Can you come and tell me about your vaginal breech deliveries?

[newmomma]

Title says it all really.
Doctor and MW both said '2 weeks until we book you in for a c/s' which I'm terrified of...

Some wonderful MN'ers have informed me that a vaginal breech delivery IS possible and I was hoping some of you lovely people out there might be happy to come and tell me about your experiences.

Thanks

Think it is possible but unfortunately it isnt the norm so mws have less experience thus less up to date skills in this kind of delivery.
Have you found a mw willing to deliver you who is competent and capable?

My second twin was breech but I don't think that is the same situation. Twas very easy.

Fwiw, the midwife I had said she could deliver singleton breeches with her eyes closed, she wasn't worried about them at all. But midwives like that are very few and far between.

Have you contacted the supervisor of midwives to see if she can find an experienced midwife for you?

I know you aren't looking for a homebirth, but there are lots of breech birth stories on the www.homebirth.org.uk website. Also links to other research. I think you go to 'you can't have a homebirth because...' page and then find the section on breeches.

No - I haven't had any support from my doctor or midwife - I didn't even know it was possible. They both just sent me away and said we'd discuss c/s at my next appt.

I'm going to look into it a bit more and then see what my midwife says at my next appointment - I have no idea if she'll be supportive or not.

But I thought it might be useful to see if other people had experienced them and how it went etc...

No harm in asking, but it all boils down to having the appropriate professional there with the expertise and ability to maintain safety for you and your baby.
You may not find that.
What is it that terrifies you about a C.section?

dunnu but I am one - my mum says get an epidural and expect the ventouse and poss forceps to be used.

I had a vaginal breech delivery of my second child. He was undiagnosed as such until testicles and bottom appeared!! M/W not happy to deliver at home so transferred to hospital where he was delivered with no intervention, pain relief or anything. 'hands off approach' was taken by hospital midwife as apparently touching baby stimulates them.

My first child was a 'natural' waterbirth at home, no stitches or tearing. Textbook 'natural' delivery. I am sure this assisted in the drs allowing me to deliver him vaginally (and the fact that someone was already in theatre having C/S!!!)

I would suggest you research breech births as many m/w have not seen one or delivered one because of preference for c/s as breech are considered high risk (research why). Was told after delivery many months later by gynaecologist that there are two types of breech (cannot remember names but one can deliver vaginally the other cannot).

Independent m/w would consider helping I would think.

As for the birth it was no more painful than head first but staff were much more worried about breech delivery than 'normal' delivery. It is obviously quite unusual as my son and I were quite the talking point everywhere we went for a few days after the birth (hospital staff, gps surgery and m/w and health visitors!) This tells me it is not that common. The hospital m/w did say that if they had know my son was breech I would have been 'persuaded' to have a c/s.

If you were to ask me would I have him again breech I would say yes but I am aware that the fact my first child was born at home with no assistance or complications this helped me deliver my son.

My advice would be do your research and do what you feel is right with all the information available. Good luck!

all midwives do know how to deliver a breech, a number of babies are not known to be breech until delivery, so all MWs do know, whether they feel comfortable with it, is another issue

your best chance of a vaginal breech birth, rather than an extraction, is a spontaneous start to labour, and no augmentation or induction. once you go down that route, then complications are far more likely.

an epidural would be a bad idea IMO, as it will render you immobile on the bed and acn lead to an increased risk of augmentatation and instruments being needed

fufflembum I was the same as you, undiagnosed until his bum appeared ( I was in hospital). I had him kneeling up, hanging onto the bedhead ,to a crowd of about 14 interested individuals as it is not common.

My sixth child was vaginal breech. It was very uneventful. She basically fell out.

Read up on breech births by googling Mary Cronk.

Thanks all - have read Mary Cronk and am going to consider a breech delivery if the baby is in the bottom first position and my labour progresses normally, rather than artificially.

Congrats on your news Loopy - don't worry about the hijack - always good to hear happy news!

Told you there was a wealth of information here

Good luck

The key thing is that you do not interfere with the birth process in any way - no induction, no acceleration (sweeps, synto, ARM), and no major pain relief. What you want to avoid is ramming the baby's chin against the pubic bone where it can get hooked.

Not all breech babies are deliverable vaginally. If your baby is in that category, your labour will not progress. The last thing you want to do is flood your system with artificial hormones to increase contractions. If the baby is not going to come, it won't, no matter how much synto is in your system.

If a breech baby is going to be birthed vaginally, the progress will be steady. You can monitor heart rate and descent, and the increase in the intensity of contractions. If it all comes to a stop because your baby doesn't fit, then you should go straight to c-section. There is no middle ground.

The term breech trial is flawed because it considered those breech births that were in the complicated region in the overall results. They found that breech births in developing countries had far better outcomes than those in developing countries because they were not tempted to induce or accelerate labour. The worst outcomes were for medically managed vaginal deliveries.

Bottom () line is to do nothing, or to go all the way (c-section). Middle ground is bad.

Someone from my yoga class gave birth to her DC2 breech vaginally.

As MmeBlueberry said, all totally natural, no drugs or intervention at all, and they did scan in early labour to check no risk of cord prolapse and size & position of baby (he was smaller than his older sister had been).

She refused the epidural so she fasted so she could have crash cs under general anesthetic.

She was active throughout early labour but once labour was established she was moved into an operating theatre.

