Nanny going on holiday.

[Sophia101]

Hello
I will try and make this short and sweet.

I have a Nanny who takes care of my children four days a week, she's been with us around 9 months now.
She is self employed and is registered with CSSIW (I'm in Wales).
Anyway she's going on holiday for a week at the end of this month which is during the half term holidays. I will need to put my children into the school holiday club during the time she's away.
I currently receive help towards my child care costs, I think it's either 70 or 80%.
The money usually comes into my account on a Wednesday and goes directly into hers via a standing order.
She does not expect to be paid during the time she is away as she is self employed, which obviously makes things a little easier for me as I'm a single mum and money is tight, hence why I receive help.
My question is, can I use the money I receive towards my nanny's wages for the holiday club fees?
They are registered with CSSIW but I'm not sure how it works, whether or not I can use that money to pay for those fees or if I have to basically cancel my tax credits for that week until my nanny comes back.
Will I be breaking the law by doing that?
If any one can shed some light on this very confusing situation I'd really appreciate it.
Many Thanks
Sophia

No one is belling you this because they want to argue. We are sharing our knowledge on the matter because you are at risk when you can ill afford to be. It's advice that's all, not attack. Ignore if you want and we'll save our time. No loss to us is there?

*telling

You set should check, the thing is you a liable to the thousands of pounds fine you could be given if she's employed by you but not declared

Like I said, thank you for you're concern but there is no need.
I don't think there's any need to carry on the conversation as obvousily we disagree so I will leave it here.
Thank you for you're helpful responces.
Sophia

As long as your realise that if you get caught you'll not only be fined but you'll also be liable for all the tax and NI (employee and employers) that is owed do want you want it doesn't affect any of us!

I will do what I want thank you.

I feel really sorry for Sophia reading this. Mumsnet used to be so nice ...

Gosh yes, all these nasty people trying to offer advice so that a mum doesn't risk a big fine. What poisonous bitches.

Chocolate- it's not about being ' not nice'

What the OP is doing is hugely risky, she could get a massive fine. Not one person on this thread apart from the OP has said ' yes, that's legal' instead, there are some very knowledgeable people who are pointing out that what she's doing is hugely risky.

My former employer was shit hot at doing everything by the book as his colleague was fined because of exactly what the OP is doing.

Actually I think the posters have a point man. It is no skin off noses if the OP ignores any advice but in her shoes I'd be checking just in case. Ifs alls fine then it doesn't matter does it?

Tax mans like a rabid dog when he turns his beam on you and there's no sympathy for ignorance at all.

But if I am telling you that all the checks have been made, everything is fine. I can't understand why none of you can't except that? I'm disagreeing with you because I want to argue with you, im disagreeing with you because I know that she is self employed and all the checks have been made. I don't think any one has attacked me, I appreciate every ones responces and for taking the time to post. I'm just getting a bit frustrated as I have said multiple times that the checks have been made and that everything is fine yet every one seems to be still going on about?

I meant - I'm disagreeing with you because I don't want to argue with you.

OP the reality is that if you contact HMRC they will find that she should not be self employed and this might lead to trouble for both you at her. At a minimum you will be forced to employ her.

The checks were obviously done before she began working 4 days a week for you. This alone makes it against the rules to be self employed. I don't care what you do, just trying to let you know the facts.

OP I mean this in the nicest way but all checks haven't been done because you haven't done the checking. This current set up may be different from the one she put to the HRMC. It's worth giving them a call surely?

Under HMRC rule nannies cannot generally be classed as self-employed for the reasons set out below.

A worker is considered 'employed' if they:
have to do the work themselves
can be told at any time what to do, where to carry out the work or when and how to do it
work a set amount of hours
can be moved from task to task
are paid by the hour, week or month
can be paid overtime or receive bonus payments

You are her employer.

FWIW, I'm a nanny and do varying hours every week, sometimes more, sometimes less than 4 days a week and I get 5.6 wks holiday a year and the pay is based off my previous 12 wks wages.

(Can't RTFT for some reason, only usernames showing up past the first few posts, so apologies if this has been covered)

If I were you, I would just ring whoever gives you he money towards the child care costs and ask them. They are the only ones who can give you a definite answer.
If you don't have to pay holiday pay, for whatever reason, I can't see why you can't use the childcare money to pay for different childcare, though. It's not like you're just pocketing it, so it wouldn't make sense to leave you in the lurch because your nanny is taking time off

You haven't made any checks though OP, and it is irrelevant if she is registered as self-employed if she then starts doing a job (yours) that doesn't meet the criteria.

Have you done any checks op? It is your responsibility. I don't think you understand how it works. Have a look at this tool:

www.gov.uk/guidance/employment-status-indicator

It is possible for her to be self employed (for ad hoc nannying cover etc) and employed - For long term regular contracts. It is very important you seek clarification from hmrc, as you will be liable for backdated Paye, NI and penalties if you don't. It is up to you to do this - do not rely on what your nanny has been told.

i'm a self employed dentist you can work a set amount of hours in the same place regularly and still be self employed you are in control of your hours but you can easily agree a contract to provide set hours each week with a notice period if you want to change them like most self employed people you need to be reliable

you can have set hourly rates etc but generally speaking you do not get paid when not working like this nanny when she is off she is not paid she will not be paid if she is sick either, there are other guidelines like providing your own uniform putting things right at your own expense so if nanny breaks something she has to replace it as an employee she would not

while a couple of messages asking OP to check would be fine 50% of replies ignored Op's question , my childminder is self employed like most child minders are and she has DD set hours each week

loads of self employed people have contracts with set hours and set rates of pay

Thank you TeacupDrama, this is what I was trying to say but I didn't put it as well as you lol. I very well might be wrong and be fined so yes I suppose I could give HMRC a ring, but all you could very well be wrong as well. Anyway I got the answer to my original post. Thank you.

Sophia something called IR35 was brought in in June 2014 so from the sounds of things since your nanny set herself up. This dramatically changed the whole employed/ self employed landscape.

We employ a loyal self employed contractors in my organisation - they have set hours, are told what to do, have agreed to a time-limited 'contract', don't work for anyone else whilst they work forbid and are self-employed.

Not being awkward but what's the difference between these people and a nanny??

For us - not forbid!!

Ffs - loads of, not 'loyal'!