CM has just bought a puppy WWYD?

[LucyLastik]

We have been using a CM since DS was 6 months old. At the time he started going, there were no dogs involved.

DD2 started to go too this year. She is 16 months atm. This week, our lovely CM has bought a puppy. I'm really uncomfortable about it tbh. If she had had the puppy when we were looking for childcare, no way would I have considered using her. The trouble is, we have become great friends over the last 3 years and DH and I consider her a part of our family. There was very little notice of the puppy. A friendly, yet pushy phonecall on one day and then the dog was there the next, with no time to really think about it or to discuss with DH.

I'm really upset about it. So far, CM seems unbothered that we may remove our children (they make up 50% of her business).

WWYD?

What sort of dog is it?

it doesn't matter what kind.

I think she was unreasonable to do this with almost no warning, if I was a CM I would at least warn the parents in advance so that it was their decision whether to leave their child with me.

Having said that, I chose my CM partly because she does have a dog and told me that she also has had a dog and always will. I saw it as a big positive experience for my dd because we only have a cat at home and she was startign to become afraid of dogs for no apparent reason. She absolutely adores the childminders dog and he is well trained and very gentle. I trust my childminder to keep my dd safe too, this was a gut reaction when I first met my CM and I think you have to go on that when you are trusting your child with someone.

If I was you I would be telling the CM that you are concerned and asking how she is managing the puppy and the children at the same time and what she is putting in place eto keep everyone safe and happy. If it is done in the right way this could be a valuable learning experience for your children.

As a childminder we make sacrifices every day for our own families, and often put the needs and requirements of the minded children first. In this instance your cm has done something for herself and her own family. If you trust her, then you trust her with everything and that includes managing a puppy and your children. If you don't, and that seems to be what you're saying, then remove your children with the proper process.
Would there be this issue if it was a cat, bird, rabbit, hamster etc? Or if the childminder became pregnant.
Yes, we offer a service, we have to be very considerate of other people's needs while they are in our homes, but it does not mean that we have to discuss and have signed off every aspect of our lives.
I have a dog, a massive german shepherd x to be precise, he is utterly huge and the soppiest creature you'll ever meet when children are around. However, when I began my business I risk assessed him and took appropriate action (he is walked early every morning for him to let off steam, I have a stairgate on the lounge door where his bed is, he is let out into the garden when the children are engaged with other activities).
The only time he would be an issue is if someone had an allergy. In that instance, they would be unable to use my services.

I think this could be a good opportunity for your children if you tried to overcome your own dog issues. If your cm is going to put safety measures in place, and you will only know this by discussing it with her, then I would write her a letter stating your concerns, and that if after x period (4 weeks maybe?) you are not happy then you will be removing your children.
My sil is much the same as you, utterly terrified of large black dogs, her children were the same (squealing and shrieking every time they came within a few feet of an animal), but their response wasn't based on an experience, it was purely their mother's fear. Now they are happy to come into our home, they play with the dog in the garden and love to come on walks with me around the fields with him. Even the 18month old can shout bed! to him and that's where he goes.

Please be aware that these are your issues, not your children's or your childminders. She has a right to have things she desires in her own home. Tread carefully and consider all angles, because it would be silly to ruin a good working and personal relationship just because of this.

yes it would be exactly the same with a cator birds in that I would expect to be informed in advance. with a cat I would have to take dc out (allergies), bird would be fineas long as it'snot flying around when the dc are around.
the very least would be informing the parents, there could be an issue with allergies that thecm is not aware of.

I'm presuming its a puppy as in a small dog, not a baby T-Rex or anything?

If you are afraid of dogs I don't think you should project it onto your children. I bet they will love having the puppy at cm's house, and for you they will have all the fun of playing with a puppy and you'll have none of the mess.

Win win?

OP your children are much more likely to be in danger around dogs if they are not used to them, react inappropriately to them and inherit your fear of them. The vast majority of dogs are perfectly harmless, the vast majority of owners are responsible about how they keep their dogs around children and if I were you I would take this opportunity to introduce my kids to a puppy and get them used to how they should react around dogs. Children need to be taught about and socialised with dogs as much as puppies need to do the same with people.

Mousey, there should be NO issue regarding allergies that the cm is not aware of. If the parent knows then the cm must know too. It's an absolute requirement.

Mousy, not mousey (stupid phone!)

yes, but sometimes parents don't think this kind of information is important and things can change, minor allergies can become severe...

If you want a sanitised, institutional environment, then you need to use a nursery.

If you want to have a homely, family environment, you take your risk with a childminder having different family values to you.

If you want dictate everything, then you have to look after your child yourself or get a nanny.

Simple.

What nonsense, MindtheGappp.

My families chose me to cm for them BECAUSE I have similar family values to them, i.e. no dogs on the premises.

Op's CM is moving the goalposts. She did not give adequate notice of her intention to get a dog.

Simple.

It's not nonsense.

The OP's childminder wants to enrich her family life by having a dog. The OP doesn't agree. That is the risk you run with childminders. You can't control them. This is one of the downsides of using childminders - but outweighed by immense advantages.

I would have loved for my DC's childminder to have had a dog. It would have allowed my children to have a dog without having to worry about it being in an empty house all day.

If a parent wants to have 100% control, they need to have childcare in their own home or use a nursery. If they are use someone else's house, they have to accept the rules and cultures of that house.

You obviously don't trust her though, because you don't trust her to keep your children safe with a dog in the house.

I genuinely don't understand what it is that you're expecting a puppy to do that is so terrifying though...

I think that you at least owe her the opportunity to discuss the safety measures with her before deciding to withdraw your children.
If you trust her as much as you say you do then you will trust that your childrens safety will be of paramount importance to her and you are more likely to loose the friendship by refusing to discuss things than a decision after careful consideration and discussion to remove them.

