So against all my better judgement (see earlier threads) I am preparing to CONSIDER a nanny with her own child, please advise me what to think about...

[flowerybeanbag]

Having started a thread bemoaning the fact that a seemingly good candidate suddenly announced as we were arranging an interview that she would need to bring her child with her, I am considering a different nanny who will want to do the same.

Despite initial instincts that this arrangement wouldn't work for us I am considering it this time because -

1.The nanny in question was extremely up front about it from the start. Always a winner with me.
2.Her child is almost the exact same age as DS.
3.She acknowledged immediately that I would have concerns and wants the opportunity to address them. Good attitude.
4.She's very experienced.
5.I'm desperate, no one else wants to work for me.

I need to know what to consider, so far I have the following on a list of things to iron out.

How will she take both children out walking or in car, we have no double buggy, only one car seat, need to hear her proposal for this.
What or how much other equipment will we need to store for her child?
What about routines for two children if they don't coincide?
Where will her child nap?
What food does her child eat - DS is BLW so he doesn't do purees or anything.

Is there anything else I need to worry about/consider?

TIA

Well you can't ask her, but I would wonder - what if she has another!

Yes I thought that, but no, can't ask!!

You need to address/discuss things like:

What would happen if her child were ill?
What kind of salary is she expecting?
Would she provide food, nappies etc for her child
Has she taken her child to work with her before? If so what were the advantages, disadvantages and issues?

The fact she was so up front is a big plus IMHO.

Yes there are potential pit-falls but if you both sit down & thrash them out(as she seems willing to do) then if she is as good as you feel she is try it out?

Would she still expect fullpay? Not sure how this works wages wise?

conflict between your child & hers (not now but later)
conflict between your rules for your son & her rules for her son
Will she wake her child to take your child out (to something you have arranged eg toddler group/dentist appt)
What if her child is allowed/not allowed food that your child is

Oooh just thought of another one!

How does her little one react when they have to share her time and attention with another child?

Does she find it challenging juggling the needs and demands of her child, with those of another she is taking care of?

This is great stuff, thanks a lot!

I have often been asked in interviews about my plans for having babies. I don't think it'd be too out of line to ask her.

I'm 27, comign up to 28 and live with my boyfriend. People do ask... "if you like kids so much, aren't you thinking about having some of your own?"

It seems even more reasonable to ask somoene who already has a child if she's planning another. Of course, she won't admit it happily if she is ("Yeah, I figured - work for you for a year then get maternity pay while I pop out another one...") but you can probably read between the lines.

I guess a lot depends on the age of your DC, my 2 year old charge is at the age where he is playing very considerately with others, but he does have older siblings...

flowery
I met with a woman recently, more for ad hoc care, who has a child. She was lovely and it did make me consider whether I could change my mind too.

Scheduling would have proved a big problem with the arrangement - we need someone who can come early, and with say a couple hours' notice (sometimes less) stay late due to our jobs. Sometimes over an hour. It was clear this wouldn't work with the nanny and child. I would want to know how flexible she could be on hours, given her own child's schedule.

Secondly, when it came to activities, while it was great that our kids were compatible ages, her daughter was going to be going to a preschool in a completely different part of town to ours. Wasn't clear how she would manage that. If your arrangement is long term(don't know how old your child is), is there anything similar which could come up and be an issue?

If you are paying full nanny rates, you shouldn't have to compromise on anything, in my opinion. Compromise means a nanny share and therefore a discount. I personally wouldn't let her talk you round this.

Flowery where are you based?

By the way, I'm quite paranoid about things like this, but I wouldn't ask about whether she's planning another child soon.

meet her and talk by all means... but this is fraught with difficulty. if the dc's are the same age there will almost certainly be periods of rivalry and conflict..... my problem would be it blurs the boundaries.... nanny's job should be to put your dc's interests first at all times (but is this realistic if those interests conflict with her child's? nanny's job is to follow your instructions about how dc's are to be cared for (discipline / eating etc),even if her personal views are different.... is this realistic? but what ithe illness thing is a biggie too....and two small people trashing YOUR living room... think v carefully won' t you?

Does the nanny have experience of caring for multiples - as two children same/similar age are very much like twins and will fight for attention.
Is nanny used to having care of 2+ children (preferably 4 or more)? Some nannies only seem to work for families with 1 child, and think that by being with that family for several years they have lots of experience. In fact they have little experience as they have experience of only one child. Good nannies will have experience of caring for lots of children over the years, in differing age groups. Don't go for a nanny who only has experience of working for families where there is just one child... make sure they have more experience than that, and ideally as the children are close in age, experience of working with twins.

