C-section due to severe phobia of birth.. when did you get yours approved?

[sarah13xx]

I’ve been petrified beyond belief of giving birth my whole life, to the point that I wasn’t going to have kids. Last year I found the birth rights website, looked up my local hospital and realised I would most likely be able to get a c-section due to this. To me there is no other alternative, I can’t and won’t do it any other way. From the second I found out I was pregnant it has been all I’ve thought about since. At my booking appointment at 6 weeks (on the phone) I told my midwife about my severe anxiety about birth and how I just could not practically see a way of me doing it any other way. She said we would wait til I was further on and she would refer me, it would all be fine, risks would be explained etc but ultimately I could get a section. The next time I got to speak to her was 16 weeks (by this point it was really worrying me) and I said the same again. This time she said at 22 weeks she’d refer me. My 22 week appointment has been and it was with a different midwife. I was really anxious having to explain all this to someone new but I told her everything and she could see how worried it was making me. She said she’d sort it, discuss it with my midwife and get a consultant appointment arranged.

I’m now 23 weeks but had a dream about it last night, woke up early and haven’t stopped thinking about it since. It really is affecting my every day life now because it’s literally all I do.. either worrying about, reading articles or watching YouTube videos from people who have had one. I would feel so much better if someone could just tell me what’s happening or if I even knew a date as to when I’ll get to tell a consultant all of this. My next appointment isn’t til 28 weeks and I feel like by then I’ll be panicking 🤦🏼‍♀️ Sounds ridiculous to some people but it is my biggest fear in life. Anyone in my position, when did you have someone tell you you could definitely have one? X

@sarah13xx

Your friend's experiences are upsetting to read and unfortunately far too common.

You will feel brave, strong and empowered after a positive c section - I imagine just as anyone would with a positive vaginal birth.

I felt once I was out the "other side" fairly physical intact but definitely mentally I was over the moon and able to give my baby my all.

Please don't waste any time on the too posh to push comments. Women have done each other a disservice over the years glossing over birth and focusing on the fairy tale perfect birth stories. As we know there are many good reasons so many women have electives and celebs pay privately!

Please do keep me updated You've got this!x

I have recently had an elective section signed-off with my NHS hospital. It's not for fear of childbirth - I had a baby vaginally 5 years ago and wouldn't be worried about doing the actual labour it again (got by with just gas and air, only took a few hours from start to end, no horrific vaginal tearing, no stitches). My main reasons are that I worry another natural birth would make an existing bowel issue I suffer with much worse - the hospital didn't agree so my request for a section went through the 'maternal request' process which is the same flow that they'd follow if I was asking for a section for mental health reasons or just because I didn't want a vaginal birth.

I mentioned request at booking appointment @ 7wks. Midwife sent a referral to discuss with consultant. I met with a consultant at 17wks, another at 22wks, another at 26wks (by which point I cried at the appointment and explained that I didn't feel 'heard', quoted the NICE guidelines etc.) and another at 28wks. Finally, at the 28wk appointment that consultant agreed and booked the section in for me. I'm not consultant led, so all my appointments with consulants were solely to discuss and request an elective section. I got passed from pillar to post a lot and I felt the team were very reluctant but in the end it was obvious I wasn't going to change my mind.

The relief when I finally got booked in at 28wks was amazing. I feel like I've actually been able to begin enjoying my pregnancy since then - whereas before that I was stressed about whether I'd be forced to go down the vaginal labour route and end up in a much worse position in terms of my existing condition!

@WaitingForNormality thanks.. glad you got yours booked eventually! Well if I do nothing til my next appointment that will be 28 weeks and I’ll be no further forward. I kept thinking it was too early but loads of people seem to have them signed off before 30 weeks. I’m giving them another week or so in case anyone contacts me about a consultant appointment (it’s been 9 days) but I can’t feel like this all the way to 28 weeks. I can imagine there will then be a wait to see them and during that I’ll still be panicking 🤦🏼‍♀️ The problem is I don’t really want to have to text my midwife explaining how it’s affecting me etc, would rather say it on the phone but I can’t phone her work mobile as it’s only on if she’s on shift. Might just say I’m wondering if a consultant appointment has been arranged for me. I hate bothering people and being awkward but I’m going to just have to keep being annoying til I get somewhere 🙈

Don't feel bad about causing a fuss - I know how you feel as I'm completely the same. I also didn't want to come across silly so probably didn't emphasise enough to the early consultants I spoke to about just how much I was panicking and stressed with the whole situation. It was only when I did break down a bit at the appointment I had at 26wks that I felt the team finally began to realise. Each consultant did stress to me that it was still 'really early' etc. but I didn't find that helpful at all so at the 26wk appointment I also made it clear how it was preventing me from enjoying my pregnancy and that I didn't want to go on feeling like that - particularly as I knew I wasn't going to change my mind, regardless of how many appointments they made me sit through to hear the risks. She kind of agreed it was a waste of time for all if that was the case!

