How to cope with watching people suffer

[ThinkingItThroughABit]

Hi,

I wondered if I could ask for some perspectives on a question I have?

My Grandad was a church Minister and my Mum learned a lot, and has always guided me on how to think about things in a Christian context. I have extremely solid Christian roots to my life philosophy and find that very helpful.

My Mum taught me to accept death happily because of faith in the afterlife and I am fine with that.

But with the NHS being so good at sort-of fixing people up these days, people live with chronic conditions for much longer, and some people suffer a lot before they actually die. My own grandparents died very suddenly, so my Mum didn't give me any guidance on how to cope with having to watch people suffer for long periods before they die.

She also didn't give me any thoughts on how to enjoy the fact that people are still alive, while knowing that they may not continue to be alive for long. These days people may have a diagnosis that means that they might be alive for 2 years or 10 years, but the end may come very suddenly anywhere on that timeline. I have no idea how to cope philosophically with that uncertainty.

I wondered if anybody had any ideas about that?

My DM has Lewy Body Dementia now, so I can't ask for her thoughts on it.

In thinking about people suffering, I'm not just thinking about my DM but about many people, young and old, and those in poverty and those in very challenging jobs, who may be really strung out. I see people struggling in so many contexts, and I wish it didn't tie me in knots quite so much, when I can't do anything about it.

As a child I used to worry about the feelings of inanimate objects, and I'm not super-great at noticing when people are genuinely happy, so I could possibly do with working on that.

Thanks!

I also used to see an adult clinical psychologist. Maybe I could make an appointment to see her while my DS sits with my DH?

Thank you everybody for your help with this. It really helped clarify things for me. I'd better go to sleep now. n'night.

@ThinkingItThroughABit I don't know about this from a Christian perspective, but what I'd say is that in some ways, suffering too emphatically with someone else can end up hurting you and that doesn't make you able to care for them in the future. With your son, it is likely to be a long road, and if you go through every bump and thought and upset as if you are feeling it too, then it will end up grinding you down and you will need therapy and antidepressants and may end up having a breakdown and then you won't be there to help him. I would get some therapy or counselling for yourself, or talk to a priest or religious leader if that helps you, so that you can support people who are suffering- but at a slight distance. I also think meditation or prayer can help you centre yourself when you are getting knocked off course by other people's emotions.

I would also focus on advocating for your son rather than feeling you have to contain all their emotions- get them good therapeutic support and treatment.

I'm struck by the fact that you used to get upset that inanimate objects would feel emotions- in the book by Temple Grandin, who is a well-known person with autism with exceptional insight into how to treat animals, she speaks about feeling the carpet 'loving' her and being very upset when she found out carpets didn't feel emotions. You do seem to feel things very deeply OP and this can leave you vulnerable, so my first thought is for you to start to see yourself as someone that needs protection and calmness rather than plunge in to take on the suffering of the world on your shoulders.

The concept of 'detaching with love' might also help you, as well as the three C's of the Alcoholics Anonymous movement, which are that you didn't Cause this, you can't Control this and you can't Cure this. You can't fix the suffering of others, but you can offer it up to God to help you and them, and you can get support to make yourself a firmer foundation (Peter was the rock of the Church).

We are human. We have love, compassion and empathy. When we see people suffering we can’t help but put ourselves in their shoes, or, alternatively, feel we cannot watch their ‘suffering’ because it is too much for us to bear. It is all normal and natural. We cry. We also need to remember that the only certainty in this life is that death will come to every single one of us. If we all lived every day mindful of that fact and keeping short accounts, the world might be a kinder place.

All those pondering said, as Christians we need to go back to the word of God and prayerfully see what the Bible says about pain and suffering; personal Spiritual growth; to leave our heavy burden with our Lord in prayer; to rest in Him; He is our Rock and our Redeemer; to fast and pray; to give grateful thanks in all our circumstance; pray and praise some more. In this physical realm we should do all we can do on a practical level: generous giving of time, wealth, food; sign posting; simple quiet hand-holding, sitting alongside; etc, and give the rest to God.

I wish you the peace that passes all understanding.

There are no easy answers, only trite ones. Human suffering is an issue that theologians have wrestled with for centuries and will continue to do so in the centuries to come. The book of psalms is a good place to dip into as it contains so much of what it is to be human reaching out to try to understand the world we are in and the kingdom of God. How we imagine the world should be is imperfect as we as humans will always struggle to imagine every possible unintended consequence of our action.

I do not know what happens after death but I have faith that God is there with us at the ultimate liminal moment and that all that has been capable of love will join with Love in a way we can barely imagine. All we can do is hold hope for those without hope, to love and care and pray for those who suffer and remind ourselves that it’s okay to have times when we weep and rail at God as even Christ wept to see grief and suffering.

Thanks, this is all enormously helpful. There is a whole lot to think about here but I will keep reading back and adjusting my plan.

I think the main thing is not to keep it all on my own shoulders but to keep reaching out for helps and teach my people to reach out for help themselves.

We will try the psalms. They sound good.

Thanks

“I almost need to have God there with me as a third person in the room, who can take all my DS's pain so I don't need to carry it all?”

He is with you in the room.

You can give it to Him.

I’m very struck my the admonition in the first of Peter’s letters
“…casting all your care upon Him, for He cares for you.”
1 Peter 5:7

and the one in Paul’s letter to the church in Philippi

“Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication, with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known to God; and the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus”
Philippians 4: 6-7

Feed on these words, written by men who, like their Lord, the Man of Sorrows, knew suffering and were acquainted with grief.

