A fête worse than the Chalet School

[EmilyAlice]

Roll up, roll up!
Bid for a mortgage on the doll's house! Pin the tail on the St Bernard! Guess the weight of the handsome doctor! (Or pin the tail on the doctor and guess the weight of the St Bernard). Knit a lime green liberty bodice against the clock!
The Chalet School fête is open.....

Yes exactly! And the three obvious choices of (conveniently Catholic) godmothers are right there.

I bet you're right about the C names being vetoed by publisher, DeeWe. I'd not thought of it before but it makes perfect sense.

The godmother choice was odd. Why were Simone, Freida and Marie not the godmothers to the triplets?

I don't remember anything about the C conversation - is it in Exile? I obviously didn't find it irritating enough to remember!!

I wonder whether Elinor thought that Exile was the swansong for the Chalet School at the time she wrote it, so she crammed in as many happenings as she possibly could, with no space for long discussions of names. After all, a lot happens in the book, and her chief (and hugely admirable given the circumstances) aim seems to be to make sure the message about hating Nazism not the Germans comes across, followed by tying up loose Chaletian ends. Maybe baby names just seemed a little bit beside the point with so many big world issues going on around them, plus a series to round off. And if she didn't know then that the series would continue into the next generation, it wouldn't perhaps have seemed worthy of discussion.

I'd never thought about it, but now that you mention it, it does seem a bit strange that the obvious choices of Frieda, Simone and Marie as godmothers wasn't made. Could it be rationalised as Joey not wanting to do the obvious and expected thing?

I'm re-reading School At and I was very amused by the description of Madge at the beginning. We're told that her eyes are 'the colour of old brown sherry'. Really? Would your typical 1920s schoolgirl know what colour old brown sherry is? I certainly didn't - and don't! We're then told she has 'well-cut lips'. I wonder what makes lips well cut. Presumably it has something to do with thickness/thinness, but I'm not well-bred enough to know which kind are well-cut and which have been hacked about a bit with a craft knife. And her figure is 'as erect as a young poplar'. Are young poplars more erect than older ones? Just musing.

PS Thanks to Ms Google Images I now know the colour of old brown sherry. Brown.

OOAO? I am baffled, my loves. Clearly I have been at the back of the class, and Not Paying Attention.

Our One and Only (Mary-Lou). Don't worry, geniuses are known for being in a world of their own, so it's perfectly in character. Back you go to your six hours' daily practice.

It's a terrible curse really, being gifted like that. (AIBU or is that totally Joey's barely-veiled jealousy speaking when she says that?)

mornington yes it's in Exile : "I did try to think up three names all beginning with the same letter, but I couldn’t get anything I wanted. I’d have liked to call one “Clare,” but I couldn’t think of a single other decent name beginning with C, so I gave it up."
I do agree completely btw that more important things are happening in Exile than tedious naming parties etc (although hadn't throught of it as a possible swansong, which does make loads of sense - I suppose at that time each manuscript she submitted would have felt a bit like 'might this be the end?', which makes me all the more grateful for all the brilliant stuff which is in Exile ) BUT I can't help thinking that EBD logic would surely hold Joey's procreation as the most important event in all of history. In triplicate.
The godmother thing does not ever make sense to me and I really have tried. I can get my head around the first two but Grace Nalder is just such a random choice from nowhere and only makes sense in the context of there being basically no other viable candidate. I suppose it could be Joey being irritating and refusing to conform to what is expected of her, but it would be most unlike her to do so without any smug fanfare!

Arf at the description of Madge, which had never troubled me in the least before, but now I will no longer be able to take it seriously.

And SPEAKING of crushed dreams, a Thing to report! I am exhausted (with the headache to prove it); have been out of the office today and therefore anticipate a more-demanding-than-usual day tomorrow; also have tedious Important Event thing to attend tomorrow; and yet I cannot bring myself to go to bed. I was halfway through a chapter of some slash I am really quite enjoying writing, but I have abandoned it. For why? Why, Chalet Girls Grow Up arrived today and I just can't put it down...

