Just enjoy them

[Deepsouthwest]

Have been watching the tempers flare about childcare options on a thread today which made me think about hopefully a better question on the same topic. Don’t argue that staying at home with your children is better/worse for them - makes them drug addicts/Einsteins or that nursery will make them wonderful or dreadful people - just ask yourself this - out of 7 days a week - how much time do you want to spend with your children from 0-5 (when they then start school). If it’s everyday - try and see if you can arrange/afford that? If you don’t want to spend everyday with them - think about how much do you want to be with them when they are little? and work the rest of the time beyond this. I don’t think it’s about churning out “better” children if someone’s at home or someone works - just answer yourself honestly - how much of the week do I want to be a full time caregiver?

Your nanny not baby asks for a raise*

Absolutely ridiculous post.

In my experience my dd needed ME vs caring for in a generic way, for the last couple of years of primary, first couple of secondary school. Periods starting, all the emotional and friendship stuff etc. By sticking at work when she was small I had much more flexibility later on, plus money and a pension. She doesn't even remember the child care part. I hate these guilty inducing posts. Women have worked throughout history and in general there has only ever been a small window where "quality time" was ever a thing.

Rich people had staff and poor people often had large families and used older children to mind the smaller ones.

Wow. If only I'd thought of that when I was doing the nursery run enroute to work, to pay for bills

Rightmove is currently showing 23 properties in and around Yeovil/Sherborne for £160 - all 3 bed. Yes you earn less away from cities but moving here has give us lots of other little perks we didn’t expect. I’m not forcing anyone to move I’m just saying it is possible if you really want to. If you don’t really want to move then don’t shout back I’m just saying moving area can free up one person to be at home - either all the time (if you want to) or part time if that is preferable. Basically lots of areas - Scottish coasts/mid wales north Norfolk/Somerset - allow people to buy or rent for a lot less and then people can have more of a “real” choice about their home/work/parenting arrangements. I’m not making people do this I’m just saying it is possible.

I love that you think more rural = cheaper. Clearly you’ve not spent much time in the Home Counties.

You are clearly judging us parents who choose to - or indeed have to - work, so don’t try and dress it up as ‘a better question’.

But surely if you are planning kids then this kind of conversation crops up before after you know you are pregnant? What shall we do when....

Yes it does crop up. Luckily it’s 2019 and people have the choice to start a family even if their partner isn’t one in of the few remaining professions that earn enough to support a family alone.

I can afford childcare we couldn't afford for me not to work should I deny my children their existence because of that? Of course fucking not and tbh I have zero guilt or otherwise about using childcare they love it and are a hell of a lot more socialised there then I could provide alone.

Great moving worked for you but wouldn't for majority of people and why should people sacrifice everything else in their lives particularly their career to stay home until kids turn 5 I couldn't and wouldn't make that choice

Ridiculously smug idealism

Nooo not Home Counties - they’re not rural! Again I’m not judging anyone - people make their own choices - all I’m saying is IF you want to be at home more/at all - if that is your starting consideration then you can find ways to make the other bits fit round that priority. Yes I come and lifestyle will take a hit - possibly a huge hit - but if you think it might be worth it then you can do it!

i live the assumption that pre children you live in London spending a fortune then post children just move to the country. As if no one without kids has no where cheaper to move to?!

You know, I wanted to spend time with my kids when they were little. But not to the extent that I'd move us and them away from their family and friends to a worse area just so I could save £100 a month on the mortgage.

You're so naive about this it's like you're an alien who has just landed on earth and hasn't figured anything out yet.

I was a SAHM for ages, and very happy, so not bashing your life choices at all, but WTAF?! Moving miles away from friends and family (i.e. all sanity and support) would have been a really stupid idea. Not to mention the assumption that you’d be able to waltz into a job in the new cheap town.

Neither me nor DH can afford to be a SAHP. We live in a house MUCH cheaper than yours, I drive a very modest car. To pay the bills on the wages we can command we both need to work full time. Also I have absolutely no idea if I'd want to stay at home, never given it a thought as it's not possible. My mum "got to be" a SAHP because my dad cleared off and left her claiming benefits. She could never have planned for that.
There's a difference between cutting down on costs here or there and not being able to put food on the table.

Ok, so those people who aren’t lucky enough to be as highly qualified as you and your husband, or don’t have the means to retrain... what do they do?

You have to understand OP that you are coming from a position where you had a great deal of options at some point. Many people don’t have that.

Also should point out I did all the "right things" as far as education, did well at school, first in my family to go to uni, but I still haven't figured out how to print my own money.

I've worked hard for my career and I'm
Looking to go back full time in September next year...we need the money and I want to be a good role model for my children showing them what a successful career looks like.

I'm a bloody good mother, they will both be in school/nursery and I get to be the woman o was before children in the workplace.

Op you are being a goady fucker with all due respect and implying that sahm's are better than working mothers which I find insulting.

Op you should be sent in to fix the whole Brexit crisis as you obviously have all the answers....

Meanwhile, back in the real world....

Op, my house cost less than £160k and I can’t afford not to work. Where would you suggest I downsize to when I’m already in a cheap area?

There is surely so much more to it than that. I would love to be with my children all the time but I also want them to live in a lovely house with the space they need, in a nice area with an excellent school, so I have to work (part-time) alongside my husband's job to make this happen. I really struggle with my job (teaching) and not being the one to take care of them all the time, but there is a bigger picture to consider and I am grateful that I can at least be at home part time.

What if you already live in a cheaper area? Or don’t have credit to borrow thousands of pounds? Are a person whose only been able to earn minimum wage before and doesn’t have savings to move house. Or if your partner doesn’t earn enough to support the family and you feel it’s morally wrong to claim benefits because you’d rather be at home with your children (I’m not actually judging this choice, I just no from a thread on here the other day that plenty of people feel that way). There’s loads of reasons why it may not be possible. As for not planning it before getting pregnant, some people may plan to work or be a stay at home parent after having a baby, but then find once they actually are a parent that they feel differently. It’s ridiculous to decide that just because you managed to cut back that other people can too if they want it enough, real life doesn’t always allow for such things

It's not just about the minimum 5 years of missed income though is it?
It's also about the fact that most of us can't waltz straight back into a well paying job at the same level as when we left to have DC.
Generally the only jobs where you have a chance of doing that are the lower paid, less skilled ones (and even then it can be tricky to find employment again).

I worked my ass off to get to a certain point in my career before dc. If I didn't go back to work before the youngest was 5, Im not sure if I could even return to the same industry. I would be in a worse position than a new graduate in some ways. I'd probably be looking at a minimum wage job instead of the well paid, mentally challenging engineering job I do now.
I had 3 years out, and even with that really really struggled to get my career back on track after.
Maybe you think I'm shallow for wanting a good income at all?
But I don't want to just earn enough money to survive, I want to earn enough to enjoy life, have holidays, and (most importantly to me) to have savings and a bit of security.
In order to earn that both me and dh need to work.
I love spending time with DC but I live in the real world.

Or are you suggesting that we shouldn't bother having kids unless we give up work for the first five years of their life and resign ourselves to a pin money job after?

You have loads of money don’t you? Only a wealthy person would simplify the cost of living quite as much as you have. I could go and live somewhere much cheaper to reduce my mortgage so I could stay at home but then there would be the small problem of not having a job and my career vanishing in a puff of smoke.

You must genuinely think that people who don’t stay at home with their kids until they’re 5 just don’t like their company.

And yeah, if part of the reason you're able to afford to stay home with your kids is because you're topping up your income with benefits, then fuck off smugly judging working mothers whose taxes are paying your bills.