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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

Original poster

Childcare and working - WWYD?

65 replies

Wittyname10 · 13/10/2023 12:43

I've received lots of helpful advice here in the past and am coming to the wise sages of mumsnet for more help.

I work in a job that is seasonal, think 5 months of busy/on the phone/sales etc, 7 months of being relatively quiet, with spreadsheets and lots of desk-based work.

My wife and I have 2 kids, 2.5 yo boy and 4.5 year old girl. Daughter will be going to school in August - Scotland - and son will be starting nursery in February when he turns 3.

For various reasons we are now on to our third childminder in our rural setting. They are very limited in number and the ones we have fill up very quickly.

Current childminder who looks after my son had to give up caring for our daughter as she was having to do school runs of her own and sending over an hour each way dropping off/picking up my daughter and her kids, with my son spending way longer than she was happy with in the car.

I have been WFH on Mondays and Tuesdays so I can drop the kids off and pick my daughter up from nursery at 3pm, my wife picking up my son on her way home from work at 5pm.

When I get home at 3.10 with my daughter she has TV for an hour or so, and then busies herself with activities, colouring and painting or imaginative play etc.

I was called in to my line manager this morning to discuss the situation, as this WFH is not contracted, but has been something everyone has been doing since COVID. The company even consulted on hybrid working to assess how it was working for everyone and approved to continue the hybrid set up.

My situation was approved - unofficially - by my line manager who said if asked he cannot lie, but won't mention anything to senior managers.

I was told this morning it has been questioned, with a screenshot being sent of me appearing to be "away" (MS teams) for over an hour. I was not privvy to when this was but I could have been on my mobile/having lunch etc. The point is that there are times where I'm not active on Teams and sometimes maybe take a longer coffee break than I would at the office if I'm WFH when theres not a lot happening work-wise (this time of year is what we call the "dead zone" between sales ending and end of year things starting).

Now I should point out that when I WFH I am online usually an hour before I need to be to accommodate the school run, will respond to emails after working hours etc, so I'm trying to re-pay the company in terms of time because they are (were) accommodating my needs.

I was told this morning that a potential promotion in the next year is being reconsidered as I am perceived to not be flexible enough to do the job that is coming up. It will involve a lot of travel, and I'm being told that me needing to be at home for school runs 2 days a week inhibits my ability to do the job.

We will not be able to find any childcare options, wraparound care has cost us 2 childminders already and isn't really an option. Everyone is full, including the private nurseries around us.

Family are close to us, but it's unfair to expect them to step in for 2 days a week - particularly my BIL as they have 3 kids of their own so couldn't take their kids and ours to/from nursery/school in 1 run anyway.

My wifes parents are retired and are busy people, they already do a day per week of childcare for us as well as various bits and bobs of childcare for my BIL's 3 kids.

My parents are 80 miles away, so I'd be asking them to come through weekly to do about 8 hours of childcare over 2 days.

My wife is already working her minimum hours at work and cannot do any less than her 3.5 days per week.

Sorry this is so long, I didn't want to leave anything out.

My options are:

1 - I tell work I have explored every option and this is literally all I can do, accepting it will effectively rule me out of an opportunity that will not come around again in the next possibly 30 years and make do with hat I've got.

2 - I tell work I need more flexibility and if they cannot provide this I will be looking elsewhere.

3 - Place an unfair burden on my family in order to advance my career

4 - Ask my wife to look for a job that can allow her to drop more time, which we could just about manage financially, but she'd be dropping a whole day at work to pick up the kids at 3pm which seems total overkill.

5 - anything else?

This is a nightmare, so thank you for reading and contributing. All opinions welcome.

OP posts:
Namechange13101 · 13/10/2023 14:01

Does your employer have a WFH policy? Ours states that you can't WFH and be in charge of the care of children under 8 years old unless in an emergency (e.g. kid off sick and no alternative) so i would day that expecting your employer to be ok with you WFH 3-5pm with no childcare is unreasonable even if its been sanctioned as ok by your line manager.

