vaginal examinations.. how many is too many.??

[1istrulyscrumptious]

hi was with a lady as a birthing partner who recieved 12 VE.s from 8 different people over a 12 hour period.. i thought that all werent needed and caused the woman pain.. she went on to labour naturally..why do proffessionals think its their right to have a feel.

Certainly sounds excessive to me - when I was in labour with my DS I had one and that was uncomfy enough, your poor friend

They wouldn't even do that to a labouring COW fgs.

Very excessive..did she complain?

You, i think, can put in a complaint in your own right, but i don't know if the lady would agree or if she is just glad its over lol.

If there was a REASON to do it, but 12 times.. I was looked at twice, to check dilation, that was it.

Was there any medical reason do you know?

Holy god !!! 12
With DD1 i had 3 and everytime i had one i was asked and given a medical reason. With my other 2 DD i was given 2 at the most. THe poor women, I go weak at the knee's thinking of them!!!

it certainly was too many.. will think about putting in a complaint. im not sure if they are needed at all?

I was checked at least 6 or 7 times by at least 4 different people (lost track!). To be fair, I was being monitored because there was meconium in my waters so they were keeping closer tabs than normal. I had an epidural though, I can imagine how painful it would have been without. Did they give a reaason for the amount of VEs given?

I had none

i had one with ds2 against my better judgement and if i had a 3rd i would refuse them unless absolutely vital
they are painful, intrusive, disrupt your rhythm and focus, and for me, have been extremely demoralising as i have not been very far dilated each time - yet i have gone on to deliver quite quickly on both occasions

well, professionals do think it is their right to have a feel, as it is one of the ways to assess dilation, effacement, presentation and descent of the baby etc, so it is a useful tool

there are other methods of assessing progress, and VEs are subjective, but they are useful

in labour unless there are indications otherwise, i would expect a VE every 4 hours,

12 from 8 different people - well, if she was being assessed by a trainee and a mentor, and then a doctor, then a shift change and different midwives, and then different doc, you can see how it stacks up, especially if things are not straightforward

if it was painful, then more care should have been taken, but it can be hard when a woman is labouring to wait for a big enough pause, and it can be hard to assess, say if she has a posterior cervix

did the lady feel they were unecessary interventions?

i would suggest making an appointment for her to go through her notes, to find out why so many VEs

I had at least 10 over 24 hours. There was no reason for the majority of them as far as I could tell and I remember shrieking at the midwife to leave me alone at one point.

It was only when they stopped doing them for a few hours that my labour started to progress properly, so I tend to think they can be very counterproductive.

a good midwife can hear when you are ready
Mine sat on the stairs and listened

in an NHS hospital sitting, there is very little chance of a MW sitting and listening for signs of progress, with the best will in the world. not saying it is right, but that is the reality

I gave birth on Monday and I had about 10- 20 VE within a 70 minute labour.

In fact at the height of pushing ds out, I screamed for everyone to take their hands out of my "Fucking vagina"

They where testing to see if he was back to back and it took 2 midwife, a reg then the consultant to ascertain he was not.

I think these VE added much more to the pain tbh and I could not concentrate on pushing whilst the hands where inside me

Would never cross my mind to question them, as I am sure they are done for medical purposes only, its not like they get any pleasure from them is it?

I am sure there is no need to that many though lilly! Are they so bad at their job that theyneed 4 people to work out hat is going on?

1 is too many imo- they are horrible.

Franny's post is uncannily similar to what I was going to say. I'm pg with DC3 and am going to decline all VEs (barring some sort of emergency). The only negative aspect of my last birth was being harangued into lying on the bed for a pointless VE.

I was assessed as being 6 cm dilated, and was told I had another few hours to go (I just knew it was progressing more quickly than that). They were therefore in no hurry to run the birthpool or to give me the ABs for Group B Strep. I ended up giving birth about half an hour later!

This was one of the things I really didn't want, as especially with SPD I found VEs really painful. In labour, I was delighted to only have half a one - the MW started having a look when I arrived at the birth centre before letting me get in the pool, but gave up as I was squirming around too much - she said it didn't matter as she could see things were moving along, and DS arrived a couple of hours later.

lilymolly - a labour progressing as fast as yours is clearly not going to be impeded by having a baby in the posterior position, so I would say that those VEs were probably unnecessary. That is, unless there were clear signs of distress/compromise (meconium present, or a bradycardia)and the staff were concerned that 2nd stage was not proceeding quickly enough.

ds heart rate was really dropping low, so that was prob why, and it was a very very fast labour.

Although the registrar was absoultely useless so did not help

I have told everyone I refuse to have them any more unless I specifically request one, because they are a painful waste of time in real labour. A mw can tell just as much from what your back looks like, and what noises you are making. It's really a hospital shortcut to proper observation, IMO.

When I was a MW the standard practice was every 4 hours to assess progress. However, I also assisted women who didn't want any and in most cases didn't need them anyway. There is definitely a change to the sounds a woman makes in the second stage of labour as well as external signs that the head is descending.
Was always a "sit and wait" type os midwife and in the end had to leave as I couldn't stand all the compulsion to interfere without good reason.

Ah but Starlight the main thing was that you knew. That's surely really all that matters, in the bigger scheme of things.