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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

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Original poster

AIBU:Should I pay my CM even though I gave her sufficient notice?

100 replies

Needadvice2018 · 05/09/2018 15:03

Hello,
I’ve changed my name just incase my CM sees.

Basically, my CM had my daughter through out term time since last September. I pay her a month in advance. I told her in July that I no longer needed her to look after my child as she would be going to nursery from September.
I assumed this would be sufficient notice as it’s 6 weeks plus. She’s now saying that as my child only does term time she needed 4 weeks notice during term time and I need to pay for September :/
My child is only contracted for term time but I assumed the 4 weeks notice wouldn’t need to be during term time. She’s now threatening to add late fees on top of what I owe her!
Should I pay her for September even though she knew 6 weeks ago she wouldn’t have my child?

OP posts:
Original poster
Needadvice2018 · 05/09/2018 15:07

Also, on a kind of separate note, she lost one of my daughter’s shoes whilst she was walking through town which resulting in having to buy another pair of shoes from Clark’s which were £32! She never offered to replace them but if she’s wanting the money for September I’m thinking she needs to pay me back for the shoes considering she lost the other pair.

OP posts:
Nacreous · 05/09/2018 15:08

What does your contract say? Ultimately the answer will be there.

tangoed2 · 05/09/2018 15:09

Sorry not really up on these things but it sounds a bit daft to me! Do you sign a contract when using a childminder? If so, you need to have a look at that for cancellation terms I would have thought.

Shoe issue would be separate, I think that should have been dealt with at the time if you wanted her to buy a new pair, I don't think you can throw that in there now.

nomorespaghetti · 05/09/2018 15:10

Do you have anything in writing / a contract about the 4 weeks notice during term time thing? Seems daft to me, you gave loads of notice, and unless you've signed a contract saying you'll give 4 weeks notice during term time then i think I'd let her whistle for it!

Original poster
Needadvice2018 · 05/09/2018 15:14

Thanks for the swift replies guys!

The contract states that my child only goes through term time but there's nothing in there which states that the 4 week's notice must during the time she's there.
I think she's trying to argue that as she's only contracted term time then I need to give notice within the term time!

I just don't really fancy having to pay my CM fees and late fees as well as nursery fees for September as it's a lot of money to be giving out Confused

OP posts:
hidengosqueak · 05/09/2018 15:16

Nope she's trying it on.
For instance if I have 4 weeks unpaid holiday booked and then give my boss 4 weeks notice, that period still counts as he has had 4 weeks warning whether you are there or not.

TracyBeakerSoYeah · 05/09/2018 15:16

Check the contact you've signed with your childminder.
If it states 4 weeks notice & doesn't specificate notice has to be given during term time then notice can be given at any time.

TracyBeakerSoYeah · 05/09/2018 15:19

Sorry just seen your latest post, I think this childminder is trying it on.
Did you give the original notice in writing or verbally?

Original poster
Needadvice2018 · 05/09/2018 15:23

@TracyBeakerSoYeah I texted her as it's the normal way she communicates with me so I can prove when I gave her the notice!

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HSMMaCM · 05/09/2018 15:39

Is there any small print on the back of your contract. Mine has a note that says notice can't include time the child isn't attending. Read all your contract carefully and if there's nothing then ask her to show you where it says the notice couldn't be in holidays. Maybe in her policies which you agreed to?

The shoe issue is separate and if you accepted (however reluctantly) that she wasn't paying for the shoes then you need to forget that one.

TracyBeakerSoYeah · 05/09/2018 15:40

That's good.
It might be worth emailing her a note or writing a note to reiterate that you gave her notice in July according to the terms of the contract via text (which she has accepted).
Therefore your payments to her are up to date.

Original poster
Needadvice2018 · 05/09/2018 15:53

I've attached pictures of the contract! As far as I can see there's nothing there that specifies 4 week's notice within term time? Just that I need to give 4 week's notice and my child only goes through term time.

AIBU:Should I pay my CM even though I gave her sufficient notice?
AIBU:Should I pay my CM even though I gave her sufficient notice?
OP posts:
ajandjjmum · 05/09/2018 16:15

Maybe just text her back and ask where the clause is saying that you have to give notice in term time, as you were not aware of this?

