Going around in circles about next labour - LONG

[BabiesEverywhere]

I DON?T EXPECT ANYONE TO READ THIS STUPIDLY LONG POST, I JUST NEED TO GET THIS DOWN ON PAPER AND SO I CAN PROCESS IT AND MOVE FORWARD.

I have just received a card detailing my blood issues Rhesus Positive with E antibodies. I need to carry during my pregnancy and for some reason this has really pushed me over the edge and I can?t stop crying.

I knew things would not be straight forward this time because of how my daughter entered the world.

Last time I was forced into hospital, as my anti-homebirth community midwife refused to come out to me and when the hospital tested me they thought I was Strep B and I had to be admitted. My labour stopped in the hospital as I was so scared. Started to induce me, I was tied to a bed with continuous monitoring.

I begged them to take it off and they refused (I now know we should of told them to fuck off ) They told me they thought I would be endangering my baby if I didn't lie still on my back with drip etc Because I couldn't move even an inch onto my side the pain was unbearable, leading to the 'classic waterfall inventions', so I ended up with drugs and a spinal thing. I pushed for 3 hours on the midwifes instructions.

Baby got distressed. So after 19/20 hours in labour in hospital (after a slow labour at home for a couple of days) they take me into surgery. I am very frightened of hospital at the best of times and being operated on whilst being awake and feeling it is my worst nightmare. They kept saying can I feel this cold thing on my leg, I said yes but they tell me I can't feel it. Why bloody ask me if you are going to ignore the answer?

I can still feel everything and they are talking about cutting me open, I am so terrified, my husband was outside the surgery room, I can hardly catch my breath. Eventually they let DH in and they say they will try forceps first and manage to rip my baby out that way. I touch her on her back for one brief second and they take her away, I feel very cold and start shaking

I don't remember the next few hours/days. Apparently I lost several pints of blood and had ripped one end to the other, had a blood transfusion and transferred to a HDU ward. All I remember is drifting in and out of consciousness, hearing beeping of machines and alarms going off and wires everywhere and a horrible mask on my face. I could hear my baby but I couldn?t reach her and the pain was terrible.

I have photos DH took of my DD and me in that ward, I can't look at them. I am 'not there' and have no memory of that time. Supposedly the first precious moments with my baby, I never gave birth, she was just ripped out of me.

I never had PND and bonded well with my DD and established breastfeeding (despite a midwife saying that mothers like me who have bad experiences, don't breastfeed). I rarely talk about what happened in hospital in real life, I avoid references to 'giving birth' and tend to withdraw when other mother talk about their labours. I have flashbacks and nightmares about what happened, though they had lessened over the last 17 months. At the start I would be crying daily and now I go weeks without it popping into my mind uninvited.
I eventually months later, did talk to the hospital about what happened and they had someone come out and go though my medical records with me, to fill in some of my blank memories.

When DD was 6 months old I thought I was accidentally pregnant and I was terrified and I wrote this entry in my blog at the time shows my state of mind at the time.
Blog Page

I thought I had made my peace with accepting that I would have to risk enduring the same experience for a second child if I went to hospital and I expected to book a private midwife so I could try to have a home birth otherwise. So with that in mind we TTC and got pregnant again and apart from a bit of bleeding I have had a good 12 weeks and no worries.

Yesterday we went for a scan and despite the bleeding we saw a healthy very active baby on the screen and I was so happy I cried

But when speaking to the midwife after the scan, she mentioned the problems in my blood. I am Rhesus Positive but have Anti-D and Anti-E antibodies in my blood, properly due to my blood transfusion. They will properly cause no problems but might cross and attack the baby if baby is a certain blood type. So I need blood tests every 4 weeks to check the antibody levels in my blood and according to the unexpected letter this morning I should carry this card whilst being pregnant.