I'm usually a bit meek and will do anything to avoid a fuss, but I just had to stand up for myself a bit with this and it did end up paying off! Perhaps text MW and ask if she could call you back, then you can discuss over the phone. She might even book you an extra MW appointment to speak directly.

@WaitingForNormality yeah unfortunately it is one of those situations that you aren’t going to get anywhere unless you’re constantly on at them. My own midwife has heard the whole thing twice now (over the phone) but because it wasn’t her who did my last appointment and I had to tell someone else I don’t know what’s happening. She did definitely say a discussion with a consultant was needed but it was a so vague I have no clue when that’s meant to be. I really did go for it in the last appointment because she started giving me details for hypnobirthing and I had to stop her and say no under no circumstances will I consider it basically 😂 She definitely got how anxious I was about it all after that and said I shouldn’t let them try to change my mind. I would be able to just completely forget about it if they told me I could have one. They told me at my scan my placenta was too low to give birth naturally so I’d need another two scans to assess if it’s further away or not by then. If it wasn’t they’d advise a section anyway but I can’t hang about til 36 weeks waiting to see about that 🙈 The irony will end up being that they’ll tell me I need one after all this stress 😂

I wonder if, with the levels of anxiety you are describing, you might benefit from a referral to the perinatal mental health team? I don't mean to change your mind, it's your decision, I mean to help you deal with the uncertainty and stress you are feeling around the process?

I always wonder when I read these stories, why phobic mums to be (and it really sounds horrendous) don't save up for a private section as a backup before they get pregnant. Then the worry is gone. Still fight to get one obviously but the other option is there if needed.

Then if things go the way they should, there's a lump of money for other things.

It makes more sense to me than constantly stressing as stress hormones aren't good for a pregnancy.

Good luck though, sounds ruddy awful.

@gamerchick if it came to it I would do that rather than the alternative. I’ve seen quite a few posts though saying unless you live somewhere like London where the private hospitals (like the Portland) are well-equipped, most private hospitals that offer sections don’t have anywhere near the same resources as the NHS if something was to go wrong and you needed a blood transfusion or moved to intensive care. I live in Scotland and don’t think I’m near any good places but if need be I would travel! There’s one NHS hospital in Scotland rated ‘green’ for following NICE guidelines so if all else fails I’m going to ask to be referred there first. That back up option is always there though 🙈

@Cakeandslippers I think it was along those lines that my original midwife said she was going to refer me to after the 22 week appointment but it hasn’t happened because it was someone else I had. Going to have to speak to her and find out what the next stage is because I can’t wait til 28 weeks to see her

A c-section is not a "fail safe" easy option. What about giving birth vaginally is it that causes your anxiety do you think?

@sarah13xx I really wouldn’t worry about not being offered one. You HAVE to be allowed one via maternal request, if the consultant refuses they HAVE to refer you to someone else who will do it. I’ve just requested mine (due to babies size-nothing else) and booked in a date at 32 weeks. The consultant said he’d like to discuss induction and I said I’m not interested in induction and will be opting for a c section. He went through the risks(nothing I wasn’t aware of from Google) and booked it in. No argument at all and I’d been warned to expect one from basically everyone I spoke to!

@gamerchick

I always wonder when I read these stories, why phobic mums to be (and it really sounds horrendous) don't save up for a private section as a backup before they get pregnant. Then the worry is gone. Still fight to get one obviously but the other option is there if needed.

Then if things go the way they should, there's a lump of money for other things.

It makes more sense to me than constantly stressing as stress hormones aren't good for a pregnancy.

Good luck though, sounds ruddy awful.

Because we have a choice of how to give birth, through the NHS which we pay for. We're allowed to choose.

OP it might be 36 weeks before they book you in which I know seems really late but is pretty standard. Make sure you ask for a consultant referral next time you're speaking to the midwife though. Although presumably you'll be seeing one for your placenta scan? There's a very small percentage of midwives who don't seem to have much respect for birth options and will basically try anything to dismiss your fears and get you to have a vaginal birth. Consultants don't seem as bothered how you give birth as long as what you choose is safe for you and baby.

Also at the 'limited movement for weeks and months due to being cut open' what a load of shite. Why do people who haven't had sections always spout this stuff? Sections are great. I loved mine. Bit sore for about a week after but pretty sure hobbling around with piles and stitches wouldn't exactly be great fun either.

@Catlover8926 thanks, that sounds like you’ve had a good experience. It’s very true that you should be able to have one and I should probably stop stressing and just presume I will get it one way or another!