Shoe's a different issue, and should have been dealt with at the time.

bestbefore · 05/09/2018 16:24

(Not a legal expert) but it does say 4 weeks contracted notice and the contract is for term time only so maybe the phrase contracted notice means notice within the contracted period eg 4 weeks in term time?? Even so, should have explained that in July!

Original poster
Needadvice2018 · 05/09/2018 16:34

@bestbefore I would've assumed contracted hours meant the hours she's contracted to look after my child not when I give her the notice? The thing scribbled out underneath is the table of hours my child is looked after. Either way I feel it's not explicitly explained as to what it means!
I just don't want to get into more trouble than necessary but at the same time I don't want to just hand her the money when she's not even looking after my daughter anymore Blush

OP posts:
Original poster
Needadvice2018 · 05/09/2018 16:36

She's also messaged to say that she told me this in person when I signed the contract! However, this was in August last year so I honestly cannot remember ever having this discussion with her Hmm

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ShalomJackie · 05/09/2018 16:48

Solicitor - no practising here.

Tell her that she did not vary the contract verbally at the time of you entering in to it. That you have given notice in accordance with the terms of the contract and if she wishes to take it further you will rely on the written terms of the contract to support your defence of her claim. Also tell her that not only will you defend any such claim you will be counterclaiming for the cost of the new pair of shoes as she negligently failed to look after your child's belongings whilst they were under her supervision.

I suspect she has failed to fill the spot and is trying it on.

Canshopwillshop · 05/09/2018 16:53

She is trying it on. Why the hell didn’t she say anything back in July? I certainly wouldn’t pay for September.

itsaboojum · 05/09/2018 16:56

There,s nothing in the contract (so far as the images you’ve provided) that supports the childminder's claim. You should also check her policies, since these usually form part of the agreed Ts&Cs too.

Some childcare providers take September's payment before the summer holidays, as a precaution against parents jumping ship just before the start of term. That certainly doesn’t seem to apply here.

Some contracts state that "notice must not be given during a holiday period" but even that is often misunderstood or misused to mean only term time week’s count as notice, which is incorrect. Again, there's no sign of that on your images.

Legally, the purpose of the notice period is to give both parties some reasonable protection from the effect so of a sudden change: to give each of you time to find a new Childcarer right or client to fill the void. You notified her in July, so you have given her somewhere in the region of six weeks to do that.

SleepyMcEdie · 05/09/2018 16:59

She is trying it on. My childminder has a 4 week notice period and it’s not term time 4 weeks!

itsaboojum · 05/09/2018 17:04

Sorry, hope my pp makes sense. My auto-spell is going weird and I posted when I meant to preview it.

Re: the lost shoe. The childminder is legally liable for the loss (as a pair.) However, she is not liable for the replacement cost: only the value of the shoes at the time of the loss, ie. their second hand value, after wear and tear. Children’s shoes depreciate in value very rapidly, even if there's only negligible wear. You’re probably looking at a value of £10 as an absolute maximum if they were reasonably new (?)

TracyBeakerSoYeah · 05/09/2018 17:08

She's shot herself in the foot by writing contractual notice thinking it relates to the contracted hours term time only.
The CM should have explicitly written that the notice period is
'I require 4 weeks notice in writing within term time if you wish to terminate my services.
However if you advise me of your intention to give notice during school holidays then the period of notice will start on the first day of the following term.'

TracyBeakerSoYeah · 05/09/2018 17:10

You owe her nothing.

IcanDorisIwillDoris · 05/09/2018 17:12

As an ex childminder I would say she is trying her luck!

4 weeks notice is pretty standard, it gave her ample opportunity to advertise and fill the space ready for September. If that's a hand written contract I.e. it looks typed like she has done it herself then she has left herself a big gaping hole. I had different terms and conditions for different scenarios/families needs. Each contract was tweaked as necessary!

As far as I can see you gave her the correct notice therefore you owe nothing!

Original poster
Needadvice2018 · 05/09/2018 17:35

I messaged her back stating:

"Contractual notice and contracted hours aren't the same thing. Contractual notice is the legal requirement needed in a contract and the contracted hours are the hours which you are paid to look after her. If you wanted me to give term time notice you needed to explicitly state that in the terms of the contract as from where I'm standing there's no evidence of that being written. As far as telling me is concerned I honestly cannot remember whether you did or not as it was in August last year and ideally should've been in writing for reference".

I'm hoping that this is enough to show her that I don't have anything to pay.

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