This is great for your kids. They will learn how to handle dogs, how to respect animals, and are far less likely to develop allergies. Win win win I think.

Oh it looks like you've already made your mind up.

That's a shame for everyone involved.

You should have given it a go for a few months. Your response seems pretty irrayional and guided by your own issues. You could have used the opportunity to get over your own fears.

"If you want a sanitised, institutional environment, then you need to use a nursery.

If you want to have a homely, family environment, you take your risk with a childminder having different family values to you.

If you want dictate everything, then you have to look after your child yourself or get a nanny.

Simple."

Very very true.

She was unprofessional to give you no notice she was getting a puppy a to not have an explanation of how she is planning on dealing with it eg child gates, crate for puppy etc

You are reacting very strangely to a puppy that's presumably around 8 weeks old. And you don't seem like you would be interested in any information about how she's going to deal with it - the fact she has it is enough to make you remove your children.

You sound more pissed off that she decided to get a dog than about the lack of warning. She is allowed you know. If you don't like it move your children, but being annoyed with her for getting a pet because your prejudice means you'll have to stop using her is rather silly.

It becomes your business when something goes wrong...

which could be something fairly major where small children and animals are concerned.

I think the CM should have given you enough notice (a month for example if that's your terms of notice) that you could have a think/chat about it and make a rational decision one way or another before the dog arrived. They should also have outlined to you exactly what measures they were planning to put in place to ensure the safety and well-being of your children in the light if the new addition to their family. Taking on a dog is a big commitment and a lot of work, so presumably they had given it a fair bit of consideration beforehand?

That said (and as you have probably gathered I am not a big dog lover at all), if you have a good relationship with her and trust her 100% otherwise, perhaps you could arrange a time to have a chat about the situation, explain that you are not comfortable and ask her to reassure you about the details of how the puppy/children thing will work.

Although I don't particularly like dogs per se (for several good reasons), I do have a couple of close friends with them, and I take those individual dogs at face value. One has a huge Russian Visler (?!), but I have no problem with DD being round there (our DD's are at school together and we help each other out with childcare from time to time) because I trust my friend and I know the dog was raised with small children from a puppy and is used to them. Most importantly DD is happy to be with the dog.

My in-laws also have a dog - they are totally responsible people and it is not their first dog. However, he has a neck problem and is not used to kids. He has snapped badly at DD's head/face on two occasions now, and even though they are family I would never allow DD to be in a room with that particular dog without my supervision.

Again, thank you for all the responses.

I have to say that it isn't just my views and feelings involved, obviously DH has to have a say so what I'm telling you here, isn't 100% my opinions on it, they are a mix of both.

I suggested to DH last night that we at least arrange to go round there and have a discussion about the safety measures she intends to put in place. I think a fair hearing is deserved before a decision is made on our part. However, I and DH do not feel that we were given a fair hearing on our feelings about the changes. DH feels that as this is the case, why should she have a fair hearing? My feelings on it are that she deserves an opportunity to discuss it with us as ultimately it is the children who will suffer.

I really, really do not have an issue with her having a dog. When the phonecall came, I did say that it was their house so ultimately up to them. Doesn't mean I'm happy about it and it doesn't mean that I have to continue with the arrangements when they have changed without prior notice or discussion. I don't think it is too much to ask to at least have the courtesy of giving us a bit of notice tbh.

I don't beleive I am trying to control her at all. I am simply trying to work out a solution to a problem which frankly isn't of my making. As has been mentioned, if a bit of notice had of been given, it could have been talked about properly on all sides and an informed decision made. I haven't said anything along the lines of "get rid of the dog or the kids are out of here", I haven't laid down any ultimatums.

TBH I'm not overly concerned at this stage about the puppy. It is only 5 weeks old so spends most of its time sleeping. This is why we haven't withdrawn the children already because at this moment in time, it poses no immediate threat. However, nobody knows to what size it will grow, nobody knows what it's temperament is likely to be and we are still to find out what safety measures are going to be put in place.

DH has spoken to her this week about it and has said we need a bit of time to talk it through between ourselves. Again, no mention or veiled threats were made. He has just said that we will do what I feel the CM should have given us an opportunity to do in the first place; think about the pros and cons and discuss them.

I thought puppies were supposed to stay with their mothers until they were eight weeks old?
Has it had its vaccinations?

malovitt you are right! 7 weeks is the recommended age for guide dogs and 8 for all other dogs!!! FFS 5 weeks is way too early. OP are you sure about it?

I am a dog lover, but I would expect the childminder at the very least to give a fair notice to the parents about taking the dog. Not a "drunken" phone call just before.

It is the CMs right to get a dog; as a person who operates a business from her home, I suppose she accepts the risk that some of the people who use her services don't like dogs and will move on. If you feel that strongly about it, you of course have the right not to use her. Did she at least verify, though, that none of her current charges had any allegeries? I think it's irresponsible if she didn't do that and also cares about keeping her current customers on.

For those who say that if you have care in the home you can always dictate what you do - 'fraid not. Well, not in my book anyway.

We use a nanny share where the other family's children are looked after in our home as well as an au pair. We are considering buying a cat. Of course I spoke to the nanny and the other family first as part of our decision making process - I wouldn't want them to be uncomfortable. But that's just me. My childcare arrangements are more important to me than getting a pet so if our current nanny or the other children were allergic/strongly disliked cats I wouldn't do it. It's a very personal decision, getting an animal, and quite possibly one that your CM feels very strongly that she must make. And it's her right. But I would have hoped that she would have explained her position first. I do think it's polite/prfessional if you are relying on her to provide a service in your home, it's a big change in the environment and obviously YOU would still be under the normal contractual obligations to end the relationship if you weren't happy about it.