Is Chalet Girls Grow Up the fanfic one where everything goes very wrong for all the major characters?

That's the one! I read it in a charity shop, but couldn't bring myself to buy it.
I think it's along the lines of OOAO runs off with Reg, Jack kills himself in an alchoholic haze and Joey discovers that everyone's been hunouring her all those year and really don't think she's the be all and end all.
It's a book full of negitivity, and just not in the Spirit of the CS.

I found that some of it would have been okay, but a whole book just felt vindictive. Bit like Eastenders really. It's not even well written. Still like Eastenders

I think there was a big row in one of the fan groups who were sent some of the less negative bits to read and thought it would be good, so promoted it heavily, and felt very betrayed when the actual thing came out.
I believe they've set up the internet to come closer to destruction with each mention of it, and if it is mentioned on their messageboard it is set up to automatically send the poster 565 000 posts all of which contain subliminal messages that JOEY IS THE SPIRIT OF THE SCHOOL, followed by automatic banning for life.

I know exactly what old brown sherry looks like.
Now my lambs, in the 1950s a bottle of very old, sweet sherry always lurked in the sideboard (the very sideboard is here with me in the chateau as we speak). It had a pungent smell and was given to unlucky visitors. There was also port (which I was allowed to have with lemonade as a treat) and gin for mixing with orange. When people had too much of any of these they became "tiddly".
Madge's brown eyes would have had golden lights in them (or something like that).
Sorry I have been quiet of late but I have been preparing the chateau for the arrival of the family and the servants seem to have gone awol.

I sort of wonder if Frieda, Marie and Simone were considered too young to be godmothers. I have a feeling that godparents were chosen then for their gravitas and/or their money. I had one who was childless and I think my parents thought it would be nice for her to have a godchild. Maybe there is something of that in Joey's choice?

Hmmm, I now feel the urge to re-read CCGU which I read when it first came out but haven't picked up in years. I seem to remember finding it utterly compelling, but I think that might partly have been because I read it in the pre- (to me, at any rate, others might have been ahead of me) fanfic and filler books days, and it was fantastic to read a story - any story - based on the CS. One thing that's stayed with me, however, is the observation someone (a man, I think) makes to someone else (ex-pupil) that OOAO did whatever it took to make her successful in whatever environment she happened to be in. That rang very true for me. Please don't send me 565 000 messages telling me however subliminaly that JOEY IS THE SPIRIT OF THE SCHOOL. I already know that, honest injun.

CGGU verdict so far. For context, I'd read the quite thorough synopsis on the NCC website (is that the one? Somewhere on the web, anyway), and ummed and ahhed a lot before deciding to read it.

1960s: it doesn't feel as vengeful as some of the reviews said. I think it's actually pretty humorous a lot of the time. I can imagine this humour is much less funny if you don't see a funny side to Joey-hate, for example. Incidentally, one of the things that put me off reading for a while was the knowledge that two of the characters I feel warmest towards are killed off v early on. Actually, I am glad for this because I think they have been spared the kitchen sink misery, perhaps deliberately. It is a bit kitchen sink ish. (Side note: it is actually three of the characters I feel warmest towards who are killed off early on. One is totally off-stage and casual though.) Margot and Con are hugely likeable. It does largely feel incredibly true to what I think of the various characters, except for ML taking Reg. ML is otherwise perfectly in character, but I can't believe she'd take someone else's husband or, frankly, look twice at Reg.

1970s: much less keen. Very kitchen sink. Child death is no fun and actually I don't really want to read that. The off-screen plot-irrelevant early death is mentioned again and now feels gratuitous and annoys me. Margot and Con remain incredibly likeable. Not really loving Sybil and Josette's appearance although arguably it fits perfectly with their final appearances in canon, where they get deprived of their expected education to trail around Australia after Madge and then marry Australians in a kind of revenge, but then I don't like that at all either. On the other hand, there are amusing moments, eg. Miss Annersley reflecting that she cannot leave the school in a crisis in spite of Nancy Wilmot dropping hints about old ladies outstaying their welcome.

