Nanny going on holiday.

[Sophia101]

Hello
I will try and make this short and sweet.

I have a Nanny who takes care of my children four days a week, she's been with us around 9 months now.
She is self employed and is registered with CSSIW (I'm in Wales).
Anyway she's going on holiday for a week at the end of this month which is during the half term holidays. I will need to put my children into the school holiday club during the time she's away.
I currently receive help towards my child care costs, I think it's either 70 or 80%.
The money usually comes into my account on a Wednesday and goes directly into hers via a standing order.
She does not expect to be paid during the time she is away as she is self employed, which obviously makes things a little easier for me as I'm a single mum and money is tight, hence why I receive help.
My question is, can I use the money I receive towards my nanny's wages for the holiday club fees?
They are registered with CSSIW but I'm not sure how it works, whether or not I can use that money to pay for those fees or if I have to basically cancel my tax credits for that week until my nanny comes back.
Will I be breaking the law by doing that?
If any one can shed some light on this very confusing situation I'd really appreciate it.
Many Thanks
Sophia

Crikey - Im in the construction industry we used to employ self employed subbies under similar conditions but have stopped doing so because hmrc are clamping down.

The rules are very clear on nannies if you look into it.

Subbies in the construction industry are quite a specialist area - hence why cis was introduced. There are also specialists involved in the drafting of contracts to ensure they avoid being employees - although hmrc will not accept a contract as absolute evidence if the reality is that they are employees.

Hmrc are slowly forcing people to move onto employment contracts. In particular, people engaging others working in the construction industry, locum gps and dentists, all of which have traditionally been self employed are coming under closer scrutiny.

Yes, the only subbies we use niw are specialist ones, sometimes limited companies, sometimes one man bands but in all cases they quote for jobs, provide the materials for their particular specialist area & have to provide a 12 month guarantee of their workmanship. They are not labour only.

Crikey - are you contractors 'self-employed' or are they employees of a service company, and might also be directors and shareholders of that company. If so, they are not self employed; they own the company that employs them. Not the same thing.

Getting back to your actual question Sophia, you want to read WTC5 (pdf)
- from WTC5 -
What childcare costs you can claim
You can claim for the costs of any registered or approved childcare that you pay for.
You can only claim for the amounts you actually pay.

Registered with CSSIW.

If you use more than 1 childcare provider, or you use a different provider at different times of the year (for example, in school holidays), you need to give us the details of all your providers. Please tell us as soon as possible if you change your provider(s)

You will need to work out average weekly cost - see page 12 onwards of WTC5.

For everyone asking about self employed v employed here is the HMRC toolkit tools.hmrc.gov.uk/esi/screen/ESI/en-GB/summary?user=guest

It really is worth checking it out if you are an employer, as it will be you HMRC come after for missed employers NI if you get caught

Also, your nanny can't just decide to be self-employed because otherwise people can't afford her. Sadly (for those of us who would love to employ a nanny but don't have the cash) that just isn't how it works!
I agree with the other posters. Your nanny is clearly employed by you.
But you've had lots of advice to that effect and don't want to hear it. I guess you will have to keep your fingers crossed that you don't get caught.

answer to your q, yes sure you can pay holiday club with the help you get but you need to tell them

ie you/your nanny cant claim then you get cash from nanny to pay for clubs

and your nanny may be se for other jobs but in your set up she needs to be employed

you have set days and hours

nannies are very diff from dentists/cleaners/hairdressers etc who are se

all the posters on hereare trying to give you advise, YOU will be the one in trouble/fined/possible jail sentence for tax evasion and have to pay back the tax, not your nanny

In answer to your actual question yes you can but you just need to inform them.

Totally agree with you blondeshavemorefun.
As others have said - contact tax credits and inform them of the change just for the week then they can advise you on exactly what you need to do.

I am with most others on here and believe everyone is just really trying to help you! I am a self employed CM and also include adhoc nanny jobs and babysitting in my annual tax return. I also work 1 day a week as an employed nanny with contract, holidays, sick pay included etc. for the past 2yrs and due to go on maternity soon which mat pay will also be covered through this. Nannies have a very different set up when it comes to employment/self employment status and cannot really be compared to other SE contractors/jobs. I've also been advised by HMRC that if a position is longer than 6mths then technically it has to be employment. Obviously your nanny has had different information but I think it would do you no harm just to check with HMRC yourself to be on the safe side.

It won't hurt for you To Check with HMRC - just in case. If she's right then nothing lost, if working you have time to sort it ...

Despite all the people with experience in childcare and employment law giving great advice maybe OP is just keeping keeping her rose tinted glasses on and her fingers crossed that she doesnt get spot checked for assessment by HMRC.

Then having to pay all the NI contributions she should have been paying for nanny.
Then having up to 100% of said contributions in a fine
Then probably having to pay back all the childcare £ she has been paid as situation isnt legal.

All for the sake of a phone call.. Must have money to burn.

Hmm it seems that maybe she should be registered as a child minder not a nanny.

"As nannies generally fall into the first list, they cannot be considered self-employed. However in some cases HMRC do grant nannies self-employed status, for example, if the nanny works in a series of temporary positions, or works for three or more families at the same time (in which case she would have to register with Ofsted as a childminder). The nanny should contact HMRC directly for approval if she requires this. HRMC will assess each situation individually"

Its a grey area and you would be wise to phone HMRC. I work for the NHS on a bank contract 4 days a week but I can take days off when and where just like your nanny but I am definitely employed.

No childminders are registered in their own homes to care for multiple families at once. Care for one family in the child's home is a nanny. It's not really the childcare registration that's in question here as clearly she is registered to receive tax credits but the nanny's employment status is wrong.

I appreciate that just quoting HMRC,

Yes you can have more than one child care provider just update holiday club details with tax credits.

So, op asks a question. Loads of mners don't answer the question but give advice about something else in the post. Op acknowledges what they are saying but isn't bothered. This is not what she wants advice about (the self employment thing). So still, loads of posters going on and on about it.

The op would like advice on her tax credits. Why are you all going on about the self employed bit. If the op wants to risk having a se nanny when she should be employed, that is up to her. Either answer the origional question or leave her alone!

I'm sorry, op I don't know the answer to your question, but I think you have had a bit of a hard time up thread.

Mary - because if op can use her tax credits and swap childcare she will need to give details of current one to swap it from. As soon as she does that the tax man will know it's not being done as it should and op could land a huge fine

No when you add a new childcare provider you don't re give old details.

I'm sorry, op I don't know the answer to your question, but I think you have had a bit of a hard time up thread.

So you say that others are being unfair by not answering the OP question, then don't have any answer yourself

Are Nannies OFSTED reg? Any childcare you use if you are claiming the childcare element in tax credits has to be.

You will need to tell the TC people that you will be using a holiday club, it does all get a bit confusing but you need to work out roughly what you will pay the Nanny over a year likewise with the holiday club and then work out what the average weekly cost would be.

No I don't have the answer, but I also don't think it's fair the hard time the op has got. Im trying to give another mum a bit of support, rather than giving her a hard time about something she hasn't asked for advice on.

We are giving her advice on something she doesn't care about as what she is doing is illegal

We are trying to stop her having huge fines and getting into trouble

And yes I did answer her q

So it's fine to ignore something a poster says or does as she doesn't care /want to know

Im trying to give another mum a bit of support, rather than giving her a hard time about something she hasn't asked for advice on.

People are giving her advice on something that could potentially get her into a lot of trouble.

Personally I'd rather be given a 'bit if a hard time' than end up in deep trouble with HMRC.