GreenSlideAlso at the 'limited movement for weeks and months due to being cut open' what a load of shite. Why do people who haven't had sections always spout this stuff? Sections are great

This is the reality: www.snugglebundl.co.uk/how-to-recover-from-a-c-section-caesarean/

I never got it approved.
I have an induction next week. A perinatal psychiatrist even on a letter said a c section is the best option.

But because it is "secondary tokophobia" no consultant will approve it as "I've had a normal birth with my daughter" but they forget to remember the pre term birth I had last year which resulted in me dying on the operation table for a good few minutes, my son dying and the rest.

I feel like I'm counting down the days till my death day if I'm honest and I'm just hoping inductions. Doesn't progress and I need the section anyway.

Keep on at them. Please don't back down.

@GreenSlide very true! I hate having any sort of birth conversation with anyone because so many people think it’s an invitation to lecture you on how you should just give birth vaginally then go into every detail about theirs. Like good for you but I won’t be going about after this lecturing every pregnant person on how they should give birth 🤔 I don’t want my mind changed (not that they could anyway) but it’s all anyone tries to do!
Yeah I think they said after the 32 week scan I’d have to meet a consultant then anyway but just want to speak to someone ASAP 🙈 that’s good they’re maybe less likely to try and put me off than the midwives. My original midwife was supportive in that she listened to me but didn’t really do much to help whereas the one I had at the last appointment could see there was just no other way for me so she was all for it.

I would far rather be in discomfort after it that I have chosen rather than hate myself and everyone around me because no one listened to me. My friend couldn’t walk properly for 2 months after giving birth vaginally so it really doesn’t sound like much fun either!

@megaann omg I’m so sorry you’ve had such a bad experience, that sounds awful 😞

Have you asked to be referred to someone else or another hospital? Forcing someone to go through that is barbaric

@megaann have you shared this with your team? These are the NICE guidelines and they need to adhere to them. The last part specifically says if you are still requesting it after discussion you should be offered it so call your consultant and tell them you won’t be accepting a vaginal delivery as it’s not what you want and want to book in for a section by maternal request as the guidelines state.

Hi OP,

Good luck with it. I was actually really hoping for a natural birth with first baby but after 72 hours of labour including failed induction I ended up being rushed in for Emergency CS when baby finally showed signs of distress . It was a completely exhausting and stressful experience that I was determined not to repeat.

So I said to midwife at an early stage with baby number 2 that I absolutely wanted an elective CS. She was lovely and supportive of that choice, wrote it in my notes etc. However, unfortunately the Consultant at the hospital was less supportive. He went on and on about VBACs, insisting that I took a leaflet about it even though I made clear I’d already done my own research. That was the first consultant appointment, then when I went back for the second one (twenty something weeks I think) when I knew from midwife was standard to discuss what gestation your CS would be booked for, the consultant was again very vague and when I said that I needed to know a rough date so that my birth partner could book time off work they went off to “apparently” check the diary and what a surprise, there were no dates whatsoever available anywhere in the weeks before my due date, in fact no slots until I was almost a week overdue 🙄. I was alone at the time, I wish in hindsight I’d brought my husband or mum along to help advocate for me as it’s very plain that they fobbed me off and thought that it was very likely I’d go into labour before the planned CS date then conveniently end up having a VBAC.

In the end, surprise surprise, I went into labour a few days before my due date and when I called the hospital and explained to the ward that I’d been promised I could have a CS they said I could come in and be checked over at least as was getting regular contractions. It was horrible really, the contractions were quite painful and consistent but I felt the midwives kept fobbing me off by saying there was a shift change soon so it was best to wait for that and meet the new staff... this carried on for a few hours.

The feeling of my birth wishes being not respected and sense of being pushed into a VBAC, combined with the increasingly intense labour pains and a fear I can’t explain about how this baby wasn’t safe to be born naturally freaked me out, I couldn’t get comfortable in the big bath in the labour ward and I ended up running out of that room stark naked shouting hysterically for the CS I had asked for all along.

Finally, shortly after that I was taken to theatre and DC2 was born. Bearing in mind he was only 39 weeks he was a whopper at 10lb6, built like a sumo wrestler and with HUGE shoulders that the baby doctor later confided would very likely likely have got stuck during a vaginal birth so it was lucky that he was born by CS as he could have dislocated his shoulders.

Sorry OP, you didn’t ask for awful birth stories did you. The point of my recounting this experience is to show how they sometimes fob women off, paying lip service to requests for CS but by refusing to book us in until after our due date knowing that it’s likely we will spontaneously go into labour and have natural birth if they can fob us off and stall for time about waiting for shift changes etc.

All this came pouring out and 8 years later I still feel very angry and upset about it.