So initially i'd be looking at asking for a formal flexible working request to clock off at 3pm on those days and make up the hours another time when either your wife is at home or tagging those hours onto office days.

With the promotion presumably you'd have to apply for it? You could ask then the expectations of the role as if they genuinely require you to travel and be in the office more then you are going to have to come up with a robust childcare solution like the rest of us do by weighing up presumably the benefit of your pay rise against your wife picking up the additional childcare by changing jobs or her hours.

Equally peoples circumstances change all the time so i'd make sure you are down on waiting lists for wraparound care/nurseries as i'm sure something will come up.

Ponderingwindow · 13/10/2023 14:22

This is being a parent.

i have formalized with work that I do the school run. That comes with potential impacts on my career. You just have to accept that a promotion may not be in the cards for you right now.

They are not wrong that you have no way of handling a a heavy travel schedule. Officially, it probably shouldn’t be the employer who doesn’t offer you the job. It should be you who turns it down because you know you can’t meet the demands.

jannier · 13/10/2023 15:51

Do you take your lunch break when you do school pick up? Why do you take longer coffee breaks that makes no sense when your asking them to be flexible and will upset other team members.

BoohooWoohoo · 13/10/2023 15:57

Is your job linked to your rural home location? I would move to a place where childcare was more available.

Persipan · 13/10/2023 16:03

How come one of the options here is 'tell my wife to look for another job' but none of the options is to look for another job yourself?

Caffeinequeen91 · 13/10/2023 16:07

@Persipan his option 2 was him getting another job.

do the school offer any kind of wraparound childcare? Ask them about to consider it.

DH and I both work compressed hours to get a day off. Could you compress hours and work longer days on your wife’s days off?

Bibbitybobbitty · 13/10/2023 16:13

You need to either look at moving closer to more childcare options or accept that at present your chances of promotion are going to be reduced. It's surprising you company allow you to do childcare while wfh as most don't

Original poster
Wittyname10 · 13/10/2023 16:32

Option 2

OP posts:
Original poster
Wittyname10 · 13/10/2023 16:33

Persipan · 13/10/2023 16:03

How come one of the options here is 'tell my wife to look for another job' but none of the options is to look for another job yourself?

Option 2.

OP posts:
Original poster
Wittyname10 · 13/10/2023 16:39

Thanks for the contributions everyone, re the childcare - its an informal arrangement and its something that supposedly happens elsewhere in the company, we have lots of people with kids working remotely and there are suspicions - not just from me - that this goes on elsewhere.

Moving isn't really an option as we are on a fixed mortgage for another couple of years and moving to a similar house in a more populous area would be more expensive and mean remortgaging at a higher interest rate. We have genuinely considered downsizing since the start of the COL crises but were able to make changes to afford to stay where we are.

OP posts:
Original poster
Wittyname10 · 13/10/2023 16:40

jannier · 13/10/2023 15:51

Do you take your lunch break when you do school pick up? Why do you take longer coffee breaks that makes no sense when your asking them to be flexible and will upset other team members.

I do yes, and by longer I mean maybe a couple of minutes with my phone and headset on so that if I am needed I don't miss anything.

OP posts:
OhamIreally · 13/10/2023 17:14

You don't have to be actively using Teams for it to keep your active status though. If it's showing you as away for an hour then that's because you haven't made a keystroke or moved your mouse for over an hour.

As another option could you get an au pair?

BoohooWoohoo · 13/10/2023 17:19

Look up videos on how to fake your Teams status so it looks like you're online. (I've seen these on social media)

UniKnow · 13/10/2023 20:34

@Wittyname10 - what do you want your employer to do?

SecondUsername4me · 13/10/2023 20:40

I think for a lot of people (read women) their career slows for a bit while the dc are young.so you don't get this promotion now? OK. There is time to climb the ladder when the dc need less hands on care

coronafiona · 13/10/2023 20:44

5- carry on as you are?

