Feeling second best to nanny's other job!

[knackeredmother]

I have posted on here many times about my nanny woes and I know our nanny probably isn't the best fit for us but she does a good enough job and we are just too stressed and tired to rehire!
So, she has worked for us for a year and a half. She works 2 days a week. She did work 3 days but about 3 months ago said shed found another job for 2 days a week and wanted to drop a day with us. It was difficult but we worked around it.
I really do feel we are considerate employers, for example her mum died recently and we gave her the whole time she was off (2 weeks) paid whereas the other family made her take unpaid leave. Similarly when her MIL died I far her a week paid leave.
The issue comes that she clearly sees the other family as 'more important'. For example her son was poorly recently and she called in sick for our working days (which we paid) but openly said she wouldn't miss work for the other family and arranged alternative care for him!
The main issue I could do with advice ( if you've got this far) is regarding her OFSTED registration. Both families need it and we each have agreed to fund half the costs. Her first aid course is due for renewal (it is a 2 day course) and she has basically said she wants to do this course during our working days. She refuses to ask the other family if they will give her paid time off to do it.
I realize she must do this in work time ( although I would be interested to hear if all nannies do this in work time especially as it was a requirement of the job that the nanny is OFSTED registered) but am a bit annoyed she automatically expects us to cover the days not the other family.
There are no courses when she could do one day from each families days.
I was thinking I could ask the other family to cover the whole cost of the course and OFSTED registration ( about £170) and we cover the days off and inconvenience of finding alternative childcare.
I'm also not sure what to do about the feeling there is more respect the for the other employers than us. Toughen up?!!
I would be grateful for any advice!

MrAnchovy - what about if the hours change and the nanny doesn't want to do the new hours? Does that mean redundancy - ie a 2 day nanny position is redundant, to be replaced by a 3 day nanny?

OP I run a company so have to deal with problem employees all the time.

I didn't realise this was the river nanny - she is a liability and an unsafe one at that.

Ask her to do first aid at the weekend. It's her responsibility. Point out that you have paid for x days compassionate leave and y days sick leave that was not in her contract.

For the next nanny, put in the contract who pays for this stuff and if it can be done in working hours.

If you crack down on this nannys piss taking behaviour she may leave which would be no bad thing.

What if the op wants to change hours bit nrw nanny agrees to do them though

She sounds horrendous OP. I have had some fantastic nannies over the years and they would be horrified at her behaviour. She has a massive amount of brassneck.

Good luck with getting rid.

I remember our CM telling me that she was doing a first aid course at the weekend at some point last year. I didn't really think about it at the time though. So weekend courses do exist. I presume that she paid for it as part of her CPD.

Good luck OP. I find it helps to remember that you're paying her to provide you with a service. MN taught me that .

Update...... I've had a chat with my nanny and explained it appears most nannies will do first aid in their own time. She got quite annoyed at this and said she had never heard such a thing.
Her other boss has told her she is not happy with my suggestions and will give her one day off. She must find a course that runs on one of our days and one of hers. When I suggested this nanny said try don't exist. When other MB says it our nanny has been on the phone to colleges trying to negotiate these dad to attend!
This has opened my eyes, we are too soft, she has no respect for us and I've had enough.
We need a new nanny but the legal side of things seem so complex. I need to work out how to do this without ending up in a tribunal!

They not try, days not dad. Must proof read.

Your nanny is taking you for a ride because she knows she can get away with you. You have to stop it now and look for another nanny I think. As a nanny, there is no requirement for her to be Ofsted registered (whereas childminders have to be Ofsted registered). Regarding first aid, it's her responsibility to ensure she has the right qualifications, so it is fair if you split with the other family. I think she's forgotten that you will ultimately write her references if she looks for a new job!

You could advertise for a mothers helper or childminder? And change the job description sufficiently to warrant a new role?

I need to work out how to do this without ending up in a tribunal!

No you don't, you need to go and see a lawyer who will explain how a compromise agreement works. It won't cost you a great deal and all your problems with this person will go away.

Wrt the references it appears it is very difficult to give a bad reference. Our nanny was offered her other job just after the 'dd nearly falling in the river' incident and basically asked me if I was going to mention it. She said she would rather turn down the job than have them know about the incident.
When I looked into it further it seemed I was not allowed to mention the incident whether I wanted to or not.
It seems very difficult as an employer and I've made a lot of mistakes. If it wasn't for my sons poor health I would just go with a nursery.

Do you get employment advice with your nanny payroll company if so use them! If not, this would be my analysis although I'd strongly recommend posting this on the employment board and asking for advice.

1. You've employed her for 1 1/2 years so she has rights for unfair dismissal but not 2 years so no statutory redundancy.

1. To claim unfair dismissal it is necessary for an employee to prove that the employer has dismissed unfairly (ie without a formal process) or for an unfair reason.

1. Therefore what you need to do (with help from a lawyer or employment advisor is list factually all your reasons for dismissal e.g. river incident, dropping of day, lack of flexibility, sick days first aid course hoo -haa and follow ACAS Code of Practice. Although it could be argued you've accepted the first 2 what the 2nd is pointing at is a general failure to commit to the job which is making it unworkable. A compromise agreement may be an easier and less stressful way to deal with this.

1. If you can give her pay in lieu of notice as you won't want her near your dd once she knows the job is coming to an end.

HTH. Once you get rid of her and find a good nanny you will realise how much better life can be.

Why weren't you allowed to mention the incident? If it was based on facts there shouldn't be a problem referring to it.

My very strong advice is to speak to a lawyer, tell him you have not been able to rebuild trust since the river incident and get this advice. A compromise based on good references in return for no legal claims is pretty much on the cards. First meeting will be free. Letter will cost up to £150, compromise + independent advice for her will add another £200 or so. You'd probably have to make an extra payment too to her on top of notice & holiday pay.

Alternative is to simply tell her that this 2 day thing isn't working out and you need someone for 3 days plus two Saturdays per month and can she do it; If not you will have to make her redundant. There is a risk however that she may agree to this, which will give you problems. If you are absolutely sure she couldn't accept those hours then you could avoid a compromise agreement.

I also don't see why you couldn't mention the river incident? Did you give her a documented verbal or written warning?

You have a responsibility to give a fair (to both sides) and accurate reference.

Your nanny is taking the piss and manipulating you. She needs to go.

Oh she is the river nanny incident :(

What do you do for childcare on the 3rd day she dropped

Simply say you need 3 days childcare - offer it to her as you need to legally - she will say no as can't do 3 days as does 3 days for other family - you say sadly then you must make her redundant as she can't not fill the position you need

Simple fair and legal :)

Where are you? I need a new 3 day job