could this be asthma?

[wobblymum1]

I’ve no experience of asthma so hoping someone who does can shed some light for me.
my DD6 has over the last 8 weeks or so started to take very deep breaths - mainly at rest or when tired. When I ask her why she says she feels she can’t get a whole breath. Sounds almost like I did when I had covid (she doesn’t).
at the pool earlier she swam a width and pulled herself out and said she felt she couldn’t Breathe and was panting -
recovered fast and splashed happily back in. Now one side of my brain says no wonder she was out of breath, she’s only Just mastered swimming unaided and a width would have definitely exerted her. But often now at rest shes rewlly
taking a deep breath which is unnerving.
am I right thinking that with asthma she would be coughing / struggling after running around? As she doesn’t do this. Or is that wrong?
I have awful health anxiety so keen to check this out for thoughts before I make a Gp appt. She’s well in herself generally.

thank you 😊

I should add she had a chest X-ray in Feb to exclude a chest infection due to a bad cough and high temp, they said it was clear - not sure if that is relevant or not.

Worth getting checked out.
Swimming used to really exacerbate my DS’s asthma.

thank you💞
i guess I always associated it with a wheeze, out of breath after exercise which she doesn’t have. Her big deep breaths nearly always are when she is tired or at rest.
she does have eczema and allergies which I think increases risk tho?

Yes, my DS has eczema too. I don’t know about the deep breaths thing - but it was after swimming, when DS was struggling to get enough air in that I finally clocked he might have asthma.
hope your DD is ok x

Thank you so much. I think I’ll make an appointment to get her checked out.

Respiratory nurse here. Few questions - does she have any heart conditions?

Is there any family history of asthma, eczema or hay fever?

When you say it's when she is tired, is this early hours of the morning / when she's asleep? Or is it always only noticeable in the daytime?

Thank you so much for responding 😊
No heart conditions I know of.
no family history but we have a tiny family!
she has exzema unlike her older brother, and she had a very bad dairy allergy as a baby she grew out of, but still has a couple of other mild /moderate allergies (nothing severe/anaphylactic).
it is nearly always when she is relaxed sitting watching tv or at night in bed reading etc. and then going to sleep - that’s when it happens a lot. it’s like how I would sound if I was taking a breath before going under the water. Then she exhales. Then lather rinse
repeat a few mins later.
The rest of the day she seems ok- and no coughing or wheezing after eg trampolining for ages/ riding bike / running. But I may
be out of date with those being the warning signs.
i did Google sighing syndrome which it could fit? But I don’t want to miss something as
important as asthma. She is a very restless sleeper- moves around a lot and wakes a few times still. not sure if
that could be related? No coughing / wheezing.

Huge thanks.

Ok, based on that history I would say asthma is unlikely. Not ruling it out totally, but the history isn't classic asthma at all.

Albeit the allergy / eczema does increase her probability, but the presentation with the cough and wheeze absent, the exercise not causing any issues and the only symptom being the deep breaths I would say it is unlikely.

When she does take a deep breath in, is it quite exaggerated / can you tell she's doing it? Does she sort of shudder / make real effort? Or is it a slow and steady / silent but deep breath in?

Also, any history of hay fever herself?

I keep thinking of questions now - sorry!
Any change to her body recently? Any growth spurts? Probably too young for any physical (puberty) changes?

Taking deep sighing breaths can be a symptom of anaemia OP. I've been anaemic a few times over the years and you can feel like you need to take exaggerated deep breaths

Oooh good questions! Very grateful.

definitely no shudder, just a big deep breath in, like she’s “filling up” then breathes out. It’s like I would sound If I took in a deep breath before going under water. I notice it and yes I’d say it is quite exaggerated. Not sure if anyone else would tho as you’d need to be sitting next to her while she watches tv / reading to her or laying next to her in bed to hear or notice it and I’m a single mum so the only one who does this with her!

no changes body wise, definitely no puberty, though I have separately been keeping an eye on her weight which has slowed down- she’s always been little for her age but has recently dropped
a weight centile so have has eyes on that. But height wise she is on track and generally is well in herself.

That interesting about anemia. She’s very pale and has been tested for it pretty much every time we see
a Gp about something unrelated eg tonsillitis as she is so pale but her numbers always come back ok 🤷‍♀️

sorry and no signs or History of hay fever

Ok based on all that I definitely think asthma is unlikely. As a pp said there is a possibility of anaemia, but again I'd say unlikely as breathlessness would more likely be more often and especially after exertion with anaemia, but it doesn't harm to check it out.

I think the most likely thing is exactly what you mentioned earlier - sighing syndrome - which is a type of "dysfunctional breathing". No specific cause, often gets better itself with time, no major issues that can occur from it. Just her body's way of telling her she needs a bit more oxygen. Often when we are at rest or tired our breathing can become quite shallow. And therefore the body needs a few good deep breaths in to push all the carbon dioxide out of the lungs and refill them with fresh oxygen. Normally over time the body self corrects and she'll naturally learn to breath in a different way.

