does anyone know why we don't vaccinate against chicken pox?

[cheapandchic]

is it purely the cost to the nhs?

Bumbley, I would welcome a vaccine against the common cold with open arms

Hepatitis and rotavirus, yep, add them to the schedule; typhoid was reported as making a 'comeback' a few years ago, so would not be averse to that either.

Every child has the BCG in the borough I live in, so it is being brought back- DD1 has had it, DD2 is about to.

I know you used those examples in order to illustrate how absurd it would be to vaccinate for those illnesses, and therefore CP, but I don't believe that it would; in at least one of the examples you gave, an entire PCT agrees with me.

"We dont need to vaccinate against the pox. Unlike in America, where the reason is because parents cant afford 2 weeks off work."
Really?
Do you really believe that people are getting their children vaccinated because it means they have less time off work. Do you really think that Americans are so evil that they can't possibly care for the wellbeing of their children instead of just money?

I too wish there was a vaccine for the common cold. My ds has a genetic mutation that means that even the common cold has serious consequences for him. I think I am extra aware and adamant about vaccinations because of ds' issues. I am not sure he would still be alive had he lived in the times of no vaccinations for anything.

(Sidge - ds was born in 2000 in the uk when there was no pneumococcal or cp vaccinations available in the uk, but both were routine in the USA)

The BCG is being phased out because it's pretty much useless. It's only being used in 'risk' areas but it doesn't protect against pulmonary TB. Other countries abandoned it years ago.

I think vaccines have their place but i think mass vaccination campaigns with ineffective vaccines, vaccines against diseases that are quite rare or against diseases that very rarely cause serious complications do very little except put money in the pockets of the manufacturer and give parents some kind of false security that their children are 'safe'. You seem to be concerned about quite a few illnesses. Do you suffer from health anxiety?

Sofia, one of the major CP vaccination campaigns in the US compared the cost of the vaccine to the cost of having to take time off work.

I have not seen that campaign bumbleymummy, so suspect it was not as major as you might have been led to believe, but in any case, it doesn't mean that Americans don't care about their children's well being. Although it's certainly not completely negligible the amount of time a parent has to take off to care for a sick child.

Personally, I did not find the experience of having a sick child any more pleasant or less costly in the UK than in the USA. In fact, although I was paid for my sick days in the UK, which I was not in the USA, I was docked in other ways (given less important projects) that I was not in the USA. And I pay far less taxes in the USA which more than makes up for the sick days I was not paid for.

By the way, I agree that BCG is not an effective vaccine and in fact my ds had it because we lived in a high immigrant neighborhood in London when he was born and I didn't know any better, but later our US pediatrician told me off for having allowed him to have it and insisted that I didn't not let dd have it. The vaccination interferes with testing for TB and it's not very effective at preventing it.

I don't think I've ever said that Americans don't care about their children's well being. I used to live in the US and I have plenty of friends and family there as does DH. I do think that their vaccine schedule is a bit OTT though.

I don't know how you can not think that this sentence says exactly that: "We dont need to vaccinate against the pox. Unlike in America, where the reason is because parents cant afford 2 weeks off work."

I didn't say that but actually it doesn't suggest that people don't care about their children's welfare. It just says that they can't afford to take that much time off work.

no, it says that the reason people vaccinate is because they can't afford to take the time off work. That's not why people vaccinate. They vaccinate so their children don't get sick. The government who is supposed to look after society's needs, also considers the lost work cost of vaccinating when costing out whether to use a particular vaccination. But that's government's (UK or US) job.

"You seem to be concerned about quite a few illnesses. Do you suffer from health anxiety?"

Er.. would the illnesses that I am 'concerned' about be the same ones you listed in your post, perchance?

You may even say that me mentioning them was in response to said post. An 'answer', if you will.

Apart from my response to your post, the only illness I have discussed on this thread is CP/shingles, as per the OP. It's a little churlish then to try and imply that I have a health anxiety in a misplaced attempt to patronise and belittle.

Which is a shame, as I was enjoying the discussion.

LeonieDelt, I have the complete opposite opinion to yours. And also have had the complete opposite experience. My ds has some chronic illnesses. In England they went completely undiagnosed and I spent an inordinate amount of time in doctors' offices and a&e. In the USA, where, because of my low income, my children have health insurance provided by the State (I pay a nominal fee of a few dollars every month), I have had access to top hospitals, doctors, specialists and surgeons. My son's illnesses have been diagnosed in a timely fashion, he has received all the referrals he needed in a timely fashion, and best of all, it seems that they may have even found an effective (side effect free) treatment for his condition.

It was imperative that my ds not be around people who were unvaccinated and therefore more likely to catch illnesses that for them might not be serious, but for my ds would be. That wasn't my reason for leaving the UK and coming back to the USA, but it sure was a great unintended consequence.

I'm not trying to patronise you. You just seemed very keen to vaccinate against everything (including typhoid and the common cold) I wouldn't have thought that people would consider risking a vaccination for an illness/disease (because every vaccine carries a risk) unless they were genuinely concerned about their child getting ill and having serious complications. I was wondering if you suffered from health anxiety because that would explain it.

"I wouldn't have thought that people would consider risking a vaccination for an illness/disease (because every vaccine carries a risk) unless they were genuinely concerned about their child getting ill and having serious complications."

So, from this you've extrapolated that anybody in favour of the vaccines being available- remember, at no time did I say that I would vaccinate my own children with them, save for the BCG- must have a health anxiety?

Because I would like to see a vaccine available on the NHS for all the conditions you mentioned, I must have some sort of anxiety disorder.

Right you are. Not much point trying to argue with that logic.

And to warn of the dangers of an as-yet fictitious vaccine (common cold) is hilarious

"Bumbley, I would welcome a vaccine against the common cold with open arms

Hepatitis and rotavirus, yep, add them to the schedule; typhoid was reported as making a 'comeback' a few years ago, so would not be averse to that either."

To me, this sounded like you wanted them all for your children. If someone was so concerned about their child getting sick and wanted to vaccinate against everything and anything then yes, I would think they were overly anxious. If that isn't the case and you merely want them to be available on the NHS schedule (why? So you can refuse them? )then fair enough. It was a simple question, you don't need to get ratty. I know a few people who suffer from health anxiety - it isn't that uncommon.

Re dangers of fictitious vaccine - I was talking about vaccines in general. No vaccine is risk free.

The common cold one is. I researched it. They tested it on unicorns and everything

Riiiight. So you think it is possible to develop a completely risk free vaccine then. They must be just keeping the risks in for kicks then.

My DS was vaccinated against chicken pox at a year old because we lived in the US. Last year it went round his nursery and .... you guessed it - he came down with it. Not even a mild case either - he had about 200 spots and was utterly miserable for several days. The vaccine, IMO, is useless!

Yes bumbley, that's exactly what I said. I believe it passionately. Especially the unicorn part.

I'm ignoring the unicorn part but I'm wondering what you are actually trying to say if you are not suggesting that it is possible to have a risk free vaccine. Why start with all the silly nonsense anyway? So much for having a reasonable discussion.

Juneau, at least he's immune now! How awful if you discovered that the vaccine hadn't worked for you when you were pregnant.

Ah, well that clears it up; the vaccine I was talking about is risk-free and rainbow coloured. You must have been talking about a different made-up vaccine.

Easy to confuse the two, especially if you have a disorder.

Oh ok tethers, so this risk free vaccine only exists in your imaginary world. That does clear things up a bit. Thanks. Unfortunately, in the real world it isn't possible to create a completely risk free vaccine so even if a vaccine for the common cold is ever created, it won't be risk free.