Childminders Club - HELP with mealtimes - PLEASE!! (sorry, it's long!!)

[HellyBelly]

Hello

I need some advice please.

I have a problem with mealtimes at the moment and I just don't know what I should do for the best. BTW, in case this is misread as me not liking my mindee, that's so very not true! Just need some advice

I've had mindee X (nearly 3) since July and mealtimes have always been hard work but it's getting worse. At first it was just hard to get her to eat vegetables and my home cooked meals with 'bits' in (peppers, onion, peas etc). Bit by bit I've managed to get her to eat new things but she'll still say she doesn't want it most of the time (her parents admit she eats crap when they have her).

Anyway, now it's not just the food.

She always has to go for a nap straight after lunch as she takes so long to actually eat her meals, if I put her down any later she would not go to bed early enough at night. Well recently she's become very clever and does what she can to delay and delay her afternoon nap! For example, she'll take forever eating her lunch (as usual) and then quite often asks for something else to eat, even when full, and sits there with the bowl for a bit then says she doesn't want it. I'm fairly sure this is delay tactics but what annoys me is the food just gets thrown without being tasted - a waste (I know kids waste food, that's not my problem, it's that she obviously never intended to eat it). This problem doesn't bother me as much as the next......

Evening mealtimes are difficult. My ds always had good food but since I've been childminding, he's picked up the fussy habits which is a real shame as he won't eat the mix of things he used to - anyway, that's another story. I have 2 problems at the moment:

1. I give her something she doesn't like, she leaves it and fills up on biscuits, banana's, pasta when she gets home. Is there any point in me trying to still get her to eat better? I think not as she's clever and knows she won't end up hungry! (although the mum wants her to eat better and has told me to tell her when her dd doesn't eat so she knows not to give her biscuits etc, having said that, she'd still give her loads of her pasta etc so it's not going to make a difference I don't think)

2. My ds has always been a fast eater and she's ultra slow (although I think a lot are at that age). What she's started doing since coming back in the new year is the second my ds has finished and asked to leave the table to play, she suddenly says she's finished and doesn't want any more and asks to play. Problem is we eat in the lounge so are in the same room as the toys. I've started saying that she has to stay at the table even though she doesn't want anymore as she's hardly eaten anything. She then continues to eat as she's not getting to play. She just pretends she's not hungry any more to play but I don't know if telling her she has to stay at the table is the right thing to do????

I've had a lot of problems with her lying to me and not listening as much recently - her mum thinks she's started to behave more like what she's like for her parents, now she's been here a while. There are a few main problems with this but I'll post those in another thread

Any advice about mealtimes would be great!

bump

I had one like this once what i did in agreement with mum was to give her a set time to eat and if she didnt it went straight in the bin no comment no nothing but also nothing in between other than a drink.Believe me it seems harsh but it worked.This also means though that you and mum have to be in total agreement and mum cannot supplement at home so child knows there is no second sitting to go for.
Have you tried only giving her a tiny bit rather than even a portion size on a plate that worked well too.It is so unfair because i suppose for you its like with me -chucking food goes against the grain,your own kids are expected to eat etc I know it is really hard.

OR

Getting her involved with food-
making fruit salad
growing cress to go in a sandwich
fruit picking in summer
making a sandwich herself-obviously all supervised.

I agree with Joanna 4, I have a minee who is the same, with agreement with her family we set a time and if she hasn't finished her dinner/tea goes in the bin, it does seem harsh but it works.(I used to be icemum btw)

Im sorry but im on the time limit idea as well. Also although it may annoy you what the mother gives her when she gets home it(and please dont take offence) really isnt your worry. After all i dont think you would like it if someone else was not happy with what you feed your ds in your own home would you? Children of this age are often bad/picky eaters....looks like your one of the lucky ones with your ds. Fell proud of yourself that you are offering a varied and nutritious menu thats all that can be asked surely.
HTH

Joanna4 - thanks for that. Before Christmas that's exactly what I was doing - if she didn't eat a reasonable amount then no dessert and just in the bin. I don't have a problem throwing food away if not eaten - it was the daily asking for something but not wanting it - just wanting to delay going for a nap (new since new year, if you knew all the other clever little things she does you'd know what I mean - for another thread though ). I'll just continue as I am with this and in my head pretend she ate it

The evening meal is the main concern as she decides to stop the second ds asks if he can leave the table - a kind of copying phase I guess.

