New Nanny - Teething Worries

[Spikesmum]

Hi there
I am returning to work on Monday, leaving my 7 month old DS with a live in nanny, who arrived two weeks ago. I have some niggling concerns, and since I am new to this, wondered if anyone could help me consolidate them?

1. Upon arrival, I gave our nanny a "manual" for DS, giving info about food, routine, washing etc. She is not doing some of the things in the prescribed way. The important stuff that she has ignored, I have addressed. Am I petty to insist that she does DS's laundry in the way I have asked (and not to mix colours/whites, not to tumble dry everything instead of air drying)?

1. I have a couple of pre-planned (and paid for) activities lined up for DS during the week and the nanny is free to do what she likes for the rest of the time. There's a kitty of cash at her disposal. How much is reasonable to leave her with, on a weekly basis with a 7 month old, not including transport? I pay her mileage separately and have paid for her car insurance.

1. Also, how much is reasonable for a nanny to spend on lunch out for herself, with a seven month old - if there is loads of food at home and she has the run of the fridge/larder (and she has taken a packed lunch for DS)?

I guess we are just bedding in together but I want to strike the balance between not micro managing and not being taken for a ride!

Thanks for reading and sorry for the long questions.

Thanks for all of the messages. Nanny and I have had a nice chat over supper last night and I have re-clarified my feelings towards laundry/kitty etc. I think everything will be cool now....thanks for the support!

I agree with most of what has already been said on here. But I wouldn't ask the nanny not to tumble dry because I could never be arse to hang up clothes myself. And as a rule of thumb, if I wouldn't do it, I won't ask nanny to do it. There are exceptions to this rule but generally speaking I try to apply it.

Also, I wouldn't approach the spending by limiting activities. I would just say here is £70 per month for you to spend as you like. If she spends it all in two weeks, then she will have to be very frugal for the remaining weeks. My nanny doesn't actually need to spend any money to get through the week. But life is a bit cosier if she does. They all have a (nice) gym membership, she has a bus pass, and there are a variety of paid for activities (which I pay separately). Byt just saying here is your x amount of £££ you are giving her some flexibiloity to make her own choices but also keeping your busget under control. It think you'll both be happier this way. Obviously there are some limits. If she was spending all the money on McDonalds and then had nothing to take them swimming or to the library I'd introduce her to Nutrition Geschtapo personilty. But I avoid all this by signing them up for and paying for the things that are important to me. And then she can do whatever she likes with the rest of the week. My kids are a bit older. So you probably haven't found a lot of activities for a 7 month old.

Thanks again to everyone for their advice last month. We are working hard to build a good relationship with our nanny. I continue to have niggling concerns, and in the past two days, a couple of things have come up. What do you think to these?

1. I had prepared a meal for our baby and fed it to him over the weekend. There were leftovers. In passing I said to the nanny that she should give them to him for lunch today. She told me that she would not as she did not think the meal was suitable for a 7 month old. We cook everything from scratch and he eats what we eat - no salt/sugar at all and he has never had jars of food. I am in the food business (Chef) so I know bit about nutrition, honestly - nothing wrong with the food. Is it OK for the nanny to decline such a specific request, is it not ultimately my decision and responsibility? I was livid that she thought I would ever do anything to hurt our baby!

1. When addressing the above issue this evening, at the end of our chat she told me she had borrowed money from the kitty. She will pay it back at the end of the week. The kitty is now empty - over £70 is adrift (I did not know this at the time). Is it common for nannies to do this? I am not at all comfortable to be "told" that she was borrowing the cash.

I feel that there are some trust issues creeping in and I am not sure if I am being over-emotional - should I just get a grip?

1. Difficult one - if I honestly thought, as a nanny, that it wasn't suitable for a 7 month old I wouldn't risk feeding them the food but I would never presume to tell parents what to feed their child (unless they specifically asked me advice). It would have been more tactful for nanny to say that she wasn't comfortable feeding him that and maybe she could prepare X, Y or Z instead? It is your decision but the nanny shares the responsibility and personally I would reserve the right to refuse to do anything I wasn't comfortable with.

If you look at it another way, slightly extreme, say a family lock children in their rooms as a primary method of discipline and have told nanny to do the same. Nanny is not happy with this - is she right to refuse even if it is not harming the child?

1. Absolutely not on and if I were a nanny employer the first issue would become completely irrelevant because, unless she asked you BEFORE borrowing it's theft, and theft is gross misconduct so instant dismissal in my contract.

1. If the nanny could give you a genuine and sensible reason for not feeding your dc the prepared meal then fine. If not, she should have done as she was asked! How old is she? I suppose if she's recently trained ( assuming she is trained ) she might be of the ' thou must feed your baby mushed veg until they are 1 cos that's what we were taught at college'.