In hindsight, things I could have done and that you can do to increase your chances:

-Print off the guidelines that state women’s rights to choose type of birth. Bring them and show the consult and so they know you are aware of your rights.

-COVID permitting, bring your partner/ friend or relative with you that you know will advocate for you to consultant appointments, will ask pesky questions and don’t get fobbed off with a CS date that’s any later than 38 weeks.

• Write a short statement of your own to be attached to your maternity notes, stating your clear wish for a CS and even ask the consultant to sign to state that have read it.

-Ask your midwife not write a statement of support if the consultant seems obstructive at the first appointment. Say that you are aware it will form a part of your medical records along with your own statement.

-if all else fails, look into private hospitals eg the Portland.

From speaking to a couple of midwives at the local hospital since it does seem that hospitals have targets for CS and if they want to reduce the number of them, then it’s easy to get fobbed off.

Really hope it goes smoothly for you OP. It seems to vary so much hospital by hospital. A friend had a very similar experience to me with her first baby and wanted a CS for second for the same reasons and had no trouble at all getting booked I for a CS at 38 weeks, her consultant was lovely about it. Or perhaps her hospital didn’t have such stringent CS related targets, who knows.

[quote Catlover8926]@megaann have you shared this with your team? These are the NICE guidelines and they need to adhere to them. The last part specifically says if you are still requesting it after discussion you should be offered it so call your consultant and tell them you won’t be accepting a vaginal delivery as it’s not what you want and want to book in for a section by maternal request as the guidelines state.[/quote]
I did. The consultants just said, "if we find someone else willing then we will call you" I've been ringing/emailing my diabetic midwife everyday as every time I call I get told "someone will ring me back" even my psychiatrist has mentioned she's been emailing the consultants.

I had a scan at 36 weeks last week. Baby is around 8.5lbs and I have extra fluid (hydramniosis) so I'm literally living in anxiety and fear of what's going to happen next week.

I'm in for a "sweep" tomorrow. Like they don't understand I'm terrified about this too but I'm hoping tomorrow I'm going to basically say to them this is not acceptable etc.

@megaann, that is awful. Have you considered complaining to PALS? Do you have a midwife onside? You don’t have to consent to an induction, you know.

OP, I completely understand where you’re coming from and would definitely suggest you get onto your midwife to see where the referral is at. You could ask to be referred for mental health support as well - they may be able to help you manage your fear and anxiety levels while you wait to have everything signed off. You should be able to get it agreed in principle quite quickly even if you don’t get given a date until 36 weeks.

I’d also recommend the Facebook group Planned C-sections U.K. Support Group (or at least, it has a similar name to that). There are lots of very supportive women on there who’ve been in your position.

@Summergarden thanks for all of this! That’s awful that you were continually passed further down the line but good on you for not accepting it! It’s so true they seem to work to these targets and act like a c-section is so high risk. I fully accept there are risks with it but there are also massive risks with a vaginal birth that no one gets you to sign a form to agree to. You’re just expected to waltz in there like it will be fine when over 1/3 of first time mums need forceps to deliver naturally. They are my idea of hell on earth!

I will do all of these things you have suggested. I already have a bullet pointed sheet printed out with my reasons etc. I will now be adding to it that the longer the decision making process goes on, the more my anxiety increases and I’m having problems sleeping because my mind it on over drive. The midwife I had last time said she thinks the consultant will phone me because of covid so I’d probably be on my own but at least if I had sheets of paper to read from I would be able to get my point across. I think I will text my midwife tomorrow. Given she doesn’t seem to have taken any steps whatsoever (other than writing it in my notes) so far and I’ve been going on about it since 6 weeks, I think I just need to start being really difficult with them. I would be inconsolable if I ended up like you and went into labour early then no one took me seriously. I feel like that’s my main worry, that it happens before I’ve even got a chance to tell a consultant anything. My mum also suggested calling the GP and saying how anxious I am just so that was added to it too

@MyCatHatesOtherCats oh I didn’t realise there was a facebook group, will need to get on this. I think I’m going to text her tomorrow and just continually pester them until I get to speak to a consultant because I really don’t want to leave it til the next time I see her at 28 weeks

Do! It’s not good enough that you’re being fobbed off.

@sarah13xx I think I agree with your mum and it would be good to also speak with GP as they could also do the referral to the consultant. Particularly if you get the feeling the midwife is delaying and fobbing you off.

Someone up thread mentioned why people who want a planned section don't just go private. I did hope to do this myself and we have the savings in place. However it's not that simple in covid times as many of the private maternity hospitals simply stopped offering their services (perhaps they were part of the private agreement with NHS to do overspill work?!) and I got no where. Also, most are in London. There are none at all in my area. Besides this, the NICE guidelines state we are entitled to a section if we've been made aware of risks and still opt for this mode of birth.