What should / shouldnt a childminder do when the have mindees with them

[travellingtime]

So, using a childminer (not the same one) for the first time in a few years and need a sanity check on what's normal and what's not.
So, DD (pre-school) is with CM from 11.30 till end of day. DS, with her from 3.00 till end of day (6pm)
CM has dogs, so seemingly each day after school the walk the dogs - which sometimes involves going to the park too. By the time they get back its time for tea and then perhaps a bit of telly before we collect - all fine (at least it is now in the summer months, not sure how I will feel about them being dragged about in the cold and wet in november though!)
However what about things like CM getting a hair cut (at someone elses house, rather than salon) trips to town to run errands, and such like ?
I understand the argument that CM needs to do jobs etc but she doesnt have them all day every day so has the time to do these things without involving the child(ren)
Thoughts people?

Does she have the other days off though? I would assume that if she has yours for three days then she would have other children on the other days if not coinciding with yours seeing as she's a childminder?

Thurlow: It used to be that people who lived in the house over the age of 16 needed to be checked I think, or it could have related to the likelyhood of them being in during the day, I can't remember exactly, but I remember the kerfuffle my Nan went through when she was CMing and the CRB checks for her adult son and husband who both worked out of the house 12 hours a day, and, later when she was fostering, her 16yo grandson.

In my opinion it sounds like she sees child minding as a way to get money while doing all her own stuff at the same time. I would prefer a childminder who took childcare seriously as a job. The non crb checked relative is a big issue too. She just doesn't sound very professional.

I take children to the supermarket, but not for the big weekly shop. I took 2 children to the hairdresser once when they came for an extra day and they had a great time, but I'd rather relax when I'm having my hair done. My dentist positively welcomes them and talks to them about keeping their teeth clean. All these things are learning environments, but most learning is done at home and in the forests and parks near where I live. If you are happy with the dog, then I think walking it every day is a fantastic example of responsibility towards living things whatever the weather.

I wouldn't worry about the male relative as anyone living in the house has to have a CRB check. Even my dh is a police officer had to have another when I started.
Fresh air and dog walking is good, we get outside every day unless its pouring rain. We either play in the garden (trampoline, swing slide etc) or we go for a forest walk or to the beach. We look for shells and stones and dig holes and splash in puddles. It's not really educational but its great fun!
During the day apart from nap times we do games, play with toys, read books, sing songs, colouring/art/craft and once a week we always go somewhere special so a soft play or meet up with a load of other kids at the park or go to a farm park etc.
I also agree that letting them just pls by themselves is good too as they enjoy the company of the other kids and have some fun games by themselves.

Op there are also years and years for your kids to learn at pre school and at school itself. Every day doesn't need to be structured - a dog walk, park, some tea and a bit of telly sounds fine to me - haircut is a no no tho. I wouldn't schedule doc, dentist, hair when I was working.
I would go to the shops or the bank tho - that kind of thing is good for them. I also like going on a bus or a train for no reason, just as an experience.
I think sometimes people want their kids to be educated far too early and far too much. There is nothing wrong in letting kids this age just be kids and dig in the mud.

purple Everybody needs one as long as Ofsted know, the thing that flags up this bloke with OPs CM to me is that she said he'd be out of the house, which makes me wonder if Ofsted are aware of him.

kat That's probably it. It does happen occasionally after all. My DP had one of those CMs for most of his childhood, he's still got issues about it :( I grew up with both Mum and Nan CMing and they were both more along the lines of mixing errands and normal family life with childcare activities, so I can see how well it works if it's what you want in a childcare provider. I'd love something like that when I had my own kids, but then seeing as it's likely CMing is what I'd end up going into (currently a nanny) I don't think I'd get away with packing my kids off to another CMer

Yes, confused, I couldn't remember whether my CM's husband had been CRB checked as he was also down as her back-up and so we could authorise him to look after the children for a certain length of time if we were happy with that, or whether he just had to be CRB checked.

OP that would be my only concern about the relative in the house, that Ofsted don't know he lives there.

I know CM who've had to take their mindees with them whilst they have their Smear tests!!! Due to not being able to have it done at any other time working fulltime with some of their parent being teachers and being unable to just take time off!
Not something that I'd want to be forced to do. And it makes taking them with you for a quick trim not sound so bad!

Yes thurlow that was my issue, whether he was there 'under the radar' as she did tell me first of all that he was out of the house 12 hours a day, yet the children have mentioned him to me.
CM must realise that the children will tell me what's going on during the day and who they see.. so in that respect she cant be daft enough to think taht I wouldnt know that he was around

Sorry OP, it was me that mentioned ironing as an example of personal stuff I didn't think a CM should be doing, but I seem to have confused the issue!

Of course they don't have to take their mindees to their smear test! All they have to do is give the parents enough notice and say they are having the day off. It is up to parents to make alternative arrangements. Smear test in the morning, hair cut in the afternoon perhaps?
When I was teaching I never had any problems arranging a cervical smear in the school holidays. I guess if the parents don't mind their kids tagging along to that sort of thing it is up to them really. I don't think its appropriate though.

Me either!
Can't think of anything worse. Would not take my own.

I dont have issues at all with my CM doing the following(for example)
Light cleaning/laundry
Paperwork
Bank/shop/etc
Allotment
as these are all just part of normal home life.

I wouldnt be happy with
Ironing
Hair cuts/Salon appts
Heavy spring cleaning
Tv frequently (ours doesnt have one)

Judgement call really.

Travelling, even if the other relative were out of the house all day they should still have been DBS/CRB checked if he lives there. They don't need to be around the children all the time or left in sole charge to require a check.

Even my oldest son will need a check when he turns 16 (be good for keeping him on his toes!)

I think the walking is great btw and I sometimes take my mindees into town to pay in cheques or post a parcel as, especially during holidays, it can be tricky to find the time to do it and it isn't a huge imposition for a child to have to tag along for half an hour. CMing is supposed to be a home-like setting and you wouldn't hesitate to take your own child to the bank, so it is perfectly reasonable.

Haircut I wouldn't do, but it may be that she had to rearrange at short notice or something and had to take whichever appointment was available. Unless it becomes a regular thing I wouldn't be bothered about it. There are plenty of learning opportunities throughout the day and if your CM wants to get a good OFSTED rating she will need to show evidence of providing the EYFS learning that little ones need. She should also be able to show you a book or folder where she records things that relate to that, so it would be a good opportunity to find out if that is being done. It may be that she is just finding her feet and it may take a while for her to get into her stride.

My children are the only mindees right now and this is first proper week with her.
Will certainly raise the issues that are bothering me ... But in a sensible way. I guess as it's new for her she us finding her feet a little so am prepared to give benefit of the doubt , but I don't want to be taken for a mug either :-)

I was expecting you to say its been at least a month, but first week? Find somebody else, if this is how she starts I dread to think how she'll continue!

I wouldn't personally go for a haircut whilst working, or do anything unavoidable in the way of significant personal errands, but I would certainly take minded children to a toyshop to choose toys, or to an art shop to help choose craft bits for their own benefit. If I had to I would for example stop off at the cashpoint on the way to playgroup, or pick up some fresh milk or fruit on the way home from the park, or pick up a prescription for one of my own children on the way to the library, or small incidental chores of that sort. But then I do work all week, so I think that does make a difference.

We don't really have any options at the moment :-(
However as I mention I'm all for benefit if the doubt whilst we all get used to the new regime, but my children are my best spies !!