Joanna4 & HenniPenni - I love the idea of a time limit I will speak to her mum about this as she's all for speeding up things as her naps are starting later and later at the moment. Out of interest, how long do you think is reasonable for a nearly 3 year old girl? (mum will ask for my opinion on time as she always asks what I think). Lunch is usually sandwiches etc and evening is cooked dinner.

nzshar - maybe I didn't explain myself well enough? The parents DO want her to eat healthily and want me to encourage this as she's with me most of the time. They want to have rules as they've admitted they've let her get away with whatever she wants since she was very small. They want her to not be given stuff at home if she doesn't eat at mine - she can just wrap herself around their little fingers and they find it hard!

I think I just need to have a 'proper' talk with them to find out exactly what they want and we all stick with it. They've told me what they want but aren't sticking to it I get on really well with the mum though so I'll give have words with her again.

Anyone here cook different meals for different children?

Sorry HellyBelly slight mix up there then and i see that half your battle is getting the parents to stick to a course of action.
I truely think the time limit idea is maybe a good start. I give my ds 20 mins then its nothing more than water after that though occaisionally i may offer again around a half hour later but if refused i throw away. Nothing else is given. BTW my ds is only 20 months though so may be different with a child a year older.

It's brilliant that you can discuss this so sensibly with her mum. I guess that perhaps both of you should tell her together what the "new" rules are so that she can't play either of you off against each other.

Personally, I would prefer to offer the meal and, if it's not eaten, ditch it (or make it into a pie for your dh, he'll never know). I would hope that her parents could be strong enough not to give in to her when they are at home but, even if they do, it is something that they choose to do and is "not your problem" (in the nicest possible way).

I also wouldn't have a problem with her "filling up" with bananas at home, they're yummy and better than biscuits!! When she asks for something else to eat, what are you giving her?

how old is your DS? Perhaps you could ask him to stay a bit longer at the table before playing and so wait until your mindee has finished? May be a bit of a pain and perhpas unfair on him, but might work?

TP - we did sit down with mindee and tell her new rules together Oh well, will speak to her mum about the time limit thing then I know where I stand. What was worrying me is that I KNOW she's wanting to get up once ds does regardless of whether or not she's had enough, and I was worried about mum being annoyed that she'd not eaten properly and needs to be fed again at home (as they pay for the evening meal). If we agree a time thing and they know she may be hungry then there's nothing else I can do!

The 'something else' i.e. dessert offered is usually Apples, Banana's, Oranges, Melon, Grapes, Yoghurts - she tends to choose apples

Thanks popmum - been doing that but I do let him leave after waiting another 10 mins just sitting there as I feel that's quite a long time for his age - anyone else think I should be making him stay longer? (problem is I've had big behaviour problems with him since I started minding and he's sooooo much better, I just don't want him to feel punished for nothing iyswim)

It is still up to the parents as to how they deal with the situation at home, I guess you just have to explain the rules as they will be in your house. Would the parents prefer her not to have an evening meal with you at all? Then the little girl can sit and watch everyone else tucking into something yummy, and realise that she's missing out!?

Could you make a wallchart and write down the "mealtime rules" so that all the children know them, rather than just her. You can include all the stuff about not talking with your mouth full etc., as well as the actual rules you want her to know (ie. nothing else offered if you don't eat what you're given, time limit etc).

Ok, will try the wall chart thing. Totally agree that it's up to the parents, I just get confused about what to do when they say one thing one minute and then admit (in embarrassed but giggly way) that they did the opposite to what we've agreed. As I said before, we get on really well and they have told me we're like family to them so it's all fine, I just find it hard to know what to do for the best.

My main worry was that it's ds getting up that's causing her to stop eating more. Parents are happy for her to be told to stay at the table until they collect her at 6.30pm. What do you think about that?

(I agree about banana's btw, think that was a one off though )

Sorry forget to say, they definitely want her to have her evening meal here.

Had a quick scan and couldn't see anything about what time she actually sits down to have her evening meal?

It must be hard for parents to enforce what they want to happen at home, but having a problem in actually doing it.

5-5.30pm (aim for 5pm but sometimes she'll have a toilet accident or something which delays the cooking a little)

I know, poor daddy just can't say no . I think I will stop saying "remember you won't be allowed anything else at home like mummy said" like agreed with her mum as I feel that she'll then not listen to anything I say (as we've been having other problems recently) if what I have said is different to what actually happens at home iyswim? Sorry if I'm not making myself clear, been feeling rotten over the weekend and trying to explain myself with a foggy head and noisy ds!!

If she does sit down for meal at 5pm, staying there till 6.30pm seems like a long time, whatever the parents say (unless you have the meal later). It would be nice to have everyone on the same side and doing the same thing, but it obviously isn't going to be happen.