I would say this is the most likely thing based on a very brief messaging chat. In the real world I would be wanting to see her , listen to her chest, check oxygen levels etc. So I would still say it's a good idea to get her checked but I think this is what the outcome will be. Best of luck x

I honestly can’t thank you enough for taking
the time to share your knowledge with me.

wish you could check her over in real life! I will make that appointment with my Gp.

i think the thing I find hardest being on my own with them is when I worry they are poorly and there is no one there to say yes, I agree, let’s get some medical attention now, or no, you’re just being your usual anxious self, it’s all ok.

So to have you listen (albeit virtually) and bring your knowledge and reassurance means more to me than you can know. Thank you. So much x

Sorry
to bump and wake this up again but this is getting worse for us☹️
shes now
doing it when trampolining (new) and needing to sit down and catch her breath. I’ve checked her oxygen sats with an oximeter
tonight and they were low 90’s dropping into 88/89. Allowing for
Some
error
as her fingers are tiny and it’s a bog standard odometer I got from boots during covid, these still seem low ☹️ , should I be worried? ☹️If it’s not asthma, what could be causing her to need to take deep breaths in and say it’s because if she doesn’t it feels like she’s holding her breath?
thank you xx

You must be so worried When is her GP appointment?

Oh, and that deep breath thing...apparently I do it, mostly when I'm watching TV in the evening, but I hold my breath for ages as well. No idea why.

It’s 10 days away.
am wondering If
i need to take her to a & e sooner than that. Not right now, she’s sleeping peacefully but sooner than 10 days away?
my worry is she seems so fine when it’s not happening I think I’ll look a major time waster when (unless it happens in front of them) for taking in a
healthy
child
who hasn’t had an accident or is in am emergency ☹️We only have Gp or a&e here, nothing in between.

Unfortunately A&E won't do anything unless it's actually happening at the time / says are low at the time. I'd try not to worry too much about the days - although I agree those figures are low, if it's not a paediatric oximeter then it won't be accurate. They key with it really is that when she takes a deep breath in, does she then recover quite quickly? If she stops trampolining does she immediately recover? Or does it go on for a long time after? With asthma, although exercise can trigger it, it is unlikely to resolve quickly on stopping because the airways are inflamed. So with asthma you need something to get rid of that inflammation - stopping the activity normally isn't enough for quick recovery.
So what is the time frame?

these are great questions.
she recovers quickly after a couple of these “deep” breaths. and no cough or wheeze. It then continues to happen on and off but no blue tinge, she seems “ok” apart from it being scary seeing her need to gasp in the air at the time.
also really helpful that they won’t do anything unless reading is low as she’s being assessed.

DD has exercise and cold induced asthma. She didn't get diagnosed until she was 13 and has never had a stereotypical asthma attack.

When smaller she used to complain of a tight chest but she also had a growth condition that meant she wasn't meant to do high impact exercises so I always brushed it off as not being great at cardio exercise. It wasn't until she started playing Rugby and she would lead the pack doing laps around the field most of the year until the cold dry air came in January and she couldn't even finish one lap that I realised it was probably more serious than I thought.

The asthma nurse said that unless children have very severe asthma they try not to formally diagnose until the child is older as it can limit career options although they still treat it with inhalers.

Not much A&E can do but I would ring the GPS tomorrow and talk to the receptionist and see if they can get you an emergency appointment. It might be a general nurse will see you and prescribe Ventolin and then you'll keep your appt at the asthma clinic.

Could it also be her lungs haven't fully recovered from her earlier chest infection? Where she's struggling with deep breath etc and this can seem like what you've described. I have asthma and get wheezing and chest tightness and shudder breath but look up silent asthma as its this without the wheeze. Random but what age is she? Asthma has been known to follow a 7 year cycle or development or remission, if she's around that age it might only be developing.

This is all so interesting.
she’s newly 7. when she was Seen in February and had the chest X-ray the admitting nurse said she had some o2 dips but the dr later dismissed these as a blip as they didn’t repeat 🤷‍♀️
dr said X-ray was clear but all this breath gassing stuff has started since then.
i have never heard of silent asthma so that’s really helpful too. School hasn’t mentioned anything so can’t be too profound there? I hope ☹️

It doesn't sound like my son who has asthma, he never gasps, even when having an attack. But then there are a wide range of presentations. My son has transient tics though that come and go. When he is having a phase of them, they tend to always be when he is relaxing, usually watching TV or on a screen. I have learnt this is common with tics. Also lots of children have tics, and most go unnoticed if you don't know what you are looking for. I know a gasp isn't an uncommon tic. Other common tics are coughing, sniffing, throat clearing, blinking, nose twitching, shrugging, repeating words. There are lots more. Just listing some because if you notice any others it might help rule out if it is or isn't.