Feel uneasy about a nanny - should I tell parents?

[lechatnoir]

Bit of background:
Nanny 'A' has been with this family full time for 3-4 years. She started when 1st child was about 6 months old, baby 2 arrived within 18months then a year later baby 3 arrived. So fairly full on role for a young girl who took on her first nanny job caring for 1 child but soon had sole charge of 3 children under 4 (now 1, 2 & 4). I live near the family (know them to exchange pleasantries but nothing more) but nanny + charges regularly attend the same groups/park as me.

We've spoken many times & she's very nice BUT she really doesn't seem to be interested in, or even like the children . It's always takes someone else telling her one of her charges needs changing/nose wiping/is crying etc (so not great but not enough to get involved in someone else's business over) but in the last 6 months since she's had all 3 children in her care there has been a noticeable decline in her attitude & demeanour towards the children to the point where I & 2 other mums ended up discussing her today (after witnessing her being heavy handed almost to the point of being rough with 1 of them) and I'm clearly not the only one who has noticed that she seems constantly cross with them & disinterested to the point of almost ignoring their needs . I suspect she's over her head & isn't coping with the hours/number of children but don't know her well enough to do or say anything meaningful and actually, she's probably in the wrong profession!!!

As a parent I'd want to know if this was my children and as a child-care professional (cm) I also feel I have some sort of duty to act upon what I've seen but given I barely know the family, I'm not sure how they'd react to virtual stranger knocking on their door saying what a crap nanny they've got!! WWYD?

If she was their Mum how would you feel?

If they were my children I would want to know and I would be so grateful of anyone telling me,you have worded this really well just repeat what you have posted to the parents. Could you send them a letter? Might make it easier for them to take in.

I would try and differentiate between what you've actually seen her do and what you perceive her attitude to be i.e. 'she doesn't seem to be interested in...' etc.

If you've seen her do something inappropriate then report that to the family, in a formal, 'I saw x do y'. Don't say 'heavy handed almost to the point of being rough' because that's a subjective view, say exactly what she did and what the circumstances were and let the family deal with it from there.

No personal experience here, but if it was my child I would prefer to know - even from a random stranger.

As I hate confrontation I would be tempted to send a letter to the home just asking the mum or dad to get in touch as I am a bit concerned by some things I have seen concerning their kids, and can they please contact me directly as soon as convenient with phone numbers and email addresses. I wouldn't say the Nanny is the concern in writing. If they delegate the task to the Nanny then I would make something up and forget about it. Assuming one or other parent is interested enough to follow up, I would try and explain my worry.

I had an inexperienced nanny (faked references via an agency) and was very pleased that another friend's nanny spoke to me about her pulling my 21 month old around. I knew the other nannies in the group very well and trusted them. I also had a bad experience with a babysitter (I've got 3 children and the oldest is now 15) and again someone spoke to me. Please be brave, she had left my three year old in a pool on her own and I would never have known if someone hadn't told me. I was very grateful for both interventions.

Tell the parent.

Thanks a note through the door might be an idea or I wondered about asking (not mentioning why of course) if any of my local friends know the family who could at least mention my concerns & pass on my number if they wanted to discuss it further.
Just to clarify, I've really tried to not to be judgemental as there's been many a time with my DC that I'd sit at groups or in the park having a chat whilst they get on & play, but, there's a big difference between taking a step back and completely ignoring them. Thinking through the things I've actually seen, it's just little things like pushing the oldest down to sit in a chair when he clearly didn't want or particularly to, reprimanding (humiliating IMO) the 2.5 yrs old for wetting herself when it was home time, roughly putting a coat on the baby - again they might not sound too bad but it's the way she does it almost makes you wince for fear of them being hurt (IYKWIM) .

Gosh, the more I put down the worse it sounds . I'll definitely have to say something

Pushing the oldest down to sit in a chair (when he didn't want to sit down) - I don't really see the problem? Kids can't always do what they want to do can they?!

Telling a 2.5 year old off for wetting herself - if she was newly tt then it's not on, but if she's been out of nappies for a while and she chose not to go to the toilet then (again) I don't really see the problem.

Roughly putting a coat on the baby - depends on your definition of 'roughly' really. I think I possibly look 'rough' with the kids sometimes, but I've never hurt one while dressing them :)

However, you are there, you are a CM - so you are best placed to decide if you think the parents need to be told or not. If I were you, I'd write down as many specific things as you can think of because if I was the parent I would want to know, but having had a relationship with the nanny for that long (and presumably having shared care with her when on ML) it would be very hard to accept that her relationship with the children wasn't good if they weren't complaining. On the other hand the children may be complaining and your contact might give the parents the 'push' they need to re-think their childcare options. Just be very sure it's not just a 'different' way of doing things before you wade in though.

I don't agree with you, chipping - you don't push children into position and you don't shame them for toilet training accidents. You just don't.

I'd want to know, if it were my kids. A letter or something, to give me the info, and then it's my call whether to take it further.

Good luck, OP, and good on you for speaking up.