She gave birth kneeling on operating table in theatre being watched by surgeon/anaethesist etc plus operating team etc! And then after the birth she stood up got of the table and walked out of the theatre without a tear/scratch with her baby!

I'm in a similar situation. Am currently 37+5 with my first, and he's in a footling breech position (legs tucked underneath him). I had a failed ECV last Friday, and am now booked in for an ELCS on Monday 29 March. As far as I understand it from my gynaecologist, the guidelines here (Belgium) do not encourage the normal birthing of a breech baby. He says that if it wasn't my first baby and it wasn't a footling position, I could give vaginal delivery a go. But, he feels that the position and it being my first baby makes it too risky.

I have to say I'm also terrified about the CS - not really the procedure itself, more the things like the fact I won't be able to hold my baby straight away (although DH will be able to), and the effect it might have on breastfeeding. But, I had a long chat (and cry) with my gynae yesterday and he assured me that this was the best option for me and baby and that there should be no problematic side effects. In fact, as a few people have said to me, he even suggested that there were some advantages - no risks of damage to perineum, etc.

amyboo it sounds like we're in the same boat...

You're right - apparently a 'frankling' position is better for vb deliveries than 'footling'. And its easier with subsequent labours too. As this is my 2nd (and if baby is frank rather than foot) I'll attempt it but otherwise I'll be going for a c/s too.

Can you come back and tell me how the ECV went? Was it uncomfortable? Did it fail straight away or did baby turn and then pop back?

I have to say I also share all your concerns with regard to a c/s - I'm sure its silly really - the more people I talk to who've had them say they'd happily opt for another. But then I have to say that a little bit of me thinks that is because they still have the 'unknown fear of childbirth'. If they knew what it was like, maybe they'd feel differently... Not sure.

Anyway - fingers crossed things change for both of us - come back and let me know how things pan out for you? Best of luck.

amyboo come and find the elcs stories on other threads. Mine was extremely positive.

Hi Newmomma.
Changing the subject a bit, have you tried any 'alternative methods' to get the baby into the head down position?
There are some websites you might find helpful: www.spinningbabies I think?
My DC3 was breech (actually, transverse, then footling) etc and I had reflexology and went swimming and other stuff to try to get the baby head down. Luckily for me it worked, whether this was coincidence or not, but all those things aren't going to do any harm if you try them, are they?
And I'm not a very alternative medicine type of person, IYSWIM.
Of course, you may have tried these things (and been offered ECV etc) but it might be worth giving the Doctors a bit of a surprise if you can?
Otherwise, good luck however it goes. If I'd stayed breech, the MWs were going to let me go for a VB (as it was my 3rd) as that is the practice round here, but I think I found that as terrifying as a CS.

Yes, thanks Nonnomum am getting to the 'willing to try anything stage'...!

Have chiropractor booked, been doing the 'inversion technique', got my exercise ball yesterday to bounce on in the evenings and have a friend referring me to her acupuncturist and reflexologist.

Am I'm not even vaguely a hippy!!

Am even looking into something called moxibustion. Sounds ridiculous but I'll give anything a try...

Hadn't thought of swimming. And I'm even scared enough of a c/s to wedge myself into a swimming cozzy so I'll have to try that too.

Actually... from what some of my friends are saying - I'm a bit scared of an ECV. I keep getting told horror stories so thats become bottom of my list...

think the swimming is supposed to involve handstands, but I kind of just paddled about a bit...

Let us know how you get on...

Had vaginal delivery of a footling breech last year. Second baby, so a 'proven pelvis' (first was cephalic vaginal) and after failed ECV at 37 weeks when I said I wanted a breech birth, I was 'supported' by consultants in as much as it is NHS policy to support a woman's choices. A caesarean was not ever suggested, only vaguely alluded to by more pessimistic midwives.

Made arrangements with the Labour Ward at 38 weeks for various requests such as an active birth room and no continuous foetal monitoring, and midwives were forewarned so that the most experienced one on shift would come to attend me.

On the day, had a wonderful midwife who was lovely and calm, though unfortunately had a rather nervous consultant attending who put me off a bit towards the end. I totally stayed off the drugs to try to be better in tune with how my body was telling me to do it. My very best friend also had a planned vaginal breech birth in an MLU 3 weeks ago. I hope that knowing that I had done it (and how otherwise unextraordinary I am!) gave her confidence and belief in the actual normality of breech birth.

Get yourself informed, make arrangements with your midwives/consultants/hospital and show that you know what you're talking about, if it's really what you want. Also, perhaps consider hiring a doula for an extra player on your team. To be honest, I wasn't really right on about vaginal breech although I knew my body could do it given the right surroundings, I was just terrified of C-section and at the last minute was lucky enough to find the right women gathering round to support me.

Though of course...maybe your baby will still turn. Either way, I hope you find what you need.

Thanks MiaRaeDeb that's really good to hear.

Could you tell me a bit more detail...?

How did your labour/pushing/length of each stage differ from your 1st cephalic vaginal birth (I too have had one cephalic vaginal so guess my pelvis has proven itself too!)

Did you have (sorry to get a bit personal) any more 'damage' with the footling breech delivery than the 'normal' delivery?

And were you just lucky to find an NHS midwife who was supportive - the general consensus seems to be that I'd need to hire a IM and that's just way to costly for me. I guess I'll just have to see what my midwife says on Monday when I see her as she never mentioned any other option than c/s...

Still think the baby is the wrong way round. All the movements are in the opposite place to where they were last time round. Boo...