Food can be a real issue, especially if say your child is vegetarian and the nannies child is a meat eater.

the real problem for me with this sort of situation is what happens with illness. If your nanny's child is ill what will she do? and actually what do you want her to do - bring an ill child to potentially infect yours or stay at home and leave you without childcare.

we've found this a real irritation - particularly as our nanny's child started nursery school whilst with us and spent the first term catching everything.

the other stuff hasn't really been an issue - but the ages are very different and her child was old enough not to need baby paraphanalia. we were fairly certain that we didn't want to keep bumping in to someone else's high chair in the kitchen or have a bin full of someone else's dirty nappies - you put up with these inconveniences for your own children but we didn't want them when we didn't have to.

our nanny is also very experienced and very good and manages the potential conflicts between her child's needs and our children's needs very well indeed so there haven't been issues.

She should provide her own car seat for her DC.

Nanny with own child = nanny share IMO with her being the other parent in the share.

So you need to ask all the questions you would when considering a share such as discipline, food, outings etc.

hi! i am a nanny who has taken my 20 month old son with me to work for the last 14 months.i have to say it has worked extremely well,both parties are more than happy! if my son has just had the sniffles,or a little cough etc,he has still come to work with me.these are things children will pick up wherever they are i.e,nursery,playgroups.if there has been conflicts ,they have been sorted out just as they would be with any 2 or 3 chidren.it honestly works ,i am living proof..give her a chance....!

This is all very helpful stuff. She does have experience with twins, babies and older, which is good. DS is almost 9mo and her DD is almost exactly the same age, so no issues with pre-schools or anything yet, but something to bear in mind as she doesn't live exactly round the corner or anything...

Harriet I am in Cambridgeshire.

Controlfreaky I will definitely think carefully - I had ruled out nannies wanting to bring own children for all those reasons. We are lucky not to need any discount that would come with that either. The trouble is the only person I have had applying without their own child is a girl with no experience or qualifications, so it's tricky. I am considering this purely because the children are same age, because I have no other realistic candidates at the moment and because this lady is very experienced including with twins. I do want to be fully aware of any potential downsides and make sure they are all discussed/addressed to my satisfaction before this goes any further.

I haven't had time to read all the other posts so forgive me if I cover the same ground.

We used to employ a nanny with her own child (often posted about it if you search MN)

Issues we found were

1. damage caused by nanny's child ie. 2 broken phone handsets, deep scratches to wood floor, stuff that is a pain if your own child does it, but is harder to swallow when it's someone elses (we just paid up for repairs but is worth thinking about)
2. nanny's family dropping off child/picking up child from our house - we had a lot more interaction with nanny's dp and family than I think we would have done if she had no child, including her dp picking up or dropping off child during the day (he worked shifts) so often heard (from local friends) that they were all out together in my car, or children would tell me that he had been sleeping on our sofa (then also found out he had a criminal record so was even less impressed). - and nanny would take my children to her house to pick up her child which meant that my children spent long time in car, I spent a fortune on diesel, and my children were exposed to nanny's mum smoking and giving them tea to drink.
3. Can nanny take both the children swimming at the same time? and if you want your child to go to tumbletots or similar, do you have to pay for hers too?
4. Who provides food for her child (we paid for child's and nanny's food because we wanted everyone to eat the same meal together) 5)Has she experience of looking after many children of same age (ours had nursery experience so was not phased by 2 or 3)
5. Naps - we provided a travel cot in the kids bedroom, but all too often I came home to find her ds sleeping in the buggy in the living room and my dd having to play 'quietly' so as not to wake him.

That probably sounds very negative - but I think I was unlucky with my particular nanny and the child gave her excuses to be doing what she wanted rather than what was best for my child. We paid her about 80-85% of the normal nanny salary because she brought ds with her and the care was shared, also provided car, car seats, buggy, cot, toys (and found that a lot of our baby stuff ended up at her house since my children are older - so I'll have to buy it again if I have a third dc!).
Oh, and we did find that if her ds had a cold/bug then she naturally put him first although she did still turn up for work. She also had 2 days off 'sick' (and paid) due to 'tiredness' because baby had not slept well (again, I think a problem with that particular nanny rather than nannys with kids in general, most mums do not take time off work because they are tired)

On the bright side, dd loved having nanny's ds around and our prime goal at the time was to keep ds (special needs) on an even keel which worked out ok.

millarkie that's very helpful - I did come across some of your posts when I did a search last night! Definitely gives me some things to get ground rules sorted about that I wouldn't necessarily have thought of!

I am an employer of a nanny with a baby.My ds and her dd are 9 months apart.

We split the cost of a double buggy with her although she was paying for it herself we offered (she actually had a side by side one but no good for our narrow pavements/local shops so bought a new one).

You shouldn't really have to store any equipment if your child and hers are the same age as long as like us she uses your travel cot (with her own bedding) and our travel highchair.

Her dd has purees she brings (My Ds was also BLW) but we will provide food for her when she is older when she eats with my 2.I think things like this means you usually can negotiate a slightly lower wage (we pay £1-2 less than the likely rate in our area for a nanny of her experience and she pays her own petrol ( no real mileage as everything is local although I would give her some if she did any bigger journeys).It is not a nanny share as she will be working for you and following your childs routines and your wishes so I wouldn't expect too much of a compromise on your part.