1. Definately not and £70! I would give a verbal warning on that one if you think she is worth hanging on to. I suppose she did tell you she'd borrowed it rather than say she'd spent it on various activities. Has she been paid yet? I know when I came back from travelling and had to wait a month to be paid ( quite rightly obviously ), a lot went on my credit card but I certainly wouldn't have 'borrowed' it without asking!

1. I wouldn't be happy about - if you've cooked the food you know the salt levels etc, can't think of any food that a 7 month old shouldn't have (I think we may have kept ds off egg until 9 months but that was it).

1. That is theft. I would be 'having trust issues' and considering looking for a new nanny. She is in your home with your valuables and baby, you have to be able to trust her not to help herself to stuff. (Oh and with a baby I never left that much in the kitty to begin with - top it up to £20 a week max (and prepay as many activities as you can).

Nanny is in her 30s and NNEB trained. Food in question is baked beans (low salt/sodium/sugar). And we are paying her weekly still, to assit with her cash flow. Not what we agreed, but she seems to need the money.

I think you should go with your gut instinct. If you feel you can't trust your nanny then I think you should let her go. There are plenty of good nannies out there who would not abuse your trust.

1. The nanny I feel could object if it were not fit for human consumption... so in the case of a self prepared meal something that had been sitting around for many days and smelt a bit odd with green mould on. But that isn't the case here... so can't see why she would refuse. You had already indicated that he had the food at the weekend, so is in your view capable of digesting it without chocking... plus I presume it was still fit for consumption.

Ultimately if you are not present, then it is I feel the nannies decision what to feed your child. But that is due to insurance reasons - so nanny can refuse to feed food they feel is unfit for consumption. However I don't feel they can object purely on grounds that it isn't something they would cook.

Oh and reading your later post... refusing to give baked beans, why would she object... the beans are well cooked so are soft. Were they tinned, or homemade? Maybe your nanny doesn't liked tinned food!

1. How is the kitty being administrated? Is the kitty being given weekly, or monthly? If monthly, could it be done weekly... so there isn't as much to take without prior authorisation. If she was stuck for money she should have asked, not used the kitty.

"She will pay it back at the end of the week." Hmm... what if she doesn't? Now that the kitty is empty, how will your son do any activities this week? Is she now expecting an advance, or wanting to avoid taking him out anywhere that charges?

Is it common for nannies to do this?

No. If you give a nanny a monthly kitty which they can decide as they see fit how it is spent, they may spend a chunk of it on a more costly activity, then do lower budget things... or may pre-pay for some things (I get membership cards for places we visit often, as works out cheaper than paying every time). They don't however use it to pay their own bills... or whatever she has used it for - did she say?

I am not at all comfortable to be "told" that she was borrowing the cash.

That's the crunch of it. It's not the fact that she wanted to borrow it... it's that she didn't ask, prior to taking it. If she had come to you and say that she was going to be kicked out of her home unless she paid x amount by 7pm this evening (or something like that) then you may have given her an advance on her salary, or let her borrow from the kitty money. But she didn't ask.

Your employees money troubles are not your issue. However taking money from you without consent is an issue and needs to be tackled. How I'm not entirely sure... first thing is to make sure the money is repaid. Then cut the kitty money, so there isn't as much available to borrow.

Thinking about it... is Theft mentioned in the gross misconduct section of your nannies contract? If so then it is grounds for instant dismissal.

You could make it a written warning, or as EBB suggests a verbal warning.

you said you prepared a meal and then asked nanny to use the leftovers - so all the child had to eat was baked beans and the nanny refused? [hmmm]

borrowing/taking without asking is theft!!

You said you prepared the meal from scratch but left the child baked beans so I assume you made the beans ie cooked beans and then made a tomarto sauce?. Prehaps nanny thought they were tinned baked beans? I certainly would not give a 7 month old child tinned baked beans so unless you explained they were home prepared in a home made sauce I would agree with nanny. On the 2nd point I agree with other posts. That is theft and telling you in a casual way does not diminish that fact. On that basis alone I would get rid of the nanny.

I totally disagree. This is your child and she is your employee. You gave her explicit instructions and she refused to carry them out. This is covered in my nanny contract in the immediate dismissal section under the word "insubordination". I don't agree with everything my boss ask me to do. But, I do it because he is my boss and he pays me to do what he tells me to do (within the limits of my employment contract of course).

I once had a nanny who didn't like the way I asked her to feed DD. I realised months down the line that was doing things her way in my absense and I was truly livid. She refused to feed DD eggs for thing in themorning because she believed the first meal of the day should be 75% carbohydrate. I disagreed and quite frankly it didn't matter why. I paid her to look after DD as I asked, and not to make her own decisions. I appreciate that the believed her way was best. But, she lost sight of the fact that I was the mother and therefore had every right to make the parental decisions I saw fit.