The consultant said the heavy bleeding I had last time meant I shouldn't have a home birth, very reluctant about water birth, monitoring etc. The midwife agreed with me that being in hospital and being starved, lying on my back and the long labour and pushing for 3 hours and the cut, made me bleed and I would be at no more likely to bleed than anyone else if I have a normal labour and were more willing to comprise about water birth and monitoring etc. The midwife even said they would consider a home birth if I tested Strep B negative at 37 weeks and had no other problems but what is the chance of that happening.

However the last hospital said they would follow a birth plan and not tie me to a bed and they lied. Can I trust these people even if they are in a different hospital ? Even if they intended to follow an agreed plan, I can see everything changing if anything I do is not 'textbook' and no one has a textbook labour.

I still want a private midwife but we don't have enough money in our savings and our budget is so tight, I doubt we can save up the remainder needed in time. Also what if I went with a private midwife and ended up in hospital away. What a waste of money? Though for the chance of a normal labour I would spend every penny we had, we just don't have enough pennies. So although I pencilled in an independent midwife it looks like I will have to cancel her services.

The midwife did suggest an elective C-section under a spinal as a good alternative. I started crying, I couldn't find the words to explain how bad I felt. Luckily my DH realised I couldn't speak and he explained that was my ultimate nightmare and he was sure I was willing to do anything to avoid that particular scenario.

I am cross that because I was forced into hospital last time, it has caused many issues for this pregnancy. As the community midwife said ironically last time I was a perfect candidate for a home birth but now I am too much of a risk.

The midwife seems to be worried that I will crack up emotionally nearer the labour date and insisted I take details for a counsellor. I don't need a counsellor, talking will not make a difference to the past, I have tried it and it makes me will worse and weak. I just want to move forward and put practical things in place so maybe I will be able to give birth this time. I need to figure what I should do for the best.

I want to do the right thing but I don't know what that is. I just want to stay as far away from hospital as possible. But I don't want to bleed to death at home and despite being told it shouldn't be a problem, the antibodies in my blood and all the additional blood tests are scaring me.

I am just spinning around in circles

{{VictorianSqualor}}

Yes, this is what the anti-homebirth midwife who refused to come out to me, hence I was forced into hospital said to me. After she managed to force herself to look at me in pain at home on many painkillers/antibiotics etc having suffered such a horrible birth because of what she did.

Well, she is healthy. What is your problem ?

Geesh, nice attitude lady

Ugh, well done, let's add guilt at feeling so shit about what happened to the feelings you already have, clever midwife.

I honestly believe that a large part of birth trauma is associated with the guilt we feel for feeling so awful about what happened, especially afetr we have a wonderful healthy happy baby at the end of it.

My birth with DD was horrendous, lost 8pints of blood, in hospital for weeks, she was 8weeks early in SCBU, pneumothorax, etc etc but my birth with DS, an ElCS with no complications to me was worse, it's hard for someone who hasn't been through it to understand but it gets supressed inside of you because you know you should be happy and grateful and all those things, but you aren't. It's something that needs to be more widely recognised and accepted.

The lady at Birth Crisis said one thing that did stick with me.

She said that how a mother feels after a birth is not always directly related to how the birth went. Every mothers feeling are valid and important irrelevent of how the birth went and no one's experience should ever be compared to another.

That how a woman is treated and respected can make the same outcome feel much better (apparantly)

• I wonder if you had better support for your daughter's birth and/or less support for your son's ?

oh dear

i find this all the time with the BTA

women are distraught and guilt stricken because they are told that all that matters is that the baby arrived safely, regardless of how the baby arrived and regardless of how much trauma was experienced.

I think with DD's birth I was allowed to feel bad about it because she was so poorly, and when I got PND etc everyone expected it, with DS because it was so straightforward every person that mentioned it to me said 'Thank God it wasn't anything like DD's' or 'At least this time it went well' etc, but I was thinking 'Erm, NO! I was forced to have major surgery and have never been so scared in my life' but I daren't say it because I didn't want to sound 'ungrateful'.

Yes, I understand that. I was frequently told how 'lucky' I was that I avoided a C-section.

Yet, I was rushed into a theatre and prepped me for the C-section. I was so frightened they were going to cut me, I was shaking in fear and couldn't catch my breath.

