that's not you.

You are right in that cost and convenience are the driving factors for people choosing air travel, but there are reasons the government doesn't make it more expensive to fly. Air travel is not just about ferrying tourists around, it's vital to connect the country and the World for trade, political and many other reasons. The rapid post pandemic recovery of the air transport industry worldwide indicated that it's here to stay and will continue to grow.

The Highlands far North line, some of the stations you have to put your hand out.

The government is already "subsidising train travel in a big way" to the tune of a whopping £25.9 BILLION pounds in 2022/23. Most recent reports show it spends about half the total spend on the railways, i.e. half by government, half by passengers/freight customers. So, basically, train fares would double if the government didn't pump so much into the railways. How much more do people want the taxpayer to subsidise the railways???

I did say that's a bit extreme (and) unfair, of course you want to travel on holiday, most people do. And everyone should visit the Highlands at some point in their lives. Scotland is beautiful.

If you really want to get your blood pressure up on top of this, check out mainland train prices...
Like Berlin to Vienna
Paris to Rome
And so on....

What annoys me with train travel is the cheap tickets only being available within a certain window. When we were travelling to Edinburgh for the festival to watch DD1 in a show, I was quoted something like £175 pp for train tickets. Probably if I'd waited until three weeks before we could have got them for £70 each or something. But you don't often want to leave travel plans to an extremely busy place to chance. So we booked flights for about £50pp.

Car travel is far cheaper as well if you have more than one person travelling.

Our train fares are absolutely exhorbitant compared with most other countries.

As much as in other countries, where their fares are a fraction of the cost of those in the UK.

Have you checked out split ticketing OP?

Also....you might get lucky and have a severely delayed journey and be able to claim it back on delay repay! I don't see the airlines offering this!

Yes, you did. Apologies if I was being oversensitive. Long day! 😊
My great granny was Scottish, though I've spent very little time there. Never been to the Highlands. Have to admit I've been influenced by Outlander! 🤭

Apology accepted. Thank you.
I sincerely do want to do the right thing, and be ethical.
Re trains/planes. I actually find trains more convenient. Airports are a hassle. I can easily work on trains. It's 100% about the cost.