CM says she can no longer take photos?

[ApuskiDusky]

Hi,

Our childminder has always taken quite a lot of photos of our ds when in her care - some of which she uses to demonstrate what she has been doing for OFSTED inspections; she sends all of them to us (and has put together a DVD of photos as a Christmas present in the past).

She has said today that she has to stop taking photos, other than ones she will use for OFSTED, as otherwise she has to pay some kind of fee to the NCMA? A new child protection scheme? So she can no longer send us any photos.

Have you heard about this, and is my CM's interpretation of this correct?

TIA

Thank Goodness I only have two weeks left as a CM !

Yes, I am registered as a food business and I get inspected by environmental health.

It makes you wonder how many pople will want to continue as CM. It is mad!

I phoned the ICO and complained about the fee. I told them I am not paying. IMO this is the start of charging fees for other stupid things as well!

They said that if I delete the photo and dont store it on my computer then it is fine! So that is exactly what I do. I print them off and then delete them.

Ridiculous!

I am a childminder and I've never heard of this thing with the photos, what's ICO?

I wonder if a photo uploaded to an online storage system, such as Picasa, then deleted from the camera and computer would thus not require registration, as then it's someone else holding the data (so they would need the registration not you). Is that what the ICO are saying when they say registration isn't needed if you delete the photo from the computer?

meditrina - there are exemptions, and the requirement to register only applies when the information is deemed 'personal'

nannynick - concerning parents' need to register... I doubt there is any, as the exemptions include keeping details for admin (including payroll). I would assume a family might be able to keep a spreadsheet for childcare costs without any more info than a fee paid, and initials of the recipient. If they held NI numbers and were responsible for notifying HMRC of salary paid, made out P45s and P60s, then even that may be covered under the exemptions, as it would be admin related.

garden pixies I was told by ICO that even if I immediately delete the picture I still have to pay as it will be possibly still accessible from the memory card.
I didn't pay. Pile of bollox IMO.

HSMM - "all the email addresses, phone numbers, etc I store"

by themselves, the e-mail address and phone numbers are simply a list of your clients, and would not need to be registered as far as I can tell.

I'm a bit puzzled that since there's an exemption for record keeping, and documenting the service (including observations) you provide alongside payments for that service is part of your record keeping, why OFSTED thinks you should be required to be registered with the ICO.

If you held no personal identification of the subject of a photograph, ie named them 'person-123' and used that as a prefix for every photograph, it would not constitute personal information. Only you (and the parents) would be able to put a name to a face.

FWIW, I'm interested because the charges I might face would be 500 pounds a year, though if I can be sure not to fall into the trap of having too many employees and pay MNetters up to 5K a month as commission then they will come under the record-keeping exclusion. I don't want to know NI numbers and have tax as PAYE to take out of lump sums!

Hmmmm ... I do have names on photos, but I was told it applied to all their personal information that I hold on my computer - names, emails, addresses, phone numbers, work contacts, emergency contacts, invoices, etc.

Does a list of clients really not need protecting?

I am certainly not an expert, just going on what I was told and read last year.

"protecting" is perhaps different from "registering" under the DPA, but...

There's a self-assessment guide to exemptions PDF

On page 13, one exemption, under 'Accounts and records' is

"keeping records of purchases, sales or other transactions to ensure that the relevant payments, deliveries or services take place"

You provide a service and document it as it is "being provided" by taking photographs from time to time. It justifies charging for your service and in my view is simple record keeping...

Page 14 says "This exemption covers the administration of customer and supplier records."

So that covers your invoices along with contact details for your clients, and your data is provided willingly for your (and their) convenience (rather than you seeking it from credit reference agencies, or collecting it in an underhand way).

The exemption for record keeping does not apply for childcare (or a range of other activities identified in Q5 of the self assessment guide). The records parents keep regarding employment of a nanny are not childcare records of course, they are employee records, so they are exempt.

NetworkGuy I'm impressed - I didn't realise you have a turnover of £29.5 million and 250 staff!

yes I have to register for my drama club but not for my parents plumbing business.

thanks for clarification re Q5...

As for the other, I had only seen the press release and had assumed it was either high turnover or over 250 staff, but on further reading, see it needs both (which surprised me, when public authorities have to register once they exceed 250 staff, though I suppose 'turnover' does not apply when they are not selling products or services to 'earn' income).

I haven't read all the replies so I'm not commenting on the DP registration: just the OP.

It sounds to me as though your CM has received a communication of some sort from the County Council. Ours has been saying on all the Safeguarding training that we're not allowed to take photos of the children usng mobile phones because of the Portsmouth case. This was quickly expanded to include all photos.

After many childminders pointed out that they could forget about any observations, then(!), they've backed down a bit and agreed that maybe they over-reacted a bit and childminders should just carry on as they've always done.

I think it would be worthwhile to have a policy - yep, another one - that states what photos are used for, how long you keep them, and where they are kept. One thing that did make sense was that we shouldn't keep photos on our phones: they should be downloaded and removed regularly in case we lose our phones or have them stolen.

My laptop grabs all the photos off my phone every time I am near it, using the blue tooth connection

Dear Ms E,

Thank you for your email of 17 May. We can confirm that childminders who process data on computer and / or use a digital camera to record the development of the children in their care, are required to notify under the Data Protection Act 1998.

You can start the application process on-line at www.ico.gov.uk/for_organisations/data_protection/notification/notify_or_renew.aspx or by telephoning our Notification Helpline on 01625 545740.

Alternatively, if you provide the following details by e-mail, we will raise a draft notification form that will be sent to you for further action.

Your full name and address.
A separate contact address for correspondence, if different from above. This address must be in the UK.
The name and daytime telephone number of the contact person for the notification.
A brief description of the nature of your business.
Regards

Notification Department

Bloody mental!!