Plus thanks to the forceps, I had the joy of a third degree tear and all the resulting pain and problems at the toilet and sex end as well.

How is that 'lucky' ?

It sounds like people were more understanding and validated your feelings following your daughter's birth. But not with your son's.

Definitely, even DP (he isnt my two's Dad) didn't understand how affected I was by it until we saw the cons a few weeks ago, he thought I just wanted to give vaginal birth a go!
I felt such a prat crying after being advised to have a CS and was desperately trying to catch my breathand pull myself together but now I'm glad I did because it made him and my cons understand much more.

In fact on my notes, my cons just read 'EmCs then ElCs' so assumed it was all ok and that I'd actually chosen to have a CS with the second, which wasn't the way of it at all. She didn't seem very impressed when I informed her how I wasn't 'allowed' to try a VBAC with DS.

Now she knows though, as does DP and I feel much happier about the birth, whichever way it happens, I know I have to come to terms with the eventualities of a possible CS but I feel that as long as I do everything I can to avoid it, with it being the very last option after all others are exhausted then I will eb able to come to terms with it, I imagine your feelings are similar? Agreeng to a CS is obviously going to be there as a maybe for both of us, espcially with complications, but knowing there is no other way is the only way I can be happy with that result.

Yes, I need to see I have a hope at an alternative result. i.e. I want a chance at having a properly labour, being able to move etc and see how things go, when/if I get some proper support.

I am worried that a consultant will ensure I have the same crappy non-birth time I had last time and this time it could be a C-section.

And if it came down to a C-section I NEED to be knocked out. I know many ladies stay awake but I just can't

Sounds like your consultant (like mine) makes assumptions about what we need/feel without asking us.

Is your due date soon, you are talking like your birth is quite soon ?

I'm 30 weeks, so I don't have long! They wanted to do the CS at 38weeks, but as I said, I refused it, I have monitoring every two weeks at the hospital because I am at higher risk of pre-eclampsia or IUGR, I'm just hoping I go into labour before 39weeks otherwise there will mroe of a chance of having to have the CS as they can't induce for VBAC's.

I would imagine your GA request to be quite simple to gain agreement on, it's just that it needs to be the last resort. Maybe try emailing the head of midwifery wrt your situation, asking her to arrange a meeting but outlining as much as possible before you meet her, it may be easier for you to stand your ground as it were in that case? I know having said what needed saying I feel much more comfortable with keeping to that decision and not allowing anyone to sway me. That and my birth plan that is quite obviously stuck on my front page of my notes

All the best VS, I will be stalking you to see how things go I really hope things go as well as can be expected in whatever circumstances you find your self in. Not the most positive hope but a heart felt realistic one.

Things depend on whether the results from the monthly blood tests are reasonable, the results from the strep B test at 37 weeks, if I can arrange third party support (looking unlikely but never say never)

I need to have the information on what happens in each case.

I need definate agreement to :-
: NOT cutting into me unless I am asleep and after agreement.
: No formula for babe unde any circumstance (donor milk or I will hand express)
: No continous monitoring, if they try, I'll cut the monitoring leads !!!! (joke, I'll decline)

Thanks

If you think the third party support isn;t a viable option (it wasn't for us really either) is there not a friend or family member you would trust to be your 'voice' as such??

I put it to DP that his mum (she will be my 'voice') will be good for both of us because she can support him, and me and will think about things clearly and logically rather than with the heightened emotions we are both going to be feeling at the time.

No one else I would want to be with whilst I'm in labour, so my DH will have to be my voice.

We were just bulldozered last time and I stupidly thought the staff would follow my birth plan rather than laugh at how much I didn't get. Which I found very embrassing on the ward.

I think the key will be to try and forward plan as many options as possible and get it written down so there is NO confusion and make sure DH understands what I want.

Last time I was in too much pain to ask him to intervene and when I asked a midwife something and they said no I just accepted it I was so stupid.

Have you seen this birth plan???It covers alot of eventualities, good for me because it has VBAC things in, but it also has a lot about CS's you might like to have a look at.

