childminder v nursery dilemma

[mumofben]

sorry if this topic has already been discussed - I'm returning to work in Feb and until recently thought nursery would be best for my 6 month old - However, i flicked through the Stephen Biddulph book on "raising boys" and he suggests that boys in particular benefit from a calm environment with a constant person they can learn to be attached to etc which made sense. So, I changed my mind and thought a childminder would be better, especially in the early months then I could change to nursery when he's a bit bigger.

However, talking to a mum the other day made me re-think again - I've got him into a routine with naps etc - a childminder will want him to fit around her routine - eg out in the car all day? or will he be stuck in front of TV while she's doing her housework etc. Therefore, no guarantee he'll get individual attention anyway.

Now I'm completely unsure what to do. Would be really grateful if anyone can help point me in the right direction?

riab - CMs are only allowed 3 under 5s so would have a maximum of 2 toddlers. Also I don't think there is an issue with the school run - it is an opportunity to get out for a walk. And any child with older siblings and a SAHM will find themselves doing it anyway.

don't know where you are but if you're in scotland - you can check you the inspection reports of all child care providers on the care commissions website - these covers health and safety, what activities children do, food given, policies, training etc etc. they are measured once per year against agreed standards.

mumofben it sounds to me like you are not fully going to be able to truse ANYONE with your child!
as hmo2 says you do come across as having a poor view of cms. i too would ask that you made an appt to come and visit my setting,why would i want a potential client visiting when im up to my neck in baby sick,or in the middle of kiddies lunch,or doing a school run or at mum n tod group etc etc.........?
not atall unusual for cms to ask that you arrange a mutually convienent time to call!
i also will be very interested to know if you manage to go see a whole nursery unannounced.

mumtoben, DO get the Biddulph book. I think he has really sensible, sensitive stuff about parenting a boy.

Some people are highly troubled that he seems to recommend mothers of pre schoolers not to work at all which isn't realistic for many (me included!) but to be honest I think it's about taking the spirit of what he says into consideration; eg boys thrive best if cared for more or less one to one by a loving carer at home until age 3. For me this meant me most of the time and my mum or MIL one day a week each. And that to me, was him being cared for more or less in the way Biddulph recommends and the way I felt comfortable with.

for me, if mum/MIL hadn't been an option, my choice would then have been childminder, and bottom of my personal list would have been nursery.

It sounds to me that your feelings on how DS should be looked after are similar to mine so I reckon you'd be more comfortable with a childminder for him.

Get the Biddulph book and make your own mind up about him!

Dooooonnnnn'ttttt dooooooooo iiiiiiiiiiiit....

He'll just make you feel bad. Who needs that?

uwila, why is it that you say that?

I read it and felt reassured and 'backed up' by his thoughts!

Well, must confess I haven't read the book. But I do remember a newspaper article (followed by an MN ruckus) about how hard he was on working parents. And nobody needs to read that crap when they are going back to work.

maybe I have an easier time disregarding things that I physically CANNOT provide for DS!

eg, when he was a baby I had to work 2 days a week. Financially, there was no way round that. Not to pay for a 'lifestyle', or even cover the bills! but to basically keep us from financial disaster......therefore I read his advice as 'mums are best for boys for the first three years except for sunny who has to work 2 days therefore her mum and mil are just as good, but if they are not available then a childminder will be fine"

I do think it's about the spirit of the advice rather than thinking you are being 'got at' if you can't meet the 'ideal'.

UWILA!

SHAME on you not even having read the book!!!!!!

well, we know who to listen to about Biddulph now, don't we ladies

Mumofben - it's so scary and nervwracking looking for childcare for your first baby isn't it?? I'd say go and see some childminders, and some nurseries with an open mind, and see what you think. There are plusses and minuses with each type of care, depending on you, and your child, and your routine etc. And remember, it's not a forever decision - if you try something and it doesn't work, you can change it. Good luck!

I have another tip for you. When you go back to work, take a pic of the baby but don't put it up on your desk. Put it in a a drawer so you can sleak a peak when you want to but it won't be sitting there staring you in the face making you feel guilty when you are otherwise busy.

hellomumofben
I think much depends on the individual CM or the nursery but- imo - a childminder/nanny is best for a small child/baby in terms of their mental well being. I think having other toddlers around at a CMs is a big positive - in fact I think one of the real down sides of nurseries is the tendency to segregate by age so strictly.
I would also recommend the Secrets of Happy Children by Steve Biddulph. I think he is a genuine, caring person and when I read his book I thought it was a breath of fresh air. so many other books I read said "well you can put your child into a nursery or a CM or a nanny it's entirely up to you" and when I read SB he said "well I think putting young children into long hours of day care is a bad idea until they are a bit older and this is why" then I found that so refreshing. (and at the time my dd1 was in f/t nursery) I mean, why would you alsways bother to read things that you agree with? if you read someone else's opinion, then you can say yes I agree with that, or no I don't (for whatever reason) but at least it is treating you like a functioning thinking adult not to somehow protect you from anything that might upset you. I don't think anyone's interests are served by deliberately ignoring research. I mean - ignorance isn't bliss is it?