We haven't had an issues with her dd being ill and minor things such as colds she still brings her.

She follows my ds's routine (you are the employer so need to make sure you address this) and her dd goes to my ds's toddler groups am (we only pay for ds as arranged with the groups as they are age specific but I would expect in your situation to discuss this with your nanny)

Her dd has a nap at the same time as ds in the travel cot in the spare bedroom.If your child and hers are the same ages they may will be on the same routine anyway.I would definately ask about this.

No trashing of any rooms but she is only little..Ds doesn't go to her house and none of her family come here(she is working after all) - I would not accept Millarkie's situation and think this would be unusual.

The think the compromise is probably her flexibilty as it is harder for her having a child but we don't need too much and I know she would come or leave an hour earlier.

If she is the best one for the job I would take her on.I would expect her to have brilliant references(I have always telephoned previous employers with a list of questions, the most important being would you employ her again)

I would check over a couple of sessions first if your child and her's seem of a similar nature and compatible - my nannie's dd is much more placid than my ds so he tends to get the lion's share of attention!

Often nannies with their own children are very experienced.Mine had had care of multiple children in a family before so copes without any problem with just two.It works for us and like you I did have a choice but she was the best and I don't regret my decision.

RC&D that's so helpful, thank you. Trouble is at the moment she's the only realistic candidate, which I was hoping wouldn't be the case, I don't want to end up feeling panicked into accepting a situation I really didn't want, so I am going to talk to her and see what I think, bearing in mind all these issues, and see what happens.

Although she's really the only possible at the moment, I am lucky in that I work for myself so I don't have a deadline of when I'm going back to work that I need to sort this by, so if I'm not entirely happy I will keep looking.

thanks everyone

I think illness and flexibility are the real disadvantages to think about.

Colds - fine; chickenpox - baby needs it sooner or later; but that vomiting bug that was around over Christmas?

And one of the great advantages of a nanny for me is the smooth transition into overtime when DH and I between us are travelling and working late, so you'll need to ask her about that too. One of my colleagues has a nanny with a 1yo DS who babysits till after midnight very cheerfully, babe in travel cot, but I wouldn't fancy that myself!

We had a nanny share when DS1 was very small, which was great for him. He really loved, and still does, his nanny share friend.

I have said to my current nanny if she wants to come back to work for us after her maternity leave we will be happy to have her DC too. This is nanny-specific though, and there was no way I would have entertained that possibility with Nanny 1.

Don't want to rain on the parade, but initial reactions are usually the best ones...

What would happen/ how will you be covered if her child were to be injured or hurt while she was looking after yours...??

You want to employ and pay someone to solely look aftr your child and their interests... if this is going to be compromised this should be factored in...

fbb - it will only work if you are prepared to compromise and be laid back. we had a nanny with her own child and it was great. but I think a lot of that was because we are not the kind to worry about child-related damage or a few slices of cheese on toast.We also felt that her daughter was part of our family and that all 3 kids were to be treated the same (by both nanny, and by us) and we embraced this as a positive, learning and relationship-forming experience for all. If you're accepting a child into your house there are things that come with it. it's more then having an employee in your home. If the things that come with the child will make a parent uptight, and if they percieve the arrangement as one where their kids take priority and the other one fits around them, then it probably won;t work.

Having said that I strongly recommend it. dd2 had a playmate; I had total confidence in the nanny on issues like safety, discipline, healthy food - precisely because she was with her own child too. I could talk to her as a fellow mum, as well as nanny. I also felt that dds had the benefit of more interaction - learning to share and compromise, whilst still being, mainly, in the comfort of their own home.

make sure all the things people have mentioned are in your contract - but negotiate rather than set your conditions. another thing to think about is activities. If you;re employing a nanny you almost certainly have more disposable income than her. If you want your dc to go to a group/class of some sort and if it's expensive you might want to consider paying for hers to as well, or contributing. we did this, as the idea of hers being exluded was something that would send a very odd message to dds - that somehow they were priority no 1 in the arrangement.

also you need to accept that things will change over time (not unique to nannies with kids) - it may not be as long lasting - ours left when she had her second and her first started at a different school to ours - it just became a logistic impossibility - but if she'd lived round the corner and all the kids were at the same school I would have happily kept her on.

re the illness thing - it's barely any different from a nursery or childminder. we agreed that coughs and colds we just all got on with. sickness or dia-wotsit-that-I-so-can't-spell, they should be apart. you have to use up leave for it. it's part of life. in fact it never actually happened

interesting contrast between what I said and stairdemon. which is actually kind of my point. if you are are employing someone solely to look after your child it won;t work. if you feel your child and your famiy's interests can actually be well-served by such an arrangement it will.

and re double buggy - get one from ebay, and split the cost. if you sell it on after 2 years or whatever it will probably end up costing something like £30.