My cons read through mine and said that hopefully as much as possible could be done to adhere to it, but that it can't happen in all cases, which I understood, it's just that there are some things really important to me that I have stated which DP/DP's mum can refer to if the questions arise.

I'd suggest you write one asap, and take it with you when you meet with the head of midwifery, she can then help you adjust it if need be to be relevant in whichever form of birth you end up with.

Thanks that looks very useful

BabiesEverywhere, responded to your mail.

xxxx

Thanks hertsnessex

Update thanks to hertsnessex, it looks like I'll have a doula (need to fill in some paperwork etc to get sorted 100% but it is looking good)

I spoke to the doula today and she is so lovely, friendly and confidant that things can be different this time

At her recommendations I am going to re-book at another local hospital which is decidely more home birth friendly.

Apparantly I have the right to demand antibiotics at home if I end up Strep B positive again, not IV ones but bottom pills(can't remember the right term) or oral pills, so being strep b does not mean I can't have a home birth.

Big thanks to Lulumama,who has also been very helpful and support on and off the boards.

I know Mumsnet doesn't go in for slush but I really think there is a strong link between being a doula and being a wonderful, caring person....
...
Doula's rock (especially the Mumsnet ones )

So feeling a lot more positive all around.

B.E!
That's great!
I'm so pleased for you.
I really 100% believe that having someone who knows the score and is willing to be your voice will make all the difference.
Yay

(btw hospital appt yesterday my results are still staying at the 'can have a VBAC' levels so fingers crossed!)

Oh meant to ask, how is DH about this???

We had a good chat and I showed DH a leaflet that hertsnessex gave me about the role of a doula.

Which explained that the doula works alongside and doesn't replace the father. I explained that I consisted a doula as a replacement mother/sister figure, a woman to emotional bounce off in a different way.

I explained how much support he did give me last time and I need the same from him this time. I think it was good for him to hear how much I do value his support. I think he has been taking my upset at the last time, as critism of him. Which it isn't.

So we have agreed that (if it is possible) it will be wonderful to have a doula as emotional support for us both. We are going to do some research on this blood thing and strep B and preventing back to back positioning and we are still aiming for a home birth.

He just wants to support me in anyway he can (he is a very good husband).

VS, glad the hospital tests are spot on for your VBAC

BabiesEverywhere. I'm afraid I'm nowehere near you either (Scotland) but have just read this thread with mounting horror and then rising hope! You have done so well already. Herts and Lulu are fabulous and I can see how you've benefitted already.

I have information about GBS which I can send to you if you've not already been sent it. Basically, I've decided that even if GBS+ next time, if I don't have any of the other risk factors, I probably won't have IV ABs and will also use garlic and other measures to try to minimise risk. This is a regime you might like to explore and decide about for yourself.

Try to explain to dh that a Doula is not there to take his place or make any decisions for you, or to overrule any HCPs, but rather to support you AND him to birth this baby the best way for you.

I ended up with forceps, episiotemy and spinal for my VBAC so understand your feelings somewhat. Your fears and worries are extremely valid.

Please contact the Head of Midwifery, your cons has no right to tell you you are not allowed to. You deserve to explore your options with HoM and make informed decisions about your care. You are entitled to plan a homebirth if that is your informed decision.

And you may had a bad bleed because of an instrumental delivery, most likely. How can anyone be sure that you are likely to do so again? MW are trained to deal with pph, and have everything they need in the Homebirth kit to enable them to get you transferred as safely as possible. This is something you can clarify with HoM.

I really think you need to discuss this all with her and make your own decision whether to HB or plan a hospital birth on your terms.

Have you read any childbirth books?

I have just read this thread, and like Klaw I felt mounting horror, then relief when you mentioned your doula.

Do they offer domino births in your area? That may be worth looking into.

Also, the homebirth website (hombirth.org.uk I think) is a great site for information, even if you don't plan to have a hb.

So much luck and good wishes to you and VS xx

I'm really pleased he is supporting you, I know how much it means.