The kitty is obviously not on. I would limit kitty top ups to £20. When it is gone, put another £20 in it. And have a record book where she is required to itemise everything spent and attach receipts.

However, in the long term, I think you should be considering that this nanny relationship is comming to an end. These are huge issue and not minor niggles. I would have a serious chat with her, I would give her a written warning about "borrowing" money from the kitty. And I would make it very clear that I expect her to as I instruct and refusal to so is insubordination.

I should add that obviously I don't know whether insubordination is in your contract under grounds for immediate dismissal. If it is not in yours, I suggest you put it in your next nanny contract. I put it in mine after the nanny who refused to give eggs in the morning left. Live and learn...

my dc love dippy eggs/fried eggs for breakie -athene I would have no problem in feeding your dc eggs

op does sound that you are not happy with this nanny, you have had her for a few weeks and already is borrowing stealing

I have to admit it had never even occurred to me that eggs were somehow inappropriate for breakfast.

Now, OP, I wan to know how to make home made beans. I'm thinking one might start with bean and ummm.. tomatoes... what next?

I have been a sole charge nanny for 23 years, most of my positions I have had are with babies at the start and so advise my bosses how to wean. However, if I had gone into work on a monday morning and my boss said we had xxx for lunch and the leftovers are in the fridge for the boys, I would feed it too them, it is their child, they pay me and I do as they ask!!!

The kitty thing is stealing!! I would never, ever borrow money from the kitty. If I was feeling a little strapped for cash, I would ask for a sub on my wages. (Or ask my dad!)

Nothing wrong with baked beans be they freshly prepeared or tinned, it is the OP child and as they weren't a new food it isn't an issue, now had they contained nuts/shellfish i could see some reasoning but even then the attitude is wrong.

As for the Borrowing of the kitty that is plain and simple Theft and immediate dismissal.

Spikesmum, you really don;t sound happy ( with just cause) with this person so i would look at a change of carer for your son.

Blimey. Dipping into the kitty within a month of starting work?

Sorry, but IMO she needs to go. Regardless of what your contract states, you can let an employee go within the first 12 months of employment for whatever reason you like so long as it is not discriminatory. So it is not a problem if you do want to let her go. Personally I would fire her, because the trust has broken down. Would you have found out about the kitty money if she hadn't told you?

Out of interest, what did her previous employers say about her?

Start the day on an egg athene! I hate them, but they are good nutritious breakfast food.

Baked beans are fine - as someone else said it would have been if it was nuts/shellfish/anything else you're advised not to give a very young baby that she would have been right to refuse!

Leaving that issue completely to one side, fire her for theft. It's completely not on and with the next nanny limit the kitty to something less.

athene-did you read my reply on mp post

my ex mb now gives my ex charges for breakie

chocolate spread on white bread

used to have cereal, toast, fruit, egg etc from me

SPIKESMUM what are you doing to do - keep or sack thief nanny?

No, what thread is that? I hope you called social services. In fact I think what MN really needs is a "Should nanny call Social services on nutritionally negligent 'mother'" thread. And be sure to put mother in quotes.

Thanks everyone for your posts. My DH talked to the nanny this AM about where the money had gone. She told him she could account for it all, insinuating that she had spent it on my DS. I'd set her a limit of £20 a week but put in £70 for a humidifier that she was going to get from Mothercare. No humidifier has transpired.

So the general consensus from you all is that I should ask the nanny to leave, which I think I am going to do. I have no problem with the actual deed. A bit more advice please, though . 1. What is the quickest, safest, best way to find a new nanny? I used an agency for our current lady and obviously won't use the same one again. She did have fab references, btw. Which is sort of why I was in doubt about the whole situation. 2. Current nanny is live in. So if she gets fired, I make her homeless. What time-frame should I ask her to follow to move out? I will pay her her notice period (one week) but obv would rather that she doesn't stay in the house. In her contract it does say she should quit as soon as employment is terminated.

MANY THANKS, you have been so helpful.

Considering that she stole, and then lied about it, I wouldn't leave her alone in the house from the time I informed her she was leaving until she actually left.

Do you know if she has somewhere to go, or will you truly be making her homeless (although really I think she made herself homeless).

I would stear clear of agencies. I think they are a waste of money, as your experience demonstrates. I would put an ad in nannyjob and maybe greataupair.com. And then I would check them myself. I have a questionnaire if you want it.

athene duh - reliesed it was in an email i sent to mp - not on here im blonde

spikesmum so she showed you receipts for £20 but not the £50 she borrowed stole?

no reason why you cant use same agency - infact as your nanny has been there less than a month, they should find you a replacement free of charge/refund your fee considering they found you a nanny who is a thief!!!

if notice says a week then think you have to give her a week to find new lodgings