My non-sleeping mindee

[Saltire]

is wearing me down.
I didn't have them yesterday due to me being ill,a nd on Monday he actually slept for more than 10 mintues in the 10 hour day, so was overall a far happier child.
He and his brother are due here at 10am, and the mum has already texted me to say he's been up since 4.45 am (he's 10 months), and hasn't slept yet,a nd has been screaming with tiredness since 9am

I am breaking out in a sweat already.
He won't sleep unless beign pushed in parm, in the upright position.
He won't sleep in cot, as he screams till he's sick, ditto if I lie the buggy flat.
If he's not asleep within 1 1/2 hour of beign pushed around, we have to stop so he can have food (I don't think I have ever seen a 10 motnh old eat asmuch), he needs food every 1 1/1/2 - 2 hours). Then he'll poo, so we have to stop again and change the nappy, and back to square one again.
If he doesn't sleep, then he won't let me down, he literally screams till he's sick if I try to sit him on floor, or even put him in high chair so i can cook!

Really could do with some tactics to get him to sleep[

Get a sling. An ergo is a good bet, or a patapum is a cheaper option. My ds was the same and liked to be carried.

I can't carry him, I tried, I borrowed both a sling and a backpack for him and he is so heavy, I couldn't walk the next day. Plus, he didn't like the backpack and was sick onme with his screaming

totally sympathise as I have a mindee 3 days a wk who can go without sleep for the full 10.5 hrs he's here!!! He's on the go all the time and by the time he goes home I am buggered

There isnt a lot you can do if that's the way he is, though I've found that putting mine in a car seat that I can rock sometimes - and I mean sometimes! - sends him off. He's such an inquisitive little chap I think he's frightened he might miss something if he goes to sleep

Was about to type that he's sleeping now, but too late, he's awake again screaming
He slept from 12.50 till now, 12.59

poor you

does he sleep at home with the mum

i think he needs to be sleep trained but obv both you and mum need to do the same thing and if mum wont/hasnt done anything about it then you have no chnace if she is carrying/rocking/pushing him all the time

its def harder for you as you have your own/other children to think about

why does he need so much to eat/could he have tummy ache as has too much food and is uncomfortable?

blondes - he is a big child - 10 months old, but wearing 18-24 motnh stuff. His older brother on the other hand is 2 1/2 and wears 12-18month stuff.

His mum works full time and he has been at home with the dad, and I think the dad has been "anything for an easy life" type. The older child will only sleep on the sofa with a blanket over him, he has a hissy fit if I try and put him in the bed. Of course older child isn't getting a sleep here either becasue we are walking miles - 4 1/2 on Monday to try and get the little one off to sleep.

i think i rem you posting about this family before, the sofa and did bit ring a bell

i send pity and luck and lots of it

I had a 10mth old like this and TBH it's a difficult age as it's when separation anxiety is at it's peak. He screamed the whole time and in the end I was a nervous wreck but I stuck it out for a good 10 weeks and suffered a miscarriage in the meantime (stress related?) but in the end I just ended the contract with the mother as it was affecting my mental health.He was a full-timer as well so not a decision I took lightly. Best thing I ever did.

Do you really need this mindee? If you can manage without then I would get rid, to put it bluntly. At the end of the day, it's your usiness and if it's affecting you in such a way that you dread each morning then what is the point?

We have jsut walked 1.5 miles to school, 1.5 miles back again, followed immedaitely by 1.5 miles round the base we live on, he fell asleep at the end of the street on the way home and has just woken up - 8.5 minutes. So 16 minutes sleep since 4.45am this morning, and his brother has now fallen asleep on the floor but will be woken up now by the brother who will scream blue murder from now till 5.30 when his mum gets here. The brother will also scream blue murder becasue he hates being woken from a sleep. Oh joys.
The little one, for the ntire wlak, was rubbing his eyes, pulling his hair, doing those long blinks that tired children do, but would not sleep

They are the only 2 I have, so if I give notice then I won't have any mindees

No mindees would be preferable to the one you have. I've been there before, and had my fingers burned.

You have 4 options:

1. Carry on as you are and hope that things improve.

1. Terminate the contract with the younger one and just keep on his older brother.

1. Terminate the contract with both of them and hope that other mindees will come along soon. It means accepting that sometimes, some children are just not ready for care outside of the home and just letting it go. He isn't settling and it's time to admit defeat.

1. The last option involves the co-operation of the parents and means sitting down with them and having a serious talk about an angle that you can both come from to tackle this issue. Does he really sleep at home? Is there a problem that he has that no-one has picked up yet?

Perhaps something like cranial osteopathy would help, or baby massage to try and help him relax.
Whats he like at baby groups?

I think you need to talk to the parents and ask if this is normal at home and how you can work together to make him a happier, more sleeping child.

I would be thinking cranial osteopath and possible silent reflux. My non sleeper was silent reflux - didn't sleep at all during the day from 6 weeks until the treated her at 6 months, nowt wrong with her weight or appetite either

If it is the same family that I'm thinking of then the parents have made a rod for their own backs

ESP if the older ds only sleeps on sofa. Parents havnt renforced a proper sleep/bedtime routine and given in for an easy life

I doubt if things will improve and if you don't want younger boy then doubt mum will still use you for the older one

course if I have family mixed up then ignore the above

Oh no, poor you. That does sound hard

The poor little thing is probably exhausted but too anxious to sleep. Classic sign of separation anxiety.