Actually, I have no issue with gently pushing my children into position. Telling a child off for a wee accident...depends on why the accident happened and how long they've been continent. DD3 was dry day and night before her 2nd birthday, so by 2.5 I'd be unhappy if she wet because she was careless. Not upset if she genuinely couldn't help it.

Context, is everything.

Bolshie - disagree all you like. I am happy to place a child on a seat when they don't want to sit down. If you'd like to point out where I, or the OP even, said anything about 'shaming a child'...??

Lougle exactly!

chipping, my apologies, you didn't say shaming, but the OP said "...reprimanding (humiliating IMO) the 2.5 yrs old for wetting herself when it was home time" - which sounded like shaming to me.

It is the OP's opinion that telling a child off for wetting themselves is humiliating... that's not the same as shaming a child and it's not my opinion that telling a 2.5 year old off for wetting themselves is humiliating. I don't see anything wrong with telling a child off for wetting themselves in some circumstances - as Lougle said, 'context is everything'.

Yes, but the OP is the one with the fullest understanding of the context in this case, surely?

OP, I would be very upset as a mother if you DIDN'T tell me. It would be up to me then to verify the information and decide whether it fitted a pattern that was making me uncomfortable, or if it seemed so at odds with what my happy children were telling me that I wouldn't want to take action. But I would want to be able to make that choice for myself.

Devora - yes, as I said 'However, you are there, you are a CM - so you are best placed to decide if you think the parents need to be told or not'. Sheesh.

For what its worth (while everyone else argues over what is right and wrong in their own opinions! ) ..

as a nanny, it is of MY opinion that if these actions you witnessed were by the parent then as the children are there own it is up to them how they treat their children. However this woman is emoloyed. She is being trusted to care for them and it is not ok for her to be pushing a unwilling child into a seat. Or generally being rough putting babies coat on etc. If this was my girl id be so upset that someone I employ to care for her is disinterested in her charges, careless and rough. - I think you need to say something. The fact that she behaves this way publically attracting attention of otherparents would make me coconcerned about her attitude towards them in private. It sounds like this girl is poorly suited to childcare but is enjoying a probably well paid job and rarely has anyone around to monitor or pull her up on her attitude so has declined as her years with the family have continued.

oh fgs..bloody touch screen. sorry for typos etc.

I don't shove my ds into a chair if he doesn't want to and I don't rough my youngest to get a coat on.

Anyway the point is, she is a nanny. She should have the skills to manage these situations without resorting to force quite frankly. I've seen nannies operate (I have one as well) and my god they are brilliant at getting the children to do what I and many mums may struggle with.

If it were my nanny I would want to know.

OP your instinct says to say something. I agree with others that it's subjective but in my opinion, where DC are involved SAFE is better than sorry.

Bear in mind, when you write your letter, that would you see is just a snapshot, and only at the park/play group?

You say nobody knows her, but you may know somebody who knows her family. So, I take it this young girl is alone at the park/playgroup with her charge of 3 young children, and the local mums and childminders use this time to judge her, rather than befriend her?

It is quite typical. If you are nanny, the mums wont talk to you, neither will the cms.

It could be that the only time you see her, is when she is doing the most lonely and isolated part of her job, which is taking the children out to play, and she feeling looked at and judged?

The things you mention does not seem too bad. Seems to me she is in an uncomfortable position.

I also agree that a proffessional child care provider should never push, pull or shove children. My own DD at age 3 (very articulate) explained to me that her Keyworker had pulled her by the wrist into the toilets and that it had hurt her.

I went straight in to speak to the manager. NO pulling, pushing or shoving is ok with little children. It's completely unnecessary.

Quint I see how you're explaining it....the Nanny could feel self concsious when the DC won't do as they are told and so react. But again...that's a sign that she's not able to manage well.

Ok, our first nanny wasn't great in many ways. We had a neighbour who rang me up a couple of times about her. I obviously wanted to know that she was smoking whilst pushing DD in the pushchair (!!!) but in terms of the other stuff she talked about there was an element of nosy neighbour about the calls.

And then guess what?! As we were coming to ending things with this nanny the woman turned around and goes: "Oh do you think she could day a day for me?" WTF, if you had 'concerns' about her to the extent you were phoning me to gossip about her.

I guess my point for you is - you don't want to sound like that nosy neighbour! I am not sure there is enough in what you've said for it not to come across as mostly subjective. If she's recently taken on looking after the third child, maybe she is struggling a bit BUT if I were you I would leave it another couple of weeks and then see. The last thing you'd want the parents to conclude is that the nanny is just somehow being marginalised/sniped about by the parents and CM. I'm not saying you are doing this but I just think you need either stronger examples or a more sustained pattern of behaviour.

For example, if she were on her phone while they were crossing the road unsupervised I would be standing in front of the parents' house until they got home to tell them...being facetious but you see what I mean.

I'd pop a note through the door "i have concerns about how your nanny is treating your children, I see her at toddler group a lot. would you like to discuss them with me?" and leave your contact details.

debuck that would fill the poor mother with terror! Far better to briefly explain the concerns in the note and leave it at that with an offer of more talk if wanted.