SheilaFentiman · 14/10/2023 07:48

When you said there wouldn’t be another chance at promotion for 30 years, was that a typo? Did you mean 3?

Original poster
Wittyname10 · 14/10/2023 09:10

UniKnow · 13/10/2023 20:34

@Wittyname10 - what do you want your employer to do?

I guess be a bit more sympathetic to the circumstances? I need them to be flexible for 4 hours a week which I’m being told is killing chances of promotion.

I don’t know. I think one of the main issues with my company is that all the senior managers either haven’t got kids or when they did it was 30 years ago and their wives stayed at home to do the childcare duties.

OP posts:
Original poster
Wittyname10 · 14/10/2023 09:13

SheilaFentiman · 14/10/2023 07:48

When you said there wouldn’t be another chance at promotion for 30 years, was that a typo? Did you mean 3?

No I meant up to 30, it’s a regional management job that is an excellent opportunity for the right person. Equally it could be as little as 5 years if the person who comes in is an older head who’s closer to retirement.

OP posts:
Original poster
Wittyname10 · 14/10/2023 09:14

coronafiona · 13/10/2023 20:44

5- carry on as you are?

I’m leaning towards telling them I don’t want to be considered for promotion and I’m happy in my current role as the timing isn’t right for me and my family.

I think eventually I would move on if I had to do this.

OP posts:
Original poster
Wittyname10 · 14/10/2023 09:17

OhamIreally · 13/10/2023 17:14

You don't have to be actively using Teams for it to keep your active status though. If it's showing you as away for an hour then that's because you haven't made a keystroke or moved your mouse for over an hour.

As another option could you get an au pair?

Hmm if I’m really honest with myself I could have been off my computer for that length of time. It’s my own fault for not being attentive enough but it was a one off. But when you’re WFH and there is nothing to do I don’t think you should be expected to sit at your desk waiting for something to come across it.

I go for a run/walk/cycle for my lunch break and take lunch at my desk so it was probably tied to lunch break and then having nothing much to do either side of it.

OP posts:
UniKnow · 14/10/2023 09:42

I guess be a bit more sympathetic to the circumstances?

But they are being sympathetic to your circumstances. They are allowing (or at least turning a blind eye to) you to work from home on two set days a week while caring for a young child (many employers wouldn’t allow this as it’s not fair on anyone - I wouldn’t and consider myself very reasonable). But they are saying that if you want to be considered for an area management role this won’t be possible as the role requires more flexibility. Now you know this you can decide whether you want to find a solution to your childcare issues or accept that you can’t do an area management role. I live in an area with insufficient childcare so I completely understand how hard it is. But ultimately this isn’t your employees fault or problem.

FallingAutumnLeaf · 14/10/2023 09:50

If the extra travel came off, what would you do regarding childcare on the days that you would normally do the school collection but you are at a client?

I think travel with the amount if childcare you have available to you would be very stressful, and you need to consider that before going for a promotion.

SecondUsername4me · 14/10/2023 09:58

I guess be a bit more sympathetic to the circumstances? I need them to be flexible for 4 hours a week which I’m being told is killing chances of promotion

I don't intend this to sound nasty, but it's so bloody refreshing to see a man on the receiving end of this, as I know so so many women whose careers have stagnated as they need to be flexible for their families.

Welcome, OP. It sucks. But it's actually the norm for working mums.

EggTheParrot · 14/10/2023 10:44

SecondUsername4me · 14/10/2023 09:58

I guess be a bit more sympathetic to the circumstances? I need them to be flexible for 4 hours a week which I’m being told is killing chances of promotion

I don't intend this to sound nasty, but it's so bloody refreshing to see a man on the receiving end of this, as I know so so many women whose careers have stagnated as they need to be flexible for their families.

Welcome, OP. It sucks. But it's actually the norm for working mums.

Where does op specify they're a man?

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