Will add more thoughts as I go along! I've definitely read better fic, but it's not dreadful. It has genuinely good moments IMO but there is just too much misery all around it. Some people love that kind of thing though. I do think it's largely tongue in cheek and sort of frustrated fan seeing the problems, rather than the work of destruction I know others view it as.

The gravitas thing does make sense. I wonder if Simone, Frieda and Marie were supposed to be godmothers too, in line with there being two women and one men, but EBD decided not to mention it. Mind you, she also doesn't mention it on subsequent occasions, which is less convincing. Maybe it's the Catholic thing? Inadvisable to dwell on Catholic sacraments?

Finished it. I did find myself progressively less enthused as I went through. Eastenders is a very apt comparison. I think mainly, though, the flashes of funny grew fewer and further between and so much relentless crap stuff happens. I don't feel in the least bit that it's impacted the way I view happy-safe-cocoon canon CS, which was my great fear, but beyond the first part (the 1960s) I don't think I'd really say that I enjoyed it, either. I'll hang onto it though - suspect I'll want to read it again eventually...

Nell, I've skipped through the beginning of the first of your CGU posts because of spoilers - it's so long since I read it that I can't remember what happens at all. I'm going to read it over the weekend and replies will follow!

The summer term seems to go on a long time in School At. On St Swithin's Day (July 15th, as noted in the book), Grizel and Joey trick Gisela into passing the ceremonial cup of water to Madge as it's a 'St Swithin's Day tradition'. The next day, presumably July 16th, after the hooha with Grizel and vaselining the boards, Joey takes Dick's letter to Madge who tells her that there's only a fortnight of term left which must mean they finished on about July 30th - which accords with Madge saying to Mademoiselle on the weekend after her birthday that they had three weeks left. This seems very late to break up. Were summer holidays generally a bit later in the year back then? Or was EBD taking writer's license?

I think there are a few funny terms, time-wise. The autumn term in Mystery goes on and on forever, iirc, or one half of it does - the author of the CS Headmistress fill-in notes it in her foreword. I have a vague feeling that the Spring term in Tom is also a bit funny, although I might be inventing that. I suppose Camp might corroborate (or not) the time broken up and/or the length of the summer holidays, but it's been so long since I read it that I can't remember.

I'm nearly at the end of CGGU and I'm enjoying it. I don't think it's sneery at all. The picture of Joey is nothing that hasn't been said over and over again on this thread - that running in and out of your old school (which presupposes having to live next door to it wherever it happens to be) is rather strange behaviour in a grown woman. I think the take on Jo is very plausible. Joey's a vivacious, charismatic schoolgirl, but we're told over and over again that she's 'highly strung' which could easily be read as code for unstable. Add that to the cossetting that came with being a delicate child, and the seeds are sown for the person she becomes in CGGU - unable to empathise with others and increasingly out of touch with the world around her. I thought she had a kind interpretation of Jack, and I was really shocked by his sudden demise.

I like the way she develops the triplets, and I'm pleased that they remain likeable women who lead lives of inconspicuous success. Len's endless run of bad luck jars a bit, though, and like Nell I thought the child death was gratuitous. As the book goes on I'm not enamoured of the theme that the triplets can only see themselves as successful if they get and keep their man. I think it's way overdone, and having grown up in the woman-identified world of the CS, not to mention living in woman-identified worlds in their own ways (all-women-and-children household, working on a women's magazine and living as a nun) I'm sure that the heyday of second-wave feminism wouldn't have completely passed them by as the book suggests. But she's made them into likeable women, and I like the way they stay emotionally close to each other despite huge differences in their lives.

I don't know whether I'm sad that the School was closed, or happy that it didn't end up becoming a swanky co-educational international boarding school for the super-rich, its values becoming ever closer aligned to the corporate world. Probably the latter.

Mm, I hadn't thought about that, the second wave feminism thing. It's a good point, and food for thought. I definitely think her Joey is perfectly captured BUT I can see how it might offend, to someone who only (wants to) see Joey as EBD intends.

I do find the balance of 'nice stuff' to 'sheer misery' personally unappealing. But for the most part I think it's an entirely probable version of events. That's almost why I find it difficult in some ways - if it was out-of-character, Len's endless misery wouldn't bother me so much. I can totally see what the objections are. But lots of it made me chortle too, in recognition.

Her Jack is unexpectedly sympathetic! I really don't like him in canon.

Gosh, look at this MN thread about someone just like Grizel's father !

mormington I agree that some of the stuff isn't worse than what is said here, or probably what's written in fan fiction.

However when we're talking about it on here, I get the feeling that we're talking about a relative that we're all very fond of but, boy, can she be irritating. And everyone knows her faults, and jokes about them in an affectionate but exasperated way.
I remember at my Gran's funeral df (his dm) and his brother having that sort of conversation. No one would have doubted that they loved her, but some of the stories they were telling were very funny (like the one where my Uncle was chased up the road by her waving a bamboo cane because he'd stepped on one of her prized plants. To get the picture stictly acurate you need to realise that my gran was about 4'11" and the slowest person in the world. My uncle at the time was a father of two in his early 20s and was a sergent in the army!)

The book otoh felt more like malicious gossip. The sort of thing that someone who doesn't like you whispers about hoping all your friends will hear. Maybe just as true but told to put you in the worst possible light and only told to hurt you.

My other issue was it was marketed as a Chalet School book and almost certainly will have been ordered by people who wanted books in the same vein as the original, plus it is certainly possible that young children who loved the series could have got them without any warning. I have had to remove it twice from my dd's grasp at charity shops where she has picked it up thinking it's just an ordinary CS book. The first time she was only 8yo, and I don't think she would cope with it now at 11yo either.
It would quite likely have killed her love of the books off, as she wouldn't see it as anything but what "really happened".*

*Her imagination struggles with the difference between reality and stories at times, perhaps illustrated by the floods of tears when I told her I couldn't write for a prospectus and send her there because it didn't really exist.

Aww, poor DD DeeWe.
Yes, that is a fair point I think. I'd only become aware of it through these threads I think, or possibly elsewhere on the Internet, but definitely in the context of 'here is this particular notorious approach to the series, this is the gist of what it's about and the furore around it, proceed with caution'.

I'm still not sure I'd agree with the label 'malicious', but context is definitely everything.

I feel your daughter's pain, DeeWe!

The thing for me is that it could only ever have been written by someone who knows the books really, really well and has stayed interested in them through adulthood which means another fan - so I think I did read it as the musings of a fond relative and not as malicious. I think it's fair point about the marketing, though. Does anyone know if it pre-dated the fillers and follow-ons in 'canon' style? I certainly wasn't aware of any of them when I came across it and gleefully pounced at the end of the 90s, but I might have been late to the GGBP party.

at the Grizel's father thread, and even more that the majority of posters on the thread think it's quite OK. I don't have pots of money to leave, but I wouldn't dream of putting conditions on my DDs inheriting whatever I might happen to have by the time I pop my clogs. [wonders what my two wonderful, opionated daughters would say if I tried to make them become music teachers... might try it for fun...]

Haha! Do it mornington.

CGGU was published very early nineties - I think 1991 - and certainly Gillian which was iirc the earliest GGBP fill-in didn't come out til 2001. (Unless New Beginnings came before this? I'm not sure. But it's a pretty big gap. Speaking of New Beginnings, has anyone read it? I haven't, and I don't feel hugely inspired to - not my favourite part of the series, and godawful cover art - but I'd be interested to hear any opinions.)

Also: alternatives to CGGU? Or specifically, is it possible to imagine the CS not being put out of its misery within say 20 years max of the end of the series?
I think in the first five years or so after the end of Prefects, we'd definitely see Hilda and Nell retiring together to travel and live in Nell's cottage in Devon. Nancy would become head. Len would come straight back to teach, after Oxford? And probably Ruey would come back as PT mistress, why not. Maybe Len could be a working mother and Joey look after her quads, which would keep her happy and also keep her out of the school.