You never know, it might because his parents have used some form of controlled crying/sleep training where he`s been left to cry for long periods without response. Resulting in a baby who is too scared to sleep.

Have you tried lying with him, letting him snuggle in, reassuring him that he`s safe & not alone?

I think CC in a 10 month old is cruel, he`s too young to manipulate, he needs comfort. And a trip to a CO is a very good idea too.

Hope the situation improves soon as no-one is happy as it is.

I have not posted on here before but really felt I needed to reply to this. Everything you have said about this poor poor baby is screaming SILENT REFLUX!!
I say this as mother whose ds had exactly the same symptoms but also as a doctor as I was able to recognise them earlier. The earlier suggestions re cranial osteopath plus a visit to the gp sound needed.
However I will probably be vilified and banished from these boards for saying this but (deep breath.....)
I found the implication that the baby does not sleep due to the parents really upsetting, in all likelihood this baby is in agony from his reflux and the poor parents will be desperate!
Also, why is he left in the cot until he cries until he is sick (did the parents ask for this?)
And (this is where I really will be hunted down and shot) but I'm not sure I would be happy about anyone using the Internet to post on mumsnet whilst caring for

my children. Sorry if this offends but been through all of this with ds and it is very stressful!

bobbiesmum..

cms do have the right to a tea break/coffee break when the children are asleep arnt they? and then have a right to collapse with a magazine, get on with the endless paperwork involved in cming, ,go online to order shopping or indeed go onto mumsnet.. dont get your last point?

As regards this child I agree with breastmilksonme.. I would have to give notice as this child would require more time than I could give.. I have other children in the setting and couldnt cope with one who is so demanding, it would also affect my own family too much..

before I get flayed by a parent for this can I say that the child and parents have all my sympathy but being a cm is not like working in a nursery with lots of staff to share the children and bounce ideas off, its just you... and that can be very tough if one child needs such one to one and particular care.

Oh gosh. My dd was and is a non-sleeper. She never napped for more than a few minutes and from 12 months ish she stopped napping entirely.

But she was sunny and happy with it, rarely cried at all. She's just not a sleeper.

This sounds entirely different. Screaming until sick and unable to drop off when exhausted could be due to something like silent reflux.

At the very least, both children need some kind of consistent and manageable routines for their own health and happiness.

I was going to suggest possible silent reflux myself as ds2 had that and he screamed. I was DREADING starting back childminding when he was 10 weeks old as he was just so needy and wouldn't sleep without me holding him with the hoover on (white noise) and stuff like that. I went to CO and they 'fixed' him, I'm so so grateful as no way could I have been childminding all the little ones I had if he was like that. You have my sympathy, you really do. And I know you only came on here for advice and if he's screaming when you're trying to settle him and that doesn't help, I don't see what harm a very short amount of time on here trying to get some tips can do.

I personally would have to have a proper sit down chat with the parents and either work together on this or give notice, even if it meant I didn't have any mindees. You have to think of your wellbeing too. Poor child though, sounds like something isn't quite right :(

There's always someone who posts how wrong it is for childmidners to have a break!

looney - they have no routine whatsoever at home.
They arrived on Friday at 09.30 , after the mother texted me to say "oh x and I ahve the day off, so we are all in our bed wathcing a dvd".
They were due to arrive at 7.30.
They came in their pj's, having had no breakfast so both, especially the little one were screaming for food.

At night, they put both boys into the dining room, they have a sofa in there. The older one is lying on the sofa, the younger in his buggy. The parents stick a dvd on and shut the door and leave them there to go to sleep.

The dad was a SAHD, and he used to rock the younger one to sleep in the buggy while watching tv etc. So now the younger one won't sleep at all unless he's being pushed (and at no time did I say i left him for hours to scream himself sick, he can make himself sick after less than 3 minutes of screaming)

The mum keeps saying "oh lie him on the floor/in his buggy and give him warm milk"

Which he won't take, he knows now that if he gets that it means he is going to have a sleep, so he throws it away.

so the younger one will sleep at night if put infront of a tv?

yes he may have a silent reflux,and obv good to check this out with the gp

but i still stand by what i said and that the parents have made the child like that with the methods they have used to get their child to sleep

he needs to be re trained how to go to sleep by him self - but without the parents support saltire cant do anything

oh saltire love, if you can afford it and fill the place give notice.. I do feel sorry for the child of course but this is beyond the call of duty and parents sound a bit wet really.
you can only do so much and try new methods but have to have the support and cooperation of parents and you aint getting this..

you dont need this stress!!

Saltire what a nightmare, dd (who had silent reflux) did find it very hard to get to sleep and rocking in a buggy would probably have helped although half the time she would still scream and scream and never sleep. From 6 weeks old she didn't sleep at all during the day and used to crash out for 7/8 hours at night and that was it, any time she did pass out was only for minutes like you posted above.

When the parents have such a non rountine it's very hard to establish whether routine is part of it as well.