Peace be with you 🙏🏻

Life is full of uncertainty, but we can trust in God’s control. Proverbs 3:5-6 reminds us, “Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding; in all your ways submit to Him, and He will make your paths straight.” While we may not know how long someone will live, we can rely on God’s wisdom and timing. Instead of focusing on the uncertainty of the future, cherish the moments you have now with your loved ones, making memories and offering love. It’s okay to feel uncertain or overwhelmed, but If you need support, reach out to others who can encourage you in your faith.

Atheist here - I don’t understand how anyone could accept a god who allows people anywhere in the world to suffer - a very cruel character. I thought he was meant to be good and worshipped rather than bad and neglectful.

Parker it's important to remember that our understanding of God is limited. We can't comprehend the mind of God or the grand purpose of creation. Suffering can be seen as a mystery, a test of faith, or even a means of growth and spiritual development.While it's difficult to reconcile suffering with a loving God, I believe that God allows suffering for reasons beyond our current understanding. Perhaps it's to allow for free will, to foster compassion, or to ultimately bring about greater good.
Ultimately, the question of God and suffering is a deeply personal one. There are no easy answers, and faith often requires trus t.

The way I see it is that this god expects to be worshipped but he doesn’t give anything good in return. Basically a cruel character.

Parker the idea of God demanding worship without offering anything in return is a common criticism. However, worship is a form of gratitude, reverence, and connection to someone greater than ourselves, rather than a transactional exchange. We receive blessings and divine guidance in return for our worship, I respect your right to see things differently so what do you believe life is about?

Life is about family, friends, travel, home, exercise and having fun!

I also believe that god is in service. What I find really difficult as a paediatric nurse is seeing so many children who have such profound disabilities that their quality of life is non existent. Who a few years ago wouldn't have survived. I really struggle with the just because we can doesn't mean we should, thing. As life is sacred. It's a really difficult issue.

So why doesn’t god do anything to help them - I thought he was meant to protect innocent children?

You're demanding simple answers to deep questions. I lost a baby two weeks before term due to a traffic accident. I was distraught and looking for reasons for it happening. It was the lowest point in my life. I was afraid to ask God why, because I felt that I was to blame. Then a question came to me. Do you love Me? I knew that it was the voice of God but couldn't wouldn't answer Him. Again the question came and I broke down and cried, sobbing I do love you God please help me through this. A deep calm came over me and I felt at peace about it. Who can say why it happened? Perhaps the baby would have grown up into someone who would do terrible things, perhaps it had no chance of surviving birth, whatever. I believed then and still believe that it was His will for me then.

I’m so sorry for your tragedy. Unfortunately medical issues do happen. Although I don’t believe I’m glad your faith helped you.

Thank you for your kind words. Faith is built and strengthened by reading, understanding, and believing the Bible, which serves as the foundation of God’s promises and truths. It encourages us to trust in His plans and embrace His love. Regardless of where you stand in your beliefs, whether you have faith or not, one thing remains constant, God’s unconditional love for all of us. He extends His grace and care to everyone, inviting us into a relationship with Him. May you find peace and strength in His love.

Thank you but I’m happy being an atheist.

With respect @Parker231 I am bound to say that as you do not know God, of course you don’t understand. I have had many a discussion with you on the philosophy and religion board. This is where your statement belongs. Not here, on Christian Mumsnetters. Would you go onto any of the other religious boards and say the same? One day I pray that the eyes of your heart are opened to the true nature of God : perfect, just, merciful, and as our Creator worthy of all praise and worship.

Sitting alongside you, @MobilityCat (((gentle hug))) 🙏🤝. I am so sorry you experienced this.

With respect as I have posted previously, anyone can post so long as they are not offensive which I haven’t been. You can’t shut down valid opinions and discussions.
As I have also posted I can’t imagine why anyone would praise and worship your god.

As you are an unbeliever you will not be conscious of how disrespectful are your statements about God, here. The way you say it may not be, but your words definitely are - on this board. For you to say that God is very cruel, neglectful and not worth praise and worship is very disrespectful, here. It is not the place to challenge Christian belief. Please don’t do it.

Please accept that here on this board is not the place for an unbeliever to challenge what Christians know about God. Not that it matters, but I like you @Parker231, and as has been demonstrated, I will engage with your respectful style of debate about matters of ‘religion, theology and philosophy’ just not on this board. 💐

🤣 I am conscious of how many times I have said this board, but do not know how else to emphasise the guidance at the top of the board about it being the place for Christian Mumsnetters to gather without the tedium of folk bursting in, mid-meeting (threads) to shout that it’s all a load of rubbish, and having to kindly ask them not to do it. This matter has now been raised in Site Stuff.

It’s incredible to me that on this day which started with hostile, antagonistic posts on this board we are, 12 hours on, still having to deal with the same.

When will atheists stop this harassment of Christians on our own board? And why must they come here and accuse our God of cruelty and neglect? Have they no understanding of “respect”?

Again, for the umpteenth time, I remind all such ignorant and wilfully disrespectful posters to take their anti-Christian theories and opinions to the philosophy/ religion board and kindly leave us (& others who can conduct themselves in a respectful manner) in peace.

“This board exists primarily for the use of Christian Mumsnetters. Others are welcome to post but please be respectful. For theological debates, please visit our Philosophy/religion forum.”