New nanny. Would this comment worry you.

[mummysboys1980]

Baby is 10 mths and not yet embracing the nanny (2 days in). Separation anxiety is putting it mildly.

During a meal- nanny and I present. Baby crying for no reason after taking some lunch happily. I eventually got baby out of seat as she was distraught, evidently still hungry though.

Comment along the lines of . " we shouldn't give him any more food now until snack time or he will learnt I manipulate to get cuddles during meals"

I said no and got said child back in seat to eat more food eventually but this comment is worrying. If we'd done as she said baby would have been ravenous. He's 10mths FFS.

We had agreed that nanny would be pretty much hands off (for baby not other kids) for the first week anyway so I wasn't interfering taking him from the seat during the meal.

Any thoughts nannies and parents with childcarers?

We had a agrees

Sorry OP I agree with the nanny. At ten months your baby will soon cotton on to getting in and out of seat. Missing one meal he/she would not starve. But saying that if an occasional occurrence fine. And as you say baby was very distressed I would also have given a cuddle.

But to be honest your baby will not bond with the nanny with you around. You have employed your nanny and therefore must trust her, she is a professional let her get on with her job.

I look after a little boy who eats hardly any food for his parents, but has never not eaten for me. He is five and I have cared for him since he was ten weeks old. I am very kind but firm. He knows that and doesn't play up for me or his dad. But his mum is very inconsistent and soft. I feel sorry for her as she cooks for him and he doesn't eat a thing.

I feel nanny should be taking queues from mum (you).

Personally I would have tried sitting child on my lap and letting them help themselves to things in their bowl or mine. At that age I find children can like to try various things.

I agree.

At 10 months your child will have enough milk feeds and snacks during the day that it won't matter if they don't eat all their lunch or play up at the table.

I also would have finished up the meal - obviously the baby wasn't up for food and offered a play/sleep etc then later on bring forward a milk feed or snack to tide us on for the next meal time.

I also agree that bad habits like getting children out of the high chair to have on your lap, getting them down during the middle of a meal etc can become ingrain at 10/11 months and it will then take the nanny a couple of sessions to reintroduce (correct) behaviour at the table.

Worried about manipulation at 10 months? Really?

A nanny might be a "professional" but I can safely say mum knows her baby best.

thanks for the comments. I need this kind of perspective.

I know baby wont bond with me around but he can get to know her face etc so she isnt a stranger... I am around for bit longer yet unfortunately or fortunately....depending on your view.

Should I just leave now cold turkey or let him get to know her face before going cold turkey and going out all day?

I guess i was worried that she thought it was ok to not let him eat enough. He only has one small milk feed in the afternoon now so needed that meal.

It's a tough one. You say they were crying for no reason but distraught but still hungry. Was there an underlying reason you could discern by picking them up? Nappy needed changing? They bit their tongue and needed comfort? Or were they just bored?

If it was boredom then I probably would have tried to continue without taking them out, but offering a yoghurt or something different. If that failed and they were just experimenting with their power to refuse food I'd have taken them out and finished the meal. They will learn at 10mo that playing up gets them out of the chair until they want to go back. They will also learn that they can refuse food but they then don't have any. A good nanny would also have managed the next feed appropriately offering more/earlier.

If it was needing a change I'd have done that and continued.

If they'd hurt themselves it would have been quick cuddle and back in.

So I don't think there's a clear rule, but equally nanny should be respecting your wishes and if finishing what's in their plate is more important than them learning mealtimes are mealtimes and have defined boundaries then that's your decision.

I would have a concern about the terminology though, but that's me being very picky. It's not manipulation, it's learning about cause and effect and that their behaviour has consequences as well as an impact on other people's behaviour. Manipulation is a pretty advanced term for a 10mo.

I would think the baby was crying because she is unsettled by the presence of the nanny. I think there is research to show that a short and sweet handover between careers reduces separation anxiety, or at least the visible signs of it. It is probably making things worse having you around. It's establishing a pattern of behaviour whereby your baby cries when she sees the nanny, and I'm guessing this is happening quite a few times a day. If you were not there the crying would be once in the morning, wouldn't last long, and the two could build a proper bond.

Thanks Nom. There was an issue and that was probably what kicked off crying. Baby is normally an excellent eater.

Issue was dealt with and baby didnt want to get back to seat.

I am finding handover hard and im quite upset today about it as baby has been crying non stop (again vvvv unusual). I know its hard for me to be objective.

thanks Orange. Thats exactly the kind of information that I need to read.

appreciate that post

i would be worried. i think at 10 months it's fine to pick up a baby when they are in distress (in fact i think it's crazy not to). and then not letting them eat when they're hungry is a dangerous game to get into with young children (basically withholding food to create obedience).

Out of interest why did you choose to follow the handover pattern you did?

There are advantages to long handover and advantages to short ones, but to deliberately separate the nanny from the child who most needs to form a bond due to their developmental stage and who needs to see their mother supporting and accepting a new caregiver seems a little odd.