Therefore, anything you say to the child has to be your rules and what you want to happen - so no, you won't be able to tell her that she can't have anything else at home, because she probably will. If the parents are OK with what you do (such as throwing the meal away and not giving anything else), then so be it. (And I hate wasting the food either, so definitely make it into a pie for dh!)

I've certainly had similar instances where everyone suddenly has "finished" their meal because someone else has been allowed to get down and play. Thankfully, it's only ever been an occasional incident.

Would it make any difference if you made a much smaller portion (and had fruit or whatever afterwards if she wants) so that she actually feels that she's achieved something?

I certainly don't think you should make your ds stay at the table. If you did a wallchart, your ds could get a star for eating nicely!

I LOVE the chart thing with ds getting a sticker for eating well - brilliant . She'll really hate that as her behaviour has changed since ds has been a better behaved boy - she doesn't like it, bless. I will try much smaller portions then, just to see what happens Sorry, just so not used to it as ds is SOOOO the opposite so needed guidance - great advice as usual

Just to make clear - I don't leave her til 6.30pm, just say that and she stays and eats more. Then I praise her for eating more and say she can now leave because she's eaten more and I'm happy etc etc. I always let her get up unless dinner was late and tbh, her mum quite often arrives around 6.10pm.

TP - could really do with some other advice on this mindee re: the change in her behaviour (she's still gorgeous though ) - will try posting about this later or some time tomorrow

p.s. glad you don't think I should make ds stay at the table - I was suggested this by a friend but must admit I feel like he's being punished when he's been a good boy which sends a confusing message after all the behaviour problems I've just sorted out!

Hi Hellybelly - I too had a major problem with one of my mindees not eating a while back and someone on here also suggested to me to offer smaller portions - it has helped ever so slightly. My other mindee eats very well and quite quickly so as she finishes first, I only ask her to wait for five minutes before getting down. I personally don't cook different things for different mindees - I'm afraid I just would not have the time - I cook three weeks in advance and freeze so only take out what I need the night before. However, I usually have a bowl of pasta on standby that I cook first thing in the mornings when baby goes down for a nap just in case mindee (with eating problem) doesn't eat at all he may try a little pasta - generally though if they don't like what I cook it goes in bin (or over my back fence onto derelict land for foxes) - don't like to see food wasted! As far as say pudding goes, until good proportion of lunch/dinner eaten no pudding but in saying that if I really thought one of them was hungry, I would bring forward snack time so they could eat their fruit!

Spoke to mum this morning briefly and she agreed to talk to me properly and decide what to do.

Just quickly, is this unreasonable..............lunch on the table at 12.30. Just a sandwich with carrot sticks this time to see how quickly this could be eaten. I said the nap would be at 2pm regardless of whether lunch is finished or had time dessert. At 2pm she was still eating her sandwich . I feel really cruel but I said she couldn't have any dessert as we had no time and then put her for a nap - she seemed fine with this and so does mum.

Do you think this is ok?

Also, quick question - should I be spoon feeding a child who is about to turn 3?

Think thats more than fair, would be given 20 mins here! Do you think she would respon to a bit of "bet you can't finish yours before such and such?" Have done it with my own and it works wonders (for a while ).

I wouldn't expect to spoon feed a 3 year old but it would depend on co-ordination etc.

I do the bet you can't.... thing but she's clever and knows that faster means nap sooner . Really, it's because she doesn't want her nap anymore - just don't know what else to do!

As for spoon feeding - perfectly capable, just lazy (her mums words!) She even asked me to feed her the pita bread the other day lol Her mum admits she feeds her at home as she can't stand how long it takes her to eat and she's so lazy, she wants people to feed her. I try and encourage them to eat on their own but help when needed iyswim as otherwise, I reckon she'd be spoon feeding at 5! Just not sure whether maybe I should spoon feed her after all???

Hmmm, I think what I would do is suggest to her parents that you would like to limit the time given to eat her meals to 20mins/half an hour and then, no ifs or buts bin it.

Buy a timer so that she can see how long she has got. I would also encourage her to spoonfeed herself too, providing the parents are happy I feel this would be the way to go.
After all a few days of this and perhaps going a little hungry (I know it's against our grain to seee a child go hungry), it may have the desired effect!!

Good plan - will speak to mum about these time limits! Just to confirm, you are saying I should continue to let her feed herself and just help if needed rather than do what her mum does which is spoonfeed her? If so, I'll see if maybe mum wants to try and let her do it more at home but will respect her decision if she chooses not to at home, it's her decision after all