Could I as a CM tell a mum I do not like the preschool her DS goes to?

[Numberfour]

Or would that be out of line?

Reasons why I do not like it:

1. Mindee seems to go quiet when he knows that we are on our way to school
2. The preschool is in a hall and I was told today that the children have not been taken outside at all yet this term - despite this glorious weather
3. The person who runs the school never smiles at the children, hardly talks to them and appears to me to be more concerned about personal matters
4. The crafts that the children to appear to me to be particularly unimaginative (and my craft imagination is dire!)
5. The reports to parents on progress are one photocopied sheet
6. Parents are asked to make an appointment to see the head of the school or key workers if they wish to talk to them.
7. The staff appear less than enthusiastic about being there.

or is it really none of my business?

The mum is very happy with DS being with me and I do believe that she trusts my judgement but I would hate to overstep the mark and be unfairly judgemental about her choice of preschools.

As a parent (though not with a child placed with a CM) I think I'd be keen to hear your feedback on 1,2,3,4 & 7 (though maybe not all at the same time!) This is what you experience day-to-day that the parents don't have an opportunity to see.

5&6 are not really your concern IMO and might come across as your criticism of the parents' choice of pre-school.

HTH

thanks,CW. yes, that does help!

Good point, cat63, although mum chose the school and dropped her DS off there a few times before she brought him to me. So in a way it is a criticism of her choice of school. But then I believe that her DS could do better in a more stimulating environment.

Broach it gently and watch for a reaction. Also, do you have a better suggestion that has spaces? It could be unnecessarily uncomfortable if this is the only option available at the moment.

I had not thought of there not being space elsewhere, DeirdreB. Thanks for pointing that out.

Sometimes I wonder how I lived my life before I discovered MN!

Has she asked for your views?

1 that could be indicative

2 contradicting eyfs

3 that might just be their style

4 that could be because the staff are stuck in a rut

5 they are fulfilling bare minimum, so can't really critiscise that

6 the staff really should be available but I appreciate that ratios might be the reason for appointments only

7 unenthusiastic staff is a biggie

You could research alternatives before broaching with parents.

I would say something, but not sure what

No, she hasn't asked, HarriettS. But she does ask me often about how her DS played that day - not just "So how was his day?", but rather questions about whether he is playing enthusiastically or whether anything has changed at my setting that my have effected (affected?) his moods,and so on.

Something I should also bear in mind is that if the school is too far away or starts too early, I may not be able to drop her DS off.

harriet, part of working in partnership is holding the best interests of the children at heart and a concern about other settings attended is valid

It might seem like interfering or poking nose in

I would want to know! As a parent. Definitely. I would hope my cm would not delay in communicating this to me. Of course, she will take it as your opinion and she might have other opinions and not believe you but at least you told her what you saw.
It's tricky, though because there are some parents who have their own ideas about things and might feel offended that you are saying not so nice things about their child's preschool...
Well, I'd still like to know. I value my cm, think she's very wise, a lot of experience and would certainly value her opinion.

Boysarelikedogs

You assumed totally the wrong thing.

I was just asking out of interest.

We've had nannies who had the main contact with DD1s preschool (is why I asked). And I have sought their feedback on how it's going/their feelings about the place. I would want it. What I can't decide is whether your thoughts are a bit subjective and whether she could not have a different reaction to their attitude etc.

More detail on 4 and 7 please!

oh I so sorry harriet, we get a bit defensive too quickly

I AM so sorry, can't even sodding type legibly today

grrrr

you could/should just mention it in a "ds doesn't seem to really want to go, are the staff always so miserable" or something equally subjective like that.

then she can probe further with ds, and/or with you

if she chooses not to, then you have simply voiced what you witness and not an opinion on what she should/shouldn't do.

I have a CM and I would definitely want to know - I certainly wouldn't take it as a criticism of my choice of pre-school but then my CM is actualy a very good friend so maybe that is different. I would say, be open and honest and she will appreciate it.

No problem!

OP what other alternatives are there in your area as well, that she could conceivably use? And that you oculd, as you say, still take the child to.

You sound professional and views well-considered. I'm just amazed when people's views of different places vary as widely as they do (i.e. nurseries, play groups, schools, nannies, etc). Which is why it's difficult to advise you on what to say to the parent. Although if mine had some concerns I would want to know.

Harriet, I am worried that my thoughts are too subjective! I would not send my son there and I wonder if that's the reason I want to say something.

More re 4: some of the crafts are way above the ability of the children. I do not want to give too much detail because it make the school identifiable. Cannot really explain this one without giving away details. Will think more and reply later.

More re 7. There are VERY few smiles from the staff members. The head always meets and greets also without a smile. Sometimes while talking about her personal matter, she does not even say hello to the children that come in. The staff do not display that overly expressive way that many childcare practitioners have with children when talking to them. In fact, I am not sure I have seen a staff member talk to the kids! But that could be because of the design of the building and how we drop off and collect.

I am now tending towards thinking may be I should just leave it alone and that my concerns are too subjective.

I would mention it in a low-key way. I know that my CM doesn't rate the pre-school that DD2 goes to, but for me, the convenience of it being right across the road outweighs that.

She didn't explain it to me specifically, it just came up in conversation when she was explaining why she didn't send her DS there.

Is the craft the type where the staff do most of it, and direct the children - 'the eye goes here' that kind of thing

How long has he been there? Have they had a parents meeting yet?

Can you leave it another term?

If you think the DC is frustrated by the work you need to say something. My DD came home with half coloured sheets which looked a bit advanced but I just put it down to a bit of laziness - here's a worksheet during a bit of down time, do what you can. When she started with a page of the alphabet for her to copy out, at just under three, we said something as she was stressed by it.

yes, BALD - that's what i mean!

Not sure really how long he has been at the school, Harriet. If I did mention it, I would suggest changing him from Sept anyway, so she may well leave it for another term.

Bramshott, it may be a convenience factor to some extent for mum to send the child there but I do the drop offs and collections.

There was mention made of a parent / teacher session but I am not sure if mum went.

well you could definitely say something like "i was surprised they don't go outside at all, why is that?" and see what she says.

that's not subjective
that's a fact
but you have to say it in a non-judgey way!

that is definitely adult led rather than child led, so another reason to be concerned

from the NAtional Strategies

What Creative Development means for children

• Creativity is about taking risks and making connections and is strongly linked to play.
• Creativity emerges as children become absorbed in action and explorations of their own ideas, expressing them through movement, making and transforming things using media and materials such as crayons, paints, scissors, words, sounds, movement, props and make-believe.
• Creativity involves children in initiating their own learning and making choices and decisions.
• Children's responses to what they see, hear and experience through their senses are individual and the way they represent their experiences is unique and valuable.
• Being creative enables babies and children to explore many processes, media and materials and to make new things emerge as a result.

I def should have expressed utter HORROR at the kids not being taken outside today. It is absolutely beautiful here today

BALD, thanks for that link. It is very useful.

A bit off topic: I have been led to believe that colouring in ready made pictures is also not "child led enough". Would you also say that? I remember loving colouring in as a child and most of my minded kids love doing it too - especially if I print something off the pc that they have requested. Perhaps the fact that they request it makes it child led?