It was the nannys suggestion. I havent done a nanny handover before so took her guidance given her experience.

maybe we should revisit that. I need to do something.

I've been the nanny in this situation and it's hard. Even when well settled with me usually babies can get distressed if a parent is around but trying to work from home or get on with jobs around the house. Basically if they know a parent is there but is not responding to them as they would like. It's understandable from the baby's point of view.

At 10 months I would probably suggest a quick handover because separation anxiety is at a peak then, although all babies are different and it isn't always an issue. With a much younger baby a long handover is fine as they will get used to a new person gradually without finding it confusing or upsetting.

Babies absolutely do learn to manipulate adults by 10 months of age - typically 6-8 months is when they learn how to elicit specific, desired reactions, so her comment wouldn't bother me. I think she was probably correct.

What would bother me much more is how long you're planning on dragging out this handover. DS is never going to bond with the nanny if you're around like this - of COURSE he prefers you and is unsettled by your shared presence! And of course he hasn't warmed up to the nanny after 2 days... it can take a couple of weeks, particularly at this age, and longer if mom stays around for a while. He knows now that nanny is trustworthy, because he's seen you together, so now is the time to leave and let the two of them get on with their bonding.

It depends on your parenting style... I'd have been horrified if this had been said about my 10 month old baby, but then I'm quite a crunchy, hippy, attachment parenting type of mum ... I saw nothing wrong with giving my baby cuddles during meals, so would have wanted child career to follow my lead and also offer cuddles. But that's just my style of parenting which works for me, yet not for others. If it really makes you uncomfortable to have your child treated like this then mention it to the nanny and also how you would have dealt with it/like her to deal with it in the future.

For example I know our current au pair is baffled that we don't use timeouts as punishments, (we do time ins instead) but she is happy to follow our method, we just had to explain it clearly to her (I think she'd watched a couple of episodes of nanny 911 to prepare for the job and was initially quite shocked that we roll differently in our house).

A nanny needs to bond with a baby esp of the clingy 10mth age so having a 'hands off approach' for first week is crazy.

Wonder why a nanny would advise that

How old are your other children?

The food issue / yes obv comfort a crying baby - but again babies need to know that meal times are for eating - if they don't want the food then missing a meal won't starve them - esp if has afternoon milk - but personally I would then give next meal a bit earlier

You need to let the nanny bond and as other have said babies sense if parents are about and winge play up

I think it's a question of schools of thought whether you would use the term "manipulating". I wouldn't, and wouldn't have been happy with someone being my child's main non-parental carer who used it.

But, we have always favoured quick handovers, now at school, my boy waves me off, and is baffled as to why the other parents hang around so much. Even being dropped off at Grannie's, I get asked "when are you going to work. Bye now."

There seems to be a mixture of opinions on this... some would pick up baby, others would not.

Ultimately I feel it comes down to the match between nanny and parents, you either want someone who will do things in a similar way to you, or you want someone who will do things differently. Up to you which works for you.

If you want things done your way, then say so. Nanny isn't a mind reader so does not know if you are unhappy about something.

Manipulation at ten months?! Eh I don't think so your nanny needs some training in infant brain development.

I'm surprised she suggested a long handover, most nannies want anything but so they can get on and bond with the children.

Manipulation was a poor choice of word imo but I don't think she was wrong.

..wow. .. :-o

I always find posts like this weird. ofc nanny wasn't right.

Nannies aren't there to dictate a new parenting style. .it needs to be fluid and consistent. You find a nanny to suit you and then discuss any particular issues between you so that you are both in agreement and on the same page.

using the word manipulation is horrible imo, and if I were boss id be having a hard time not worrying.

Ive always had 1-2 weeks of 'settling in' with mum around. Yes its unusual for babe to just suddenly take to you in that time but I think it gives me time bto observe their parenting. . give baby time to recognise me in a familiar and safe environment and a decent time for us to get to know each other...for the exact reason the op posted this...she obviously said all the right things in her interview?

I think you are definitely right and not nanny. I would be worried by her comment, although I think she can make suggestions if she does it sensitively. She could have said, "have you tried such and such, it has worked for me" if she thought you were having difficulty.

It's up to you to choose the parenting style. People obviously have different views from this thread, but there is no way that your approach is wrong or should be ignored by the nanny. It is up to you to say to her "this is how we do things" rather than the other way round.

Personally, I would feed a 10 month old if they were hungry (within reason, not if it interrupted something you were doing with other children or similar) and not worry too much about "times" for snacks.

Mind you, I would give my nearly 5 year old a piece of fruit if she was hungry because if I was hungry I would eat one. I think it's about healthy eating rather than making meal times into a battle of wills.

I don't have any comment about the settling in period because I have never experienced this with a Nanny. Two days isn't very long though - I wouldn't have expected them to bond within that time.