thanks bramshott, very sensible advice. I never expected it to be so scary - I was firmly convinced whilst i was pregnant that I'd have no problem leaving a child with someone who was more experienced than me - after all what did I know about babies? It's different when you have your own - you can't help thinking that you know them best

and smeeinit, you're probably right that I'm finding it hard to trust a complete stranger with my child. However, when it comes to meeting them, I couldn't care less if they were covered in sick - I'd rather see them as they are day to day than to have them put on an immaculate looking show for me - somehow, I'd be more inclined to trust her if she said yeah pop in on such and such a day, not 11 days from now.

harpsichord - did it make you feel less happy about your dd being in f/t nursery? - what does he think is the problem with nurseries?

yes, tbh it did. the concerns he has about nurseries is to do with attachment, i.e. that a young child needs to feel a secure attachment with one person or a small number of people for his emotional wellbeing.
that it certainly possible in a nursery with a KW, but (he says) more likely with a nanny or childminder in a more "homely" environment, speaking generally.

apols for terrible grammar there

MoB - remember that you can always have a more informal 'popping in' visit with the childminder once you've met her once, and know if you are seriously considering her.

immaculate...............childminder? hehehehe!
theres no chance of an immacualte show with a cm mob! unnanounced visit or not!
i think you may have missed my point...........if you were to turn up announced and cm was busy feeding baby/children,preparing lunch etc then you are not going to have much of a chat with her,im assuming you would want to look through all off her policies,portfollio etc and have a chat with her re fees,activities,daily planners,qualifications etc? this would prob not be possible if you turned up during a very busy time.

Message withdrawn

ok ok!! I probably sound cynical because of what somebody was telling me - she must have had a bad experience with her childminder hence was trying to persuade me that nurseries are a safer bet.

I'm new to all this at the moment. I've been through such a range of emotions since the birth - I found it a bit of a shock tbh, and didn't expect to feel so overwhelmed and out of control to be a mother, having always been an organised, full time career person. However, as time has gone on, (and I've been getting a bit more sleep!), I've really bonded with Ben, and know him better than anyone else, and the thought of handing him over to a complete stranger for 10 hrs a day is a worry.

Even if I find somewhere brilliant, I'd then be worried that he'll forget who I am, as I'll just be seeing him to put him to bed during the week! There is no option for me to stay in my job with reduced hrs - it's all or nothing.

So, CM's, please don't think I've got anything against you at all, you all sound wonderful - if I can find someone like any of you, I'll be really happy

how did you get on at the nursery moB?

I didn't go in the end chickened out because of the rain. will go tomorrow as have to go out anyway to get him weighed.

I saw that guy who wrote "Raising Boys" talking on breakfast tv about a year ago.
He was saying that all children under 2 need one to one care, ie parent, childminder or nanny. Little girls were ok to go to nursery at 2 as they are more sociable, and little boys at 3. It was because infants need to bond with one or two special people, and they didn't get that at nursery.
I based the decision to put dd with childminder based on this, as I can't afford to stay at home (unfortunately). This was not a political statement, it was just based on recent research, and i am only typing what was said on tv, not nescessarily my view.

Well, I still think he's a twat. But, when I had only one child and went back to work much sooner than 6 months post birth, I did choose to use a childminder rahter than a nursery because I felt it was the happy medium between the stimulation of a nursery and a home-like atmosphere. I don't buy this stuff about boys needing more cuddles than girls. I know lots of cuddly girls, and lots of independant boys and vice versa. I think it's down to personality at that age.

And, only the oldest child gets one-to-one no matter what the care is (even SAHM) because of course there is another child there. So, are all of our second, third, fourth children scarred from having to share their care. Jeez, I hope not. I'm the youngest of 4 so I would be a right mess... of course maybe that's my problem???

i think i must be really old fashioned because i dont understand why parents need a book or some geezer on tv to tell them what there babies needs are or should be doing?
i raised 2 delightfull boys with no help from a book,other than a childrens health manual and my commmon sense,i genuinely dont get it?!
enlighten me people?!!!
MOB hope goes well at nursery tomorrow,let us know if